Glasgow Rangers go in to liquidation

[Guest ShoePiss]

"In the meantime, those SPL clubs who were frustrated in their desire for changes to such substantive matters as the distribution of TV revenue because of the need to gain an 11-1 majority – impossible while Celtic and Rangers voted as a unit – have a unique chance to exert control.

 

When this intention was alluded to near the end of Thursday’s meeting it prompted an sharp outburst by Robert Howat, Celtic’s company secretary, who took the place of Peter Lawwell because the Parkhead chief executive is still on holiday. "

 

Now that's fucking funny.

[Guest San Don]

1. Any “fit and proper persons test” cannot anticipate what a buyer might do ( as we know only too well from G&H). What Whyte did with the ST money is, and was ,legal.

 

Incredibly naive. The fit and proper purpose test should be robust enough to prevent someone using the club's own money to buy itself. Have you learnt nothing?

 

Yes, it is legal to do as the shyster did (at the moment) but morally it is not (to most sensible people anyway).

 

2. The issue is NOT the legality of EBT’s. It is the illegal use of them by making them contractual.

Where does it state in the SFA's rule book that EBT's cannot be used by clubs?

 

In any event, it is the EBT question that HMRC used to bring the club to its knees.

 

 

3. How can a payment of (best) 8p in the pound be acceptable when Falkirk, in similar circumstances paid their debts in full? HMRC determined that a liquidation provided the best opportunity to protect taxpayers, by allowing the potential investigation and pursuit of possible claims against those responsible for the company's financial affairs in recent years. A CVA would restrict the scope of such action. Put simply Rangers gamble failed through greed ( surprise surprise). HMRC took the view that personal claims may exceed what they would get through accepting the derisory CVA proposal. And make no mistake, all British football directors have now had their cards marked.

 

 

Who is to blame - the Courts will decide that in due course.

 

Unfortunately for Falkirk, this isnt about them and their debt was a lot less being a smaller club. The question is why did HMRC refuse any money however small which meant creditors got nothing?

 

Are you seriously telling me that low pence in the pound CVA's dont exist? Behave yourself. For someone who claims to know financial affairs, you dont half spout some shite.

[Guest San Don]

Was it Whyte or SFA who were being dodgy cunts over tax? Or was it Rangers for years and years?

 

I dont know mate but I do know one of them diverted VAT receipts and NI deductions to run the club from when he 'took control' instead of paying them to HMRC.

 

You'd think a fit and proper test would be able to spot a venture capitalist like whyte, wouldnt you?

[xerxes]

Incredibly naive.........etc.

 

 

 

That any fit and proper person’s test cannot ban on the basis of what someone might do, is not naive, it is a statement of fact, and a fundamental limitation of that rule/test.

 

How might the test have been strengthened in such a way that would have prevented Whyte from buying the club?

 

It is not the job of any League/FA to stop any club owner from making mistakes, or taking risks. That is sport, that is business. The sport lays down the penalties, as football does, for clubs that go into Administration.

 

What is unusual about Rangers is that their demise was not simply down to bad judgement, but criminality. The justice in HMRC’s rejection of a CVA is that, for once, individuals may pay.

 

What is also curious about the Rangers situation is that there are a series of mechanisms via legal duties of fellow Directors, non-execs a, Honorary Officials, and club professionals which should have meant that the ST deal, alleged illegal contractual EBT’s, and siphoning off of statutory deductions, should have been flagged up early on. Did Whyte really do all this in secret? Or was there widespread collusion and a culture, some of it pre-dating Whyte, of criminality and deceit?

 

For some reason you do not grasp that although EBT’s are legal. No dispute. Contractual EBT’s ARE illegal – fact. HMRC are obliged to pursue and prosecute those who break the law

 

There are three reasons why HMRC refused an offer of 8p in the £.

 

1. It was pathetic.

 

2. It sends a message out to the whole British football world that if Directors break the law, HMRC will come after them personally. This represents a sea change in how football financial mismanagement is dealt with.

 

3. HMRC calculates that it will recover more money by personal claims than by an 8p in the £ settlement. Rangers miscalculated.

 

 

Low value CVA’s have been accepted in the past, and will be accepted again. However it is pretty foolish to offer less in your CVA proposal than HMRC might recover in personal claim. Add the dimension of criminality, not foolishness or negligence as is the case in most such instances, and you have where we are now, a miscalculation which may cost some Directors to a degree that has never been seen before.

 

And quite right too.

[Nunavut Patrick]

That Belgian system is fucking weird but doesn't surprise as Belgium is full of EU bureacrats who pore over weird formulas and shite.

 

Now, your average ten-lagered up nips and oatmeal savage isn't going to have a bloody clue.

 

And what kind of majority is 11-1??? Hahaha...looks like Celtic didn't think that one through.

 

So are Motherwell in the Champion League?

[Laburnum]

A statement from Clyde FC. A small club, but what a fantastic statement. Wheres that nail on the head gif :D

 

Club Statement: Reconstruction Proposal

Sat, 30th Jun 2012 12:48pm

The Club has received a set of papers in advance of the SFL meeting on Tuesday. The essential intent behind those papers is to induce the SFL clubs to agree a proposal to allow a Newco to enter the SFL in the 1st Division in exchange for a range of structural changes to the current set up and some small financial inducements. Some of the proposed changes have merit in principle.

 

The Board believe that any proposals for change should not be rushed, as these have been. They also have to be done by consensus and not through threat or inducement, again, as these have been.

 

The papers include a proposal to allow a Newco to enter the 1st Division. This is contrary to the rules of the SFL and nothing within the papers justifies this proposal.

 

As a club owned by its supporters and recovering from having been on the brink of extinction, the Board of Clyde Football Club recognise the damage done to the credibility of Rangers Football Club by its successive owners, and the subsequent impact on staff and supporters. These proposals do nothing to restore that credibility.

 

It is not for us to become involved in punishment, that is a matter for the SPL and SFA. The SFL clubs are being asked to change their rules so that the SPL and SFA can apply sanctions that fit short term financial interests.

 

It is not for us to tell any club what they should want for themselves, but to enter anywhere other than the 3rd Division risks Rangers Football Club being burdened with the legacy of commencing its rebuilding in a manner that they later look back on with regret. Rangers Football Club does not need to be handed a competitive advantage, they are more than capable of returning to the SPL via the 3rd Division on their own merit. Rebuilding from the bottom can restore the dignity stripped from the club by its former owners.

 

The papers use emotive language to threaten a future of financial meltdown and they carry the implication of the destruction of the game should a Newco not be entered in the 1st Division. If things are as bad as indicated then Scottish Football is in a far worse state than is being acknowledged. In which case it is time to accept the bankrupt model needs fixed and not supported and perpetuated on the back of this proposal. The fact that other clubs might face similar financial distress because Rangers Football Club enter the 3rd Division is hardly a reason to compromise the integrity of the SFL and further compromise Rangers Football Club.

 

Rather than attempting to prepare a soft landing before delivering sanctions, it would be better to contemplate more radical change that might actually underpin financial stability in the long term for clubs that balance their books. Perhaps an amnesty from sanctions for clubs that are forced to face insolvency procedures in the next 2 years as a result of the current turmoil, and an automatic entry to the 3rd Division for any club liquidated and reformed in similar circumstances. This would allow 2 years to properly restructure the Scottish Game for the benefit of all and undo the damage that has been created by the current structure which encourages club directors to trade integrity for cash, and then spend beyond their means, willingly risking the very existence of football clubs. If we could believe that the game could be less self interested long enough to resolve this, then this, and other far better ideas, might be worth contemplating.

 

SPL clubs that have openly stated their opposition to a Newco being given immediate access to the SPL have taken the position based on their, and at times, their supporters' view of what is the right thing to do, however, the vote has still to be taken and proposals such as these are premature. If the SPL clubs vote as indicated on the basis of the increasingly discredited notion of sporting integrity, it would be questionable if the SFL clubs did otherwise.

 

The reality is that we are faced with unique circumstances and it would be foolish to pretend otherwise, that probably means that compromise for some is inevitable, and perhaps even worthwhile for everyone in the long term. The solution however is not this hastily cobbled together proposal.

 

The Board of this club sees no merit whatsoever in adopting this proposal.

[xerxes]

A statement from Clyde FC. A small club, but what a fantastic statement.

 

I agree.

 

Fair, balanced, common sense.

[xerxes]

I see the madness continues.Instead of looking after the game the SFA are desperately trying to look after a band of cheats and fraudsters ( I refer to the ownership, not the playing staff and supporters).

 

Kyle Lafferty signs for Sion after leaving Rangers

Northern Ireland striker Kyle Lafferty has joined Sion on a three-year deal after saying he wished to leave Rangers, the Swiss club have confirmed.

 

"He will be presented at a press conference on Monday, then will join his new team-mates for training," the Swiss club said in a statement.

 

Moments earlier, Norwich City announced they had signed Rangers' Scotland defender, Steven Whittaker.

 

Rangers's new owners have vowed to challenge such moves in the courts.

 

Lafferty played more than 100 times for Rangers since joining from Burnley for £3m, with forward Alan Gow heading in the other direction, in 2008.

 

But the 24-year-old might not find his switch is quite as smooth this time around.

 

BBC Scotland understands the Scottish Football Association could reject an application for international clearance from their English and Swiss counterparts on behalf of he and Whittaker's new clubs.

 

Scotland's national body claims it would require both the "old" Rangers, which will soon be put into liquidation, and the newco Rangers to give their permission for such clearance to be given.

 

The players, on advice from their union, PFA Scotland, rejected the opportunity to have their contracts transferred to the "newco" Rangers being created by the consortium led by Charles Green that has bought the Glasgow club's assets.

 

World governing body Fifa is likely to step into the dispute and grant international clearance for the pair.

 

However, Green's Sevco consortium rejects the claims of Lafferty, Whittaker and seven other players that they are now free agents.

 

Green has threatened legal action against any player who signs for another club - and will seek compensation from any club trying to employ them.

 

His consortium claims that Rangers players agreed to remain at Ibrox on reduced wages while the club were in administration in return for being sold at reduced prices should they go into liquidation.

 

So there could well be a lengthy dispute between the "newco" Rangers, Norwich, Sion, Lafferty and Whittaker.

 

Stoke City are in a similar position, although they have yet to formally announce that they have signed Rangers midfielder Jamie Ness.

 

At Sion, Lafferty will join up with another former Rangers player, Rino Gattuso, the 34-year-old midfielder having signed for the Swiss after exiting AC Milan.

 

BBC Sport - Kyle Lafferty signs for Sion after leaving Rangers

[Laburnum]

Another SFL club statement. Hamilton.

 

 

As you may be aware the member clubs of the Scottish Football League are holding a meeting tomorrow to discuss the current proposals for change within the Scottish game.

 

Unfortunately there has been a great deal of ill-informed speculation and erroneous reporting on our position in relation to various, hypothetical scenarios. We believe it foolhardy to comment on “questions” that have not as yet been put to the club by the SFL Management Committee.

 

When Ronnie MacDonald bought the Accies in 2003 we were within a few days of administration or indeed Liquidation due to the clubs enormous debt level for a club of our size. We had a total breakdown between our board and the supporters in addition to the punishments from the authorities.

 

No club, until now, has been in such a critical position and we hope Rangers will be the last club to be in such a desperate position.

 

In many ways the current Rangers situation mirrored our own and we should be aware the effect liquidation has on the supporters who in many ways are the innocent victims of management.

 

We would urge all clubs to work together to reshape the leagues in a fair and equitable manner and to make decisions purely for the long term prosperity of our game and the enjoyment of the supporters of all clubs.

 

Harmony must be restored between all clubs for the good of our game and the continued existence of all Scotland’s Clubs.

 

Les Gray

Chairman

[xerxes]

Laburnham, what is the time frame for this ?

 

As I understand it the vote on Rangers newco being readmitted to the SPL takes place on 4th July and it appears they will not be readmitted – is there any chance that in the cold light of day they WILL be readmitted?

 

If they are expelled is there any formal provision for any club to be admitted to Divs1-3 without them having played in the Highlands League? Is there anything in the rules which says that any club can just appear in Div 1, missing 2+3?

 

Given that Rangers are expelled is there any provision for domino promotions right the way down to the Highlands League ? Is it practicable for an extra promotion from the Highlands?

 

If Rangers are expelled is the decision on re-admittance to Divs 1-3 taken simultaneously?

[Laburnum]

The vote on 4th of July is for the SPL clubs to put their balls on the chopping block. As its common knowledge enough clubs have promised a No vote. I can't see it reversing. Although Daily Record is running with a story of secret meetings between 3 clubs to keep us in SPL. I don't reckon so, even if it is, it's not enough to sway the vote. Any turnaround now after all the spouting from EVERY one who has made public their no decision would by cosmic! As for the other question about division. Which division? The SPL clubs thought SFL would roll over and have their tummy tickled. Nope. Truth is they quite rightly see this as their one and only chance for proper change. For years the SPL clubs voted against extending the league because more teams would mean they would have 2 home games against Rangers and Celtic. (where was the Sporting integrity there?) So these clubs know the predicament the SPL are in without Rangers and quite rightly they are wanting a bigger slice of the pie in return for thier compliance. Who knows what will happen. A weakened Rangers in the SPL against a full strength Celtic, would be hard to suffer.

 

The highland league is not really 'div 4' if that's what you are inferring? Although the last few teams to come in have come from there.

[xerxes]

The reference to the status of the Highlands League was whether, if the top four tiers are one short, because of the demise of Rangers oldco, there was any practicable mechanism for one of them to fill the slot at the bottom filled by domino promotions upwards.

 

I t seems to me that Div 3 is the only practical option for all concerned. Rangers will come back stronger from a demonstrably clean start and however much emerges from the inevitable court cases cant damage them. A one division demotion could never be seen as adequate penalty for liquidation, and the consequences of a fudge allowing them into Div 1 means that the disciplinary rule book becomes a nonsense if that is the ultimate penalty. It would also mean they were back in the SPl just as the court cases would be biting with the worst of all worlds, accusations that they had been treated unreasonably lightly just as the sins of the old regime will be all over the papers.

 

The allegations of how the club wanted to play fast and loose with the Jellavic debt and receipts due, and their threat of legal action against players understandably bailing out suggests the new ownership has learned little. At some point a line needs to be drawn

[Laburnum]

The reference to the status of the Highlands League was whether, if the top four tiers are one short, because of the demise of Rangers oldco, there was any practicable mechanism for one of them to fill the slot at the bottom filled by domino promotions upwards.

 

I t seems to me that Div 3 is the only practical option for all concerned. Rangers will come back stronger from a demonstrably clean start and however much emerges from the inevitable court cases cant damage them. A one division demotion could never be seen as adequate penalty for liquidation, and the consequences of a fudge allowing them into Div 1 means that the disciplinary rule book becomes a nonsense if that is the ultimate penalty. It would also mean they were back in the SPl just as the court cases would be biting with the worst of all worlds, accusations that they had been treated unreasonably lightly just as the sins of the old regime will be all over the papers.

 

The allegations of how the club wanted to play fast and loose with the Jellavic debt and receipts due, and their threat of legal action against players understandably bailing out suggests the new ownership has learned little. At some point a line needs to be drawn

I don't really know ye answer to the highland question mate.

 

As with all of your posts on this thread I agree with this post. Although the players bailing out does stick in my throat. Players like Lafferty, Naismith and Ness have spent an awful long time on the treatment table, earning a lot of money at the time, maybe not Ness earnings. I would have hoped they would have stuck around and if we are to go to Div 3 and they don't fancy it, they can use the agreement they negotiated when they took the pay cut. That way we could have had some cash injection to help our cause. Although how £5.5m was the price for the club whilst they were still part of it I will never know. Bizarre.

[Laburnum]

Some updates for those showing an interest,,

 

 

OVER 75 per cent of Rangers fans polled on the club's future would rather they played in SFL Division Three next season than accept a compromise deal for a place in the SPL.

 

In a survey conducted by the Rangers Fans' Fighting Fund from the email database of the club's season ticket holders, the Rangers fans were asked three questions:

 

(1) Do you want Rangers to play in SFL Division One next season - with sanctions?

 

(2) Do you want Rangers to play in SFL Division One next season if there are sanctions?

 

Or (3) Should Rangers drop into and play from SFL Division Three next season?

 

Only 3 per cent of fans who responded went for option (1): just over 20 per cent chose option (2) while almost 76 per cent said they would prefer Rangers to go to the bottom division of the Scottish Football League.

 

"Every other club and their fan base seems to have had an opinion of what should happen to Rangers," said a spokesperson for the RFFF. "That's why we wanted Rangers fans to voice their opinion - and they have done so. We said we would publish the findings - and that's what we are doing.

 

"It shows the depth of feeling among our fans who have shown that they don't want any favours from the rest of the clubs - or any preferential treatment.

 

"What these Rangers fans are saying is: "If that is what is to happen to us, then let it happen and let us move on. We will support Rangers - no matter where they are playing."

 

Also.......

 

MALCOLM MURRAY STATEMENT

*

TUESDAY 3 JULY 2012

*

Rangers Chairman Malcolm Murray has issued the following statement today.

*

“The last few months have been extremely difficult for everyone at Rangers – staff, players and, most importantly, the supporters of the Club who have been magnificent in the face of adversity.

*

“That said, all of us within the Rangers family are acutely aware that events at our Club, brought about by people who are no longer here, have triggered a crisis in Scottish football.

*

“Ally McCoist, the staff and players have nothing to apologise for but the Club needs to make an apology. It is only right that someone at Rangers expresses our sorrow and regret.

*

“On behalf of the new Board of Directors, I apologise unreservedly to all for the distress, disruption and difficulty inflicted on the football community, caused entirely by the actions of people who failed miserably to act responsibly during their stewardship of Rangers.

*

“All of Scottish football is now having to live with the consequences of that behaviour and every true Rangers fan will consider it a matter of deep regret that events at our Club in the past have been the root cause of an extremely difficult time for Scottish football.

*

“The people who are now running Rangers Football Club want the Club to move forward but we cannot do so until we have recognised how damaging to football the crisis at our Club has been.

*

"We want to rebuild Rangers but we also want to ensure the Club plays a role that is beneficial to Scottish football, the Scottish economy and Scottish life in general.”

[Rafa_The_Gaffa]

The only reason the huns want to go into SFL div 3 is not because its the right thing but because they're convinced scottish football will suffer without them. Every statement released by any one associated with them is a thinly veiled threat. Scotland's shame all right. they cheated the game for 25+ years and should be there because they deserved it and not cos the fans want to be there.

[xerxes]

The only reason the huns want to go into SFL div 3 is not because its the right thing but because they're convinced scottish football will suffer without them. Every statement released by any one associated with them is a thinly veiled threat. Scotland's shame all right. they cheated the game for 25+ years and should be there because they deserved it and not cos the fans want to be there.

If they do think that, I believe they are mistaken.

 

I think that the SPL, short term will enjoy a competitive boost without them, and the Leagues overall will attract much extra interest as Rangers fight their way back.

 

Yes there will be a financial hit, but if affects everyone, budgets can be adjusted.

[fowler9]

just goes to show how much of a joke scottish football is that the whole league relies on two clubs to exist, if Rangers are allowed in the SPL it just sends the impression they can go spend over the top and go bust every few years with next to no consequences

[John McClane]

What should happen is Newco Rangers (Glasgow Rangers is dead) be relegated to Division 3. Suits will however do everything they can to relegate them to Division 1.

 

I feel sorry for their fans, if it was LFC in that situation, id take the bottom league and fight your way up the leagues from scratch, not having to thank anyone for any favors on the way.

 

Rangers fans always sang "nobody likes us, we don't care". They are right, nobody likes them, but they obviously do care now.

 

If Newco do go down to Division 3 it will be interesting to see what salaries the players that stayed receive as Im sure lower league teams are part time.

 

One last thing, how the hell did Lafferty get a team? have they seen him play??

[No2]

Can anyone clarify how SKY are seemingly able to rip up their contract with the SPL? The way I see it is they either illegally rip up the contract and get sued or else SKY had the foresight to see that Old Firm matches may not take place and included provisions in the contract. If the latter is true, how did SKY know that Rangers or Celtic may not be in the SPL and no one else did?

[magicrat]

Can anyone clarify how SKY are seemingly able to rip up their contract with the SPL? The way I see it is they either illegally rip up the contract and get sued or else SKY had the foresight to see that Old Firm matches may not take place and included provisions in the contract. If the latter is true, how did SKY know that Rangers or Celtic may not be in the SPL and no one else did?

Because I suspect the contract will be caveated in such a way that they can re-negotiate if either get relegated, booted out, or fuck off to the English PL. They will have covered their arses

[No2]

Because I suspect the contract will be caveated in such a way that they can re-negotiate if either get relegated, booted out, or fuck off to the English PL. They will have covered their arses

 

That's easy to say now but when the contract was being drawn up you would have gotten odds of 1000000/1 on any 1 of those outcomes happening. I wonder did they have their mates listen in on a few phone calls?

[John McClane]

The talk of the Old Firm leaving SPL for England has been going for years. SKY legal team earned their salary here as they would have entered the stipulation that only if Old Firm are in the league, is the money on the table.

[magicrat]

That's easy to say now but when the contract was being drawn up you would have gotten odds of 1000000/1 on any 1 of those outcomes happening. I wonder did they have their mates listen in on a few phone calls?

Maybe but Skys Lawyers will have every angle covered for a contract like this. Anyway defection to the PL has been widely discussed for years.

I seem to recall something in the press about the fact Sky had it covered months ago.

[Dougie Do'ins]

[JohnnyH]

Yep. Rangers now fight to get into Div 1 with the SPL a no go. Absolutely correct. They need to start back in div 3, and I was pleased to see so many Rangers fans vote for this themselves in an online poll. However, the statement from Clyde makes for worrying reading if you’re a fan of the Scottish league.