Bolton Match thread

[Rashid]

Just seen that, it was on the following page.

 

I think Brownie's choice of the word 'stumbled' wasn't the best, but I agree with him that we look a lot better playing this way and should have done it more frequently. On and off he's done it, but never consistently. Injuries have contributed to that, but it isn't just that and Rafa could have used the formation more if he'd wanted.

 

In fact, if this is his signature formation, then from the moment he came here he should have been trying to bring in players to play that system if his plan was for us to play that way. He hasn't done that in my opinion, which makes me doubt that his intention is for us to play this way all the time.

 

I'd like to see us stick with it, as if we can get Alonso, Masch and Gerrard on the field at the same time we'll 'control' every game we play. Look at how they bossed Milan's midfield.

 

Where it falls down sometimes is either through him using the wrong players in the wrong positions (Crouch on the left wing was one particularly strange one) or because we just aren't good enough in wide areas.

 

If Babel fulfills his potential, then that's one of the two wide slots sorted, but we need another top quality addition. We also need a 'number 10' who can share the job with Gerrard or allow him to play a more orthodox midfield role against shite.

 

For now though, I'd keep playing this way, but I'd consider bringing in Pennant for Kuyt (I say consider because Dirk's doing ok at the mo).

 

 

Looking back over history some of the greatest teams had players who could adapt to any position, they could play in any system and during a game could pop up all over the place. The Ajax "total football" and the great Brasil sides are examples of just that.

 

I think we can safely that we have been the antithesis of that kind of football for about 9 years now (not a dig but a fact) and we also don't have the players to do that.

 

Not least two players who played today whom I think are honest and hard working but neither suited to the role they were asked to do today. Jamie Carragher and Dirk Kuyt are not fast, skillfull or possess much crossing ability and neither can beat a man either - so why are they playing on the flank?

 

In any team where a manager is obsessed with rotation the minimum we should expect is for players to know where they stand. So in essence Pennant knows who he is competing against and players are fighting for THEIR place in the team. e.g. in the current system Crouch and Voronin can have no complaints as Torres is the lone striker.

 

It's where you have Arbeloa and Finnan fit and both dropped to accomodate Carragher rather than drop him is what gets my back up. Either have players in their positons or not at all -the team needs all it's areas to function properly to play at it's best. It's like getting an electrician in to fit your cooker.

 

In the current system Pennant should have played ahead of Kuyt and Finnan ahead of Carragher or are people going to argue that Kuyt and Carragher are the best we have in the positions they played today?

 

In the long run we need consistency and we all know that neither player is going to be there long term so why not start trying to get some rythmn in the team?

 

Am I totally missing the point again? (I know we on today but that isn't the point).

[Rashid]

The reason Kuyt is playing on the right instead of Pennant is because Kuyt works his bollocks off tracking back and harrassing the full back and he also gets in the box when we are attacking which is something Pennant never does.

 

And that's what you want from your winger who operates in a key area of the pitch?

 

Do you think Man United send out their wingers with this remit? Your post there is how I would want my fullback to be.

[coop]

And that's what you want from your winger who operates in a key area of the pitch?

 

Do you think Man United send out their wingers with this remit? Your post there is how I would want my fullback to be.

 

I was answering Daves question at why Kuyt was picked before Pennant.

 

Kuyt offers a goal threat, Pennant does not.

[Gods back]

He needs to sort the right back slot as well,It was not one of Jamie's best games.

 

Alan Hutton would have been a great buy in this system. As some have said is Rafa trying to accomodate some players. If so I expect Carra to stay at right back when Agger returns.

 

I was thinking the exact same thing a while ago.

 

Hutton would have been perfect in the right back role in this formation.The Scottish Alves,though he can actually defend.

[SpeedyG]

Looking back over history some of the greatest teams had players who could adapt to any position, they could play in any system and during a game could pop up all over the place. The Ajax "total football" and the great Brasil sides are examples of just that.

 

I think we can safely that we have been the antithesis of that kind of football for about 9 years now (not a dig but a fact) and we also don't have the players to do that.

 

Not least two players who played today whom I think are honest and hard working but neither suited to the role they were asked to do today. Jamie Carragher and Dirk Kuyt are not fast, skillfull or possess much crossing ability and neither can beat a man either - so why are they playing on the flank?

In any team where a manager is obsessed with rotation the minimum we should expect is for players to know where they stand. So in essence Pennant knows who he is competing against and players are fighting for THEIR place in the team. e.g. in the current system Crouch and Voronin can have no complaints as Torres is the lone striker.

 

It's where you have Arbeloa and Finnan fit and both dropped to accomodate Carragher rather than drop him is what gets my back up. Either have players in their positons or not at all -the team needs all it's areas to function properly to play at it's best. It's like getting an electrician in to fit your cooker.

 

In the current system Pennant should have played ahead of Kuyt and Finnan ahead of Carragher or are people going to argue that Kuyt and Carragher are the best we have in the positions they played today?

 

In the long run we need consistency and we all know that neither player is going to be there long term so why not start trying to get some rythmn in the team?

 

Am I totally missing the point again? (I know we on today but that isn't the point).

 

Is that the Carra that crossed for Kuyt to hit the post which rebounded to Babel for the goal??????????????????

 

Guess Rafa got it more right than you. FFS both of them have played in those positions for many many years. Doesn't suit your agenda though does it.

[Mr T]

I've been saying for ages that our strength lies in central midfield and wing forwards so we might as well play to that rather than putting average players into a 4-2-2 just because that's, like, what we have to play. It also makes best use of Gerrard in a position where he can attack without having to worry too much about his defending.

 

Rafa has stumbled on this formation a few times this season. Against Reading he got slated for it. I think he got it wrong that day, but not because of the system, but because of the personnel (Crouch and Torres as part of the three). He also played it against Newcastle which was our best performance of the season.

 

The key is to match the players to the formation. That's why Pennant should never be a part of it; he'll never score enough goals to warrant a place in an attacking front three.

[stringvest]

Great result today, and a good second half performance, after riding our luck in the first half - very shaky defending, and Carragher playing right back is really a bit of a joke, for attacking and defensive reasons (yes I know he passed to Kuyt who missed a great chance then the ball eventually made it to Babel who scored). Rafa, if you think Carragher's been stinking the place out at CB, then drop him, don't move him somewhere he's never been that comfortable.

 

Aurelio had a very good game today - looked comfortable on the ball, and was very willing to overlap. I can't understand the stick Gerrard's getting on here - I thought he had a very effective game; in fact I thought the midfield all played well today, apart from the profligate Kuyt, who offered very little, and missed a few good chances. On the other side, Babel looked full of pace and menace, forcing the goalie to make two excellent blocks, and drilled the ball home inside the near post with some power for his goal.

 

Good to see Alonso gradually coming back to fitness too. All in all, a very good day, spoiled only by the shite across the park getting another 3 points.

[isr]

Don't know if someone already picked up on this (haven't read the whole thread), but you can see why Rafa tends to sub Babel after 70 mins. He really seemed to run out of gas at the end - with more juice in the tank, he could have picked up one or two more at the end, with our counterattacks. He just ended up stationary in the box, while Kuyt (who looks like he carries his own inflight refuelling tanker with him) kept bombing in.

 

That said, Ryan was MoM for me :)

 

PS: on reflection, maybe that double summersault (with double tuck and pike) blew his wad for the rest of the game ;)

[Sangria]

Don't know if someone already picked up on this (haven't read the whole thread), but you can see why Rafa tends to sub Babel after 70 mins. He really seemed to run out of gas at the end - with more juice in the tank, he could have picked up one or two more at the end, with our counterattacks. He just ended up stationary in the box, while Kuyt (who looks like he carries his own inflight refuelling tanker with him) kept bombing in.

 

That said, Ryan was MoM for me :)

 

PS: on reflection, maybe that double summersault (with double tuck and pike) blew his wad for the rest of the game ;)

 

That alone made the thread worth reading.