Speed/Whizz

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

Oh come on, you're not falling for that one. As guilty as the brits who sold them guns or the yanks who gave them money to get rid of communists? Or maybe they are communists, selling drugs to fight the CIA. Anyway you get my point. It's not as simple as drug lords are bad, governments are good. You and I paid good tax money to set up all those little drug wars. Someone sniffing a few lines only contributes a couple of bullets at most.

 

I am not saying any of those people are innocent so don't put words in my mouth. The point I am making is that while there are gangs on the streets of Liverpool shooting each other, if you are buying their drugs then you are also guilty.

 

If people don't buy the drugs then people wont take the drugs. If you aren't snorting your little brain out on a Friday or Saturday night in town then these people who are shooting each other in the city wouldn't be in business. So while you may think that you have absolutely nothing to do with some young man with a family getting put down a hole in this city, your buying the drugs that create the demand which means the gangs get created.

[zigackly]

I am not saying any of those people are innocent so don't put words in my mouth. The point I am making is that while there are gangs on the streets of Liverpool shooting each other, if you are buying their drugs then you are also guilty.

 

If people don't buy the drugs then people wont take the drugs. If you aren't snorting your little brain out on a Friday or Saturday night in town then these people who are shooting each other in the city wouldn't be in business. So while you may think that you have absolutely nothing to do with some young man with a family getting put down a hole in this city, your buying the drugs that create the demand which means the gangs get created.

 

That's a very naive way of looking at it. Another way is that it is the law which creates the profit and therefore the crime. I don't actually take them any more as a rule by the way, but if some meddling, control-addled dickhead of a politician decides it's criminal for me to have a bit of harmless enjoyment, then like prohibition in Chicago that is going to generate a situation which rapidly spirals out of control because people are going to do it anyway. Human beings have had the urge and the knowhow to get stoned off our faces since before we even fell out of the trees. Stop arresting them, allow it to be sold legally for a small profit and controlled so it's not full of shit, and suddenly most of the problems with crime and health will disappear, because they were only artificially generated and sustained by a draconian, outdated and unenforceable law in the first place.

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

That's a very naive way of looking at it. Another way is that it is the law which creates the profit and therefore the crime. I don't actually take them any more as a rule by the way, but if some meddling, control-addled dickhead of a politician decides it's criminal for me to have a bit of harmless enjoyment, then like prohibition in Chicago that is going to generate a situation which rapidly spirals out of control because people are going to do it anyway. Human beings have had the urge and the knowhow to get stoned off our faces since before we even fell out of the trees. Stop arresting them, allow it to be sold legally for a small profit and controlled so it's not full of shit, and suddenly most of the problems with crime and health will disappear, because they were only artificially generated and sustained by a draconian, outdated and unenforceable law in the first place.

 

You are the naive one my freind, have you ever taken drugs or seen what harm drugs do to people. Yes alcohol does harm people but the vast majority of people who drink enjoy alcohol and it enhances not ruins their lives.

 

Cannabis, cocaine, etc. are drugs that do not enhance peoples live but instead cause more problems. I know people who smoked shit loads of pot when they were kids and younger and now dont touch the stuff. They thoguht exactly what you think that cannabis is harmless and smoking would do them no harm and alcohol was worse. The thing is though people dont sit around drinking alcohol all day do they they only drink of a weekend. These poeple who are not scallys but decent people said that cannabis is far from harmless and is a dngerous drug. I have taken all drugs and I would like to catagorically state that I would like them to remain illegal.

 

And as for your statement about politicians making them illegal well that is not entirley true.

 

we as citizens of the UK vote for a political party, and that party then makes laws for this country. If we as citizens of this country collectively wanted cocaine etc. legal we could easily vote for a party that would legalise them. So the bottom line is, it is not the government that want drugs illegal it is the people who vote them into power who want them legal.

[zigackly]

I can't begin to think where to help you, but perhaps you could start with the meaning of the word naive.

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

I can't begin to think where to help you, but perhaps you could start with the meaning of the word naive.

 

that was a typo caused by just looking at how you spelt it and not thinking what I was typing.

 

you can't help me as I am not the one with the wrong view and perception of drugs.

[RoboRiise]

I will stand corrected. I was lead to beleive that Angel Dust was just the narcotic part of speed without the other shit that just dilutes it.

 

We used to take shit loads of base in the 90's and that is why the come down I am talking about is worse than what you are saying. Used to also take loads of E's, but the problem was with them the quality went real shit after a while. They started of fairly decent but then they just became pills with valium and speed cut together, and not to forget ketamine.

 

The point is though which you seem to have missed with taking drugs is not so much what it does to you, but the people who blow each other to pieces fighting stupid little battles.

 

Whether you pull the trigger or not if your buying their cocaine then morally you a guilty.

 

 

Your last point is a very good one. Leaving aside the fact that I don't buy coke and never have (as I said in my post) I'm very well aware of the methods of production and the impact of the market for that drug on the centres of production. I'm about to head off out right now but I may return to this point later.

 

As for the speed, paste is exactly what I was talking about, not some powdery shit mixed with bicarbonate of soda and powdered glucose. Seriously mate, I'm 40 years old and although I don't want to go on and on about my own drug experiences because it ends up sounding like bragging when in fact it's nothing to brag about, just a different choice or recreational activity than most people, I'm certainly not some lightweight noob who doesn't know what he's talking about. I spent pretty much every weekend of the 90s off my tits on something and had some very good sources.

[zigackly]

Mr BUM, are you honestly arguing that people having an ale in Chicago under prohibition were directly responsible for the rise of the mafia?

 

Because if you are I will let this pass with a good chuckle, but otherwise I don't think you have even strained three neurons to understand my point.

 

I do understand your point, it's the very same one that the sheeplike charlatans amongst the political classes love to bleat in my ears with monotonous regularity.

 

And RoboRiise: only on the weekends? You disappoint me young man.

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

Mr BUM, are you honestly arguing that people having an ale in Chicago under prohibition were directly responsible for the rise of the mafia?

 

Because if you are I will let this pass with a good chuckle, but otherwise I don't think you have even strained three neurons to understand my point.

 

I do understand your point, it's the very same one that the sheeplike charlatans amongst the political classes love to bleat in my ears with monotonous regularity.

 

And RoboRiise: only on the weekends? You disappoint me young man.

 

The mafia did start off because of prohibition or at least prohibition helped them become so powerfull. But just because something being illegal means that a criminal element will try to find a niche they can exploit doesn't mean you should legalise every thing that can be exploited. It also doesn't make you guilty if these people decide to exploite a substance that you have made illegal and as such guns start to get pulled out.

 

Prohibition was wrong as the majority of people wanted to drink alcohol legally. Are you saying that we should allow cocaine and herion to become legal so people can start smoking crack, and injecting herion just so that we dont create gangs which will then in turn start blowing each other to pieces?

 

These gangs are also involved in extortion, armed robbery as well as selling counterfit clothing for instance. Are you saying that we should make all these activities legal so that we dont become part of the problem of people shooting each other.

 

Not being funny or nothing, but I have took drugs and seen what drugs do to people and I would be happy for my kids to go out and drink alcohol, but there is no way on this planet I would want them going out taking any other drugs.

[zigackly]

The mafia did start off because of prohibition or at least prohibition helped them become so powerfull. But just because something being illegal means that a criminal element will try to find a niche they can exploit doesn't mean you should legalise every thing that can be exploited. It also doesn't make you guilty if these people decide to exploite a substance that you have made illegal and as such guns start to get pulled out.

 

Prohibition was wrong as the majority of people wanted to drink alcohol legally. Are you saying that we should allow cocaine and herion to become legal so people can start smoking crack, and injecting herion just so that we dont create gangs which will then in turn start blowing each other to pieces?

 

These gangs are also involved in extortion, armed robbery as well as selling counterfit clothing for instance. Are you saying that we should make all these activities legal so that we dont become part of the problem of people shooting each other.

 

Not being funny or nothing, but I have took drugs and seen what drugs do to people and I would be happy for my kids to go out and drink alcohol, but there is no way on this planet I would want them going out taking any other drugs.

 

No, I am not stating by any means that crime should be tolerated if it's difficult to stop. What I am saying is to fight your battles where you can win. Prohibition could not win because the size of the market for booze was too great, and the margin for profits were too great. Thus a criminal fraternity arose to take advantage of it. This is basic economics, and the crime bosses will always operate in high margin commodities because people want it and will pay for it. Of course there is a fucking huge market for drugs. That's precisely why they are shooting each other over the right to sell it.

 

I don't think the market for counterfeit clothing even comes NEAR it, but you doubtless have access to figures on which you've based your decision making. No?

 

Now the question here is which is the bigger crime: manufacturing a marketplace which it is inevitable will be exploited in this way, or admitting that some people will always take drugs and taking steps to protect and help them rather than criminalise a whole class of society.

 

It's society's problems which lead people to take drugs ultimately. They do it because they see nothing around them to live for, nothing that can change, nothing that can make a difference, and the same for their children and their children's children, and fuck it: taking drugs is great. It takes all that pain away.

 

My point is that if we were to decriminalise that underclass then we wouldn't be pushing them into the arms of the crime bosses. If people are going to take crack or smack regardless of the law, which they clearly are, I prefer a society where they are understood and tolerated to some degree so that they don't end up selling their chilldren's food and school clothes to buy a fix which will fuck up their bodies because it's filled full of crap you wouldn't inject in a dying dog which had shat on your carpet.

 

And yes, if it stops the crime then what is the problem with it? What is is that you are afraid of if some people who are going to take crack can get it cheap enough so that it doesn't turn them into desperate thieving animals and clean enough that it doesn't ruin their health. You think more people will take it? Well it's possible yes, but that doesn't seem to be the case in countries where people are more tolerant of drug problems.

 

What if it did actually take away the crime and the associated health problems without significantly increasing the number of people on drugs?

 

Why shouldn't that type of solution even be considered? Is the current stance working? Are the problems going away? Are less people getting hooked or shot each year? I don't think it is working. Not even close.

 

As for the wonders of alcohol, you are talking to the wrong person I'm afraid because I have lost a number of friends and family to alcohol and have other friends who are on Antabuse for the stuff. I have had drink problems myself, and I haven't touched a drop of it for over a year. I honestly can't tell you any worse stories of drugs affecting the lives of anyone I know because I don't have any even after over ten years of near constant abuse. I have some parallel stories to the problems I've witnessed with alcohol. I honestly can't think of any worse. Even the ones who got into heroin.

 

I hope you educate your children better than you evidently have been yourself on the subject. You obviously feel strongly about it, so read up on it. Read the research. Look at the numbers. See if there might be something in what I'm saying. Or carry on with your fingers in your ears going la la la at the top of your voice. Doesn't matter to me.

Edited July 17, 2011 by zigackly

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

No, I am not stating by any means that crime should be tolerated if it's difficult to stop. What I am saying is to fight your battles where you can win. Prohibition could not win because the size of the market for booze was too great, and the margin for profits were too great. Thus a criminal fraternity arose to take advantage of it. This is basic economics, and the crime bosses will always operate in high margin commodities because people want it and will pay for it. Of course there is a fucking huge market for drugs. That's precisely why they are shooting each other over the right to sell it.

 

I don't think the market for counterfeit clothing even comes NEAR it, but you doubtless have access to figures on which you've based your decision making. No?

 

Now the question here is which is the bigger crime: manufacturing a marketplace which it is inevitable will be exploited in this way, or admitting that some people will always take drugs and taking steps to protect and help them rather than criminalise a whole class of society.

 

It's society's problems which lead people to take drugs ultimately. They do it because they see nothing around them to live for, nothing that can change, nothing that can make a difference, and the same for their children and their children's children, and fuck it: taking drugs is great. It takes all that pain away.

 

My point is that if we were to decriminalise that underclass then we wouldn't be pushing them into the arms of the crime bosses. If people are going to take crack or smack regardless of the law, which they clearly are, I prefer a society where they are understood and tolerated to some degree so that they don't end up selling their chilldren's food and school clothes to buy a fix which will fuck up their bodies because it's filled full of crap you wouldn't inject in a dying dog which had shat on your carpet.

 

And yes, if it stops the crime then what is the problem with it? What is is that you are afraid of if some people who are going to take crack can get it cheap enough so that it doesn't turn them into desperate thieving animals and clean enough that it doesn't ruin their health. You think more people will take it? Well it's possible yes, but that doesn't seem to be the case in countries where people are more tolerant of drug problems.

 

What if it did actually take away the crime and the associated health problems without significantly increasing the number of people on drugs?

 

Why shouldn't that type of solution even be considered? Is the current stance working? Are the problems going away? Are less people getting hooked or shot each year? I don't think it is working. Not even close.

 

As for the wonders of alcohol, you are talking to the wrong person I'm afraid because I have lost a number of friends and family to alcohol and have other friends who are on Antabuse for the stuff. I have had drink problems myself, and I haven't touched a drop of it for over a year. I honestly can't tell you any worse stories of drugs affecting the lives of anyone I know because I don't have any even after over ten years of near constant abuse. I have some parallel stories to the problems I've witnessed with alcohol. I honestly can't think of any worse. Even the ones who got into heroin.

 

I hope you educate your children better than you evidently have been yourself on the subject. You obviously feel strongly about it, so read up on it. Read the research. Look at the numbers. See if there might be something in what I'm saying. Or carry on with your fingers in your ears going la la la at the top of your voice. Doesn't matter to me.

 

Based on the statement that I have highlighted I will take it that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You have never met anyone that is addicted to either crack or smack.

 

These drugs fuck you up whether they are pure or not, people do not function while on these drugs. I know people who have been addicted to both and they would spit in your face and tell you to fuck off if you even suggested to them that these should be freely available. These drugs are very morish, so if you had a mountain of scag or crack you wouldn't stop until it was all gone. These people got off it because people around them were not taking it. People addicted to alcohol find it difficult to get off alcohol because people around them drink and it is a social norm. People who are addicted to drugs are not criminalised because they take drugs they commit crimes because they are addicted to drugs.

 

You talk about decriminalising drugs, but what does that sovle? It soves nothing. I holland they are de criminalised but people still get addicted and then as such people need to feed their habbit so they starrt theiving and take up prostitution.

 

The way of stopping people getting addicted in the first place is to stop them from taking it in the first place. Not one person I know who has been addicted has ever come up with the bull shit that you have just spoken and said they got addicted because of society. they got addicted because they started experimenting with drugs such as pot, and then they went on to harder drugs. And for the record that is why pot isn't a harmless drug because every person I know who was addicted to heroin started off smoking pot. If these people never smoked pot they would have never become heroin addicts. they would instead have become at first time of asking happy productive members of society, so you blaming society is the biggest load of crap i have ever heard in all my born days.

[zigackly]

Based on the statement that I have highlighted I will take it that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You have never met anyone that is addicted to either crack or smack.

 

Yes of course I don't. Seriously. I made the whole thing up. I've never even taken paracetamol, me.

 

In all honesty I see no further point in discussing the subject with you.

 

I actually think from your last post that you're just on a windup.

 

"The way of stopping people getting addicted in the first place is to stop them from taking it in the first place". Fucking hell, I bet the government wish they'd thought of that.

 

You should be an expert on the subject on telly. You could make a fortune.

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

Yes of course I don't. Seriously. I made the whole thing up. I've never even taken paracetamol, me.

 

In all honesty I see no further point in discussing the subject with you.

 

I actually think from your last post that you're just on a windup.

 

"The way of stopping people getting addicted in the first place is to stop them from taking it in the first place". Fucking hell, I bet the government wish they'd thought of that.

 

You should be an expert on the subject on telly. You could make a fortune.

 

At last you see that your idea of making it legal and tollerating it is not the way to stop people from becoming addicted to it.

[lifetime fan]

Legalise the fucking lot of it, make enough of a profit to offer an excellent needle exchange programme and drug information and counselling services that are worthy of actually being called that.

 

Exactly the same for prostitution too.

[zigackly]

At last you see that your idea of making it legal and tollerating it is not the way to stop people from becoming addicted to it.

 

Yeah I thought so. Some people do actually have their lives destroyed by this you know and you're not even being remotely funny, which is quite exceptional, you having spent so long at it today.

 

I'd be ashamed to catch a small one like this with such shit bait.

[TonyBellew_BUM!]

Yeah I thought so. Some people do actually have their lives destroyed by this you know and you're not even being remotely funny, which is quite exceptional, you having spent so long at it today.

 

I'd be ashamed to catch a small one like this with such shit bait.

 

WTF? What do you think I have been saying.

 

If people have their lives destroyed by the stuff why the fuck tollerate it then?

[zigackly]

[RoboRiise]

Mr BUM, are you honestly arguing that people having an ale in Chicago under prohibition were directly responsible for the rise of the mafia?

 

Because if you are I will let this pass with a good chuckle, but otherwise I don't think you have even strained three neurons to understand my point.

 

I do understand your point, it's the very same one that the sheeplike charlatans amongst the political classes love to bleat in my ears with monotonous regularity.

 

And RoboRiise: only on the weekends? You disappoint me young man.

 

 

I didn't say only the weekend...

[loadsoftrophies]

[YOUTUBE]dYuOeW8cNqk[/YOUTUBE]

[Adebisi]

Right, sorry for the lack of an update chaps but we didn't end up doing it that weekend after all.

 

Instead we did it last night. I'd gone out for a celebratory drink with work and left after a few points to score the whizz. Me and my mate did two bombs in an alley about 5 minutes after buying it then we had a walk to another mates and we did 2 more then. About an hour passes and I'm still not really feeling anything so a mate of a mate does me a pretty big bomb. Maybe 20 minutes later I start getting really dry mouth, sweaty palms and some light gurning. Another 15 and I'm chatting quite a lot of shit. I then go for a piss and notice my dick is basically inside of me it has shrunk that much.

 

Another half hour passes and everyone is asking why I seem like the least buzzed. Apparently that last bomb would have done the job for all of them. I figure it could be possibly due to me been rather quiet normally or something. By about 5 everyone is heading off and trying to kip, but I just stayed up and watched shite TV until about 1pm when everyone got up. Maybe it's just because I didn't sleep but I don't feel particularly bad. No real "come down" to speak of. Though I am sporting bug eyes and and the walk home was unbearable due to the heat and quite a bit of gurning was going on.

 

All in all though I feel pretty fine. I'm guessing it was shit whizz or something. Either way I've been awake since 7:45 yesterday morning and I haven't eaten since 13:00. I don't really feel hungry but I think I'm going to have to eat something. Any suggestions? I wouldn't mind a takeaway or some pot noodles and crisp sarnies. Just something easy so I don't have to move too much tonight.

[chrisbonnie]

Right, sorry for the lack of an update chaps but we didn't end up doing it that weekend after all.

 

Instead we did it last night. I'd gone out for a celebratory drink with work and left after a few points to score the whizz. Me and my mate did two bombs in an alley about 5 minutes after buying it then we had a walk to another mates and we did 2 more then. About an hour passes and I'm still not really feeling anything so a mate of a mate does me a pretty big bomb. Maybe 20 minutes later I start getting really dry mouth, sweaty palms and some light gurning. Another 15 and I'm chatting quite a lot of shit. I then go for a piss and notice my dick is basically inside of me it has shrunk that much.

 

Another half hour passes and everyone is asking why I seem like the least buzzed. Apparently that last bomb would have done the job for all of them. I figure it could be possibly due to me been rather quiet normally or something. By about 5 everyone is heading off and trying to kip, but I just stayed up and watched shite TV until about 1pm when everyone got up. Maybe it's just because I didn't sleep but I don't feel particularly bad. No real "come down" to speak of. Though I am sporting bug eyes and and the walk home was unbearable due to the heat and quite a bit of gurning was going on.

 

All in all though I feel pretty fine. I'm guessing it was shit whizz or something. Either way I've been awake since 7:45 yesterday morning and I haven't eaten since 13:00. I don't really feel hungry but I think I'm going to have to eat something. Any suggestions? I wouldn't mind a takeaway or some pot noodles and crisp sarnies. Just something easy so I don't have to move too much tonight.

 

pizza, and plenty of beer

 

oh, and fuck your missus as well, if there is no Mrs Adebisi, have a toss.