Napoli (A) - CL, Wed 7th Sep 2022 (8:00pm)

[HBenn]

3 minutes ago, coachpotato said:

This performance hasn’t been a surprise though. The Bournemouth game might have had some fooled, but the United game should have banished any thoughts that we had returned to form.

Surely if Klopp had a good idea on the solutions he’d have had tonight better sorted than it turned out? I can never understand that if a player is on the bench, he can’t be starting if necessary. To be on the bench you have to be fit enough to play some part in the game, whether that’s the last 20 minutes or the first 20 minutes. So play your strongest line up from the start, Napoli played Osimhen from the start, even though he was a risk, and he ran us ragged and enabled them to go a couple of goals up before he went off. 

No it's not, to be honest it's been coming for a long time unfortunately.

I think he has got a good idea but whether they are available or even in his squad is another thing.

Possibly his solution until Jan is Arthur and Thiago and he knows that playing them tonight may mean they cannot play for 5-6 weeks after and he needs to balance their return with getting shat on tonight. 

The thing is that in both this game and the Utd game there were large periods like it was a baseball game and that just smacks of a lack of midfield control.

I really hope that behind the scenes Klopp is screaming blue murder at FSG though. People talk about Klopp as a brilliant manager but then believe he was pretty happy with his midfield options. He must be senile if he really is! If it is true that they wanted to hold tight until Hendo got injured they truly are shafting him and I hope at least now he has the leverage to get them to step up to the plate for a change!

[HBenn]

5 minutes ago, George Costanza said:

While this is true, there are some fundamental laws with how we are playing.  Some players simply are massivley underperforming and quite frankly they don't look remotely bothered.  Injuries in midfield & CB haven't helped but how about a bit of pragmatism from Klopp and a change of tactics when we don't have the players available to play his preferred system.  Tonight we should have played deeper, have milner & fabinho are midfield protectors and try to hit them on the break. Maybe if we were at full strength & in reasonable form we could have looked to dominate a decent opponent on their own turf but we're nowhere that at the moment sadly.

I agree that Jürgen needs to adapt and do something a bit different and from his comments it sounds like he will.

 

That said I just don't believe these players have suddenly become like the lads at Utd and aren't trying. They have been magnificent for years. It feels more likely that they have been required to "go again" (because they stop building the squad) so many times before that now they have got nothing left currently. Tired in body and mind.

[coachpotato]

In the great scheme of things, I suppose losing a group game when you have 5 more to get it right isn’t so bad, and it’s not the first time we’ve been outplayed by Napoli.

It’s baffling how ordinary we’ve been, so I hope Klopp does have some answers to our problems and all we can do is support him, and them, whenever they’re on the pitch

[sir roger]

It's not a good optic when your opponents spend 40 minutes saving themselves for Spezia at the weekend.

[House of Dirk]

Napoli were well up for this and we were toilet in the first half.

 

A wake up bomb for us and a lesson in scouting. There's cracking players out there for fractions of the big money fees we see players go for. It will be an underwhelming approach for some, and its not the answer all the time. 

[Kevin D]

8 minutes ago, sir roger said:

It's not a good optic when your opponents spend 40 minutes saving themselves for Spezia at the weekend.

That was not particularly edifying. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a team do that against us before.

[Red Shift]

2 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

Like someone said a bit ago, why didn't we start with more of these players?

 

If Thiago, Matip, Nunez had started we might not have been in this fucking mess. We should've had more respect for Napoli but we didn't and we've paid for it.

I get the feeling that the bench isn’t fully fit. My issue is not that Matip & Thiago can’t play for 90, my issue is why don’t we field our best proven team (which includes Thiago & Matip) regardless of whether they can play a full 90? Get control, hopefully get early goals, or at least compete evenly, then makes the subs for the unfit players and see the game out. Some of you may say ‘six of one, half a dozen of the other’ but surely our biggest issue in not starting with our trademark intensity and skillset.

 

The second half finished 1-1 with Thiago & Matip on the field. Nunez wasn’t particularly prominent, but then Mo had little to no impact first half. Having said that, with Thiago calling the shots first half, Mo’s game may have improved with better service.

 

The right hand side of the field is not a patch on the left, currently. Diaz is making Mo look decidedly below average in effort & creativity & finishing. 
 

There are attitude problems with key players, like VVD & Trent.

Maybe they’re fucked off with Mo’s massive contract and now feel under valued? Just thinking out loud, but it could be part of the disharmony going on. We’re unbalanced on the pitch, and now the Coaching staff are making bad decisions under pressure. 
 

We have to turn this around sooner rather than later. 

[Reckoner]

8 minutes ago, Red Shift said:

I get the feeling that the bench isn’t fully fit.

Now the furnitures getting injured?

[Red Shift]

3 hours ago, Reckoner said:

I wonder if it’s just a jaded feeling after last season, you play an almost perfect season, keep going past you’re already burnt out weeks ago only to lose the league by a point to an oil state and the CL to one goal despite dominating the game. You might just think, what’s the point?

Yeah I’ve wondered this myself. So many players played a huge season. The league was always an outside chance, but I reckon the team & club were very very confident of bringing home the European Cup. We all were. To lose it under such trying circumstances as well - shit-housery from UEFA. A near footballing tragedy ffs.

 

It must be hard picking up the intensity again, and the breaks are so short these days with bullshit pre-season tournaments for marketing.

[lebron]

Here’s hoping we will never see James Milner in a Liverpool shirt again. As bad as Trent, Gomez an Virgil were (they were all really,really bad) we were basically playing with 10 men until he went off.

 

Thanks for your great service to the Club, but it’s really time to hang up those boots (or change clubs).

 

Salah was the worst player on the pitch btw. Luckily for him and us, that’s as bad as he’s ever going to play.

 

I’m still confident in our quest for the CL. Napoli are no mugs. Think we’ll go through along with them, with Ajax missing out.

 

Final note; the seeding system needs an overhaul. No way should the Europa league winner be in pot 1.

[Red Phoenix]

40 minutes ago, Red Shift said:

I get the feeling that the bench isn’t fully fit. My issue is not that Matip & Thiago can’t play for 90, my issue is why don’t we field our best proven team (which includes Thiago & Matip) regardless of whether they can play a full 90? Get control, hopefully get early goals, or at least compete evenly, then makes the subs for the unfit players and see the game out. Some of you may say ‘six of one, half a dozen of the other’ but surely our biggest issue in not starting with our trademark intensity and skillset.

 

Yeah if we'd started with players like Matip, Thiago and Nunez that first half could've gone a lot better. Or even if not maybe we'd have at least conceded less goals and had a genuine chance in the 2nd half. I was also wondering how it could've turned out if most or all of our players had the determination that Diaz had at the start of the 2nd half too and kept that going for as long as possible.

 

I guess Wolves might pay for this at the weekend if we get sorted out, but Ajax next week will be more of a test clearly to see if we've started getting past this or not.

 

And if we play a stronger side like we did in the 2nd last night and have a bad game against Wolves, well maybe we're geniunely in trouble. Hopefully that doesn't happen though.

[Strontium]

I have to hand it to @3 Stacks who has been championing Anguissa for a few years now. Put him in our side and Milner in Napoli's and it's a different result.

[s(k)aturation]

 

Not starting players who've been out injured, because you're worried they'll get injured, means they're not fit doesn't it?

 

 

 

 

[FrenchEyeGlass]

7 hours ago, Reckoner said:

I wonder if it’s just a jaded feeling after last season, you play an almost perfect season, keep going past you’re already burnt out weeks ago only to lose the league by a point to an oil state and the CL to one goal despite dominating the game. You might just think, what’s the point?

I think this is spot on, but it goes one step further than the above

 

"...you play an almost perfect season, keep going past you’re already burnt out weeks ago only to lose the league by a point to an oil state and the CL to one goal despite dominating the game...and then watch every single other club strengthen greatly during the summer while your club stands still if not regresses" 

 

If I was disheartened after this transfer window, I can't imagine how Mo, VVD, Trent, et al felt. 

[Bobby Hundreds]

Go back to the practical play we had when we won the league, the first half of that season we were way more conservative and ended up looking like we'd never concede, its not going to be at the same level but at least we wont be handing out an invitiation to the opposition to fuck us. It's embarrassing how easily we are torn apart its embarrassing because there's been enough games to show this is not working and it isn't going to suddenly start working. Almost every team we face know they are going to get a load of chances. Theres outside circumstances but a lot of this is on Klopp we've done nothing to sort out this mess we are just turning up exactly the same and expecting different results. We have to tighten up and for christ sake stop this shit with the full backs their priority should be defending.

 

Every fucking fan said if we don't sort out the midfield we will end up repeating the season the defence cost us. Lo and behold the fans were spot on not because we have amazing foresight but because it was so blatantly fucking obvious it's criminal the club was blasé over it.

 

[FrenchEyeGlass]

7 hours ago, Colonel Bumcunt said:

I think we need to try 4231.

 

Full backs as full backs, no fucking around, so that Matip and Virgil aren't chasing balls pumped down the flanks.  

Two midfielders battling.

Three attackers playing behind Nunez.

 

And then in January we need to buy another similar striker. If we're going to play with a Nunez then we have to commit to it, buy someone like Ivan Toney.  

 

I'd happily raise money by selling Trent and Salah.  Their regression is shocking, to the point it looks attitude-based, and that cannot be good to have around the team. 

 

We are literally bargain hunting for midfielders and currently need at least 3 new ones, the only way we're getting a Tony this January is if we buy a box of Frosties. They're greeeeeeat!

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Reckoner said:

Now the furnitures getting injured?

I think he means it's not been sized properly.

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, FrenchEyeGlass said:

 

We are literally bargain hunting for midfielders and currently need at least 3 new ones, the only way we're getting a Tony this January is if we buy a box of Frosties. They're greeeeeeat!

Cracking bad jokes when the team loses? Wool.

[Jose Jones]

2 hours ago, FrenchEyeGlass said:

I think this is spot on, but it goes one step further than the above

 

"...you play an almost perfect season, keep going past you’re already burnt out weeks ago only to lose the league by a point to an oil state and the CL to one goal despite dominating the game...and then watch every single other club strengthen greatly during the summer while your club stands still if not regresses" 

 

If I was disheartened after this transfer window, I can't imagine how Mo, VVD, Trent, et al felt. 

You think Mo signed his new contract worth a third of a million quid a week and then is so disheartened he can't be arsed to try?

 

[Mook]

2 hours ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

Go back to the practical play we had when we won the league, the first half of that season we were way more conservative and ended up looking like we'd never concede, its not going to be at the same level but at least we wont be handing out an invitiation to the opposition to fuck us. It's embarrassing how easily we are torn apart its embarrassing because there's been enough games to show this is not working and it isn't going to suddenly start working. Almost every team we face know they are going to get a load of chances. Theres outside circumstances but a lot of this is on Klopp we've done nothing to sort out this mess we are just turning up exactly the same and expecting different results. We have to tighten up and for christ sake stop this shit with the full backs their priority should be defending.

 

Every fucking fan said if we don't sort out the midfield we will end up repeating the season the defence cost us. Lo and behold the fans were spot on not because we have amazing foresight but because it was so blatantly fucking obvious it's criminal the club was blasé over it.

 

I've been getting fed up reading your posts about the high line but last night was the night I realised you are correct.

 

Our whole game is based around Van Dijk being unbeatable and he's nowhere near that at the moment so it's fucked, defensively at least. Time to move back 15/20 yards and open up the park a bit. 

[Bobby Hundreds]

21 minutes ago, Mook said:

I've been getting fed up reading your posts about the high line but last night was the night I realised you are correct.

 

Our whole game is based around Van Dijk being unbeatable and he's nowhere near that at the moment so it's fucked, defensively at least. Time to move back 15/20 yards and open up the park a bit. 

I'm fed up of writing them I'm just parroting on and on but it's driving me up the wall seeing the same faults over and over. It may not be the answer but currently what we are doing with who we have isn't the answer either. Getting and keeping thaigo fit could help but he played versus Fulham and that game set the tone for what we've  seen since.

[Mook]

18 minutes ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

I'm fed up of writing them I'm just parroting on and on but it's driving me up the wall seeing the same faults over and over. It may not be the answer but currently what we are doing with who we have isn't the answer either. Getting and keeping thaigo fit could help but he played versus Fulham and that game set the tone for what we've  seen since.

Unfortunately Klopp said last night that the high line isn't the problem, apparently we are not compact enough.

 

We'll see how he reacts tactically in the next few weeks I suppose...

[Dave D]

10 hours ago, HBenn said:

No it's not, to be honest it's been coming for a long time unfortunately.

I think he has got a good idea but whether they are available or even in his squad is another thing.

Possibly his solution until Jan is Arthur and Thiago and he knows that playing them tonight may mean they cannot play for 5-6 weeks after and he needs to balance their return with getting shat on tonight. 

The thing is that in both this game and the Utd game there were large periods like it was a baseball game and that just smacks of a lack of midfield control.

I really hope that behind the scenes Klopp is screaming blue murder at FSG though. People talk about Klopp as a brilliant manager but then believe he was pretty happy with his midfield options. He must be senile if he really is! If it is true that they wanted to hold tight until Hendo got injured they truly are shafting him and I hope at least now he has the leverage to get them to step up to the plate for a change!

Wishful thinking if you think Thiago is staying fit that long  

[El Rojo]

1 hour ago, Mook said:

Time to move back 15/20 yards and open up the park a bit. 

Yeah, fair point. It would potentially provide Salah, Diaz and Nunez with a bit of space to run into too. 

[El Rojo]

Anyway - reasons to be cheerful:

 

1. On last night's displays, particularly in defence, it's looking like we'll even have fewer players at the World Cup than anticipated.