Coronavirus

[Red Phoenix]

Well that fascist bankster twat Draghi in Italy started me off in this thread over 5 weeks ago with his mandate threats and now it's coming full circle, I hope the cunt has a great day : Vaccine rebels vow to paralyze Italy over incoming COVID passport

[TD_LFC]

Yeah it's completely unreasonable to have to show you're vaccinated OR you've had a negative test in the last 48 hours (is it a passport mandate if you don't actually need a passport?)

 

Given around 81% of Italians over the age of 12 are vaccinated it just leaves the remaining working age people to get tested every couple of days to show they aren't carrying the virus.

 

Sensible.

[Red Phoenix]

28 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

Given around 81% of Italians over the age of 12 are vaccinated it just leaves the remaining working age people to get tested every couple of days to show they aren't carrying the virus.

 

Sensible.

 

If they were so bothered about those carrying the virus they'd test the vaccinated too, vaccines don't stop the spread.

[Rico1304]

Fucking governments, saving their citizens lives.  
 

 

[Vincent Vega]

I reckon 90% of anti-vaxxers are simply scared of needles. 

[Rico1304]

I reckon 90% of anti-vaxxers are simple. 

[Guest]

157 deaths in the last 24 hours. It's over. 

[M_B]

1 hour ago, TD_LFC said:

Yeah it's completely unreasonable to have to show you're vaccinated OR you've had a negative test in the last 48 hours (is it a passport mandate if you don't actually need a passport?)

 

Given around 81% of Italians over the age of 12 are vaccinated it just leaves the remaining working age people to get tested every couple of days to show they aren't carrying the virus.

 

Sensible.

The majority support the ruling in principle (aside from the far right wing in Italy who oppose anything this government offers), but there is an argument over who should cover the cost of the test. At the moment the employer or employee has to pay for it, but the opposition want the govt to foot the bill.

[Bruce Spanner]

I knew there was another scandal I’d forgotten…

 

’Nightingale Testing Centres’

 

The testing places in the midlands that’s just been suspended for fucking up testing was a publicly funded initiative that was transferred to a private company, in effect we’ll build you the facilities if you do testing there, after that it’s yours…

 

Pretty sure it is anyway.

[Strontium]

2 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

If they were so bothered about those carrying the virus they'd test the vaccinated too, vaccines don't stop the spread.

 

As you point out, vaccines don't prevent transmission. That's how you know vaccine passports aren't about stopping the spread of the virus, they're about control.

[Rico1304]

4 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

As you point out, vaccines don't prevent transmission. That's how you know vaccine passports aren't about stopping the spread of the virus, they're about control.

What? Exactly what is the ‘control’ ? Giving people a life saving vaccine? Are they controlling babies too? 
 

People with the vaccine are many times less like to catch it, therefore pass it on and then to suffer from the worst of the complications.  When your only ally is a self confessed tin foil hatter…

[Jose Jones]

8 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

As you point out, vaccines don't prevent transmission. That's how you know vaccine passports aren't about stopping the spread of the virus, they're about control.

Classic Stronts argument preparation post there, kudos.

Will you agree that the vaccines reduce transmission?

[TheHowieLama]

Strontsy - you travel internationally right?

[Strontium]

4 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

People with the vaccine are many times less like to catch it, therefore pass it on and then to suffer from the worst of the complications.  When your only ally is a self confessed tin foil hatter…

 

They're not "many times" less likely to catch it, especially new variants that emerge from here on in. The point of the vaccine is to stop it from killing or hospitalising you when you do, inevitably, get it.

 

1 minute ago, Jose Jones said:

Classic Stronts argument preparation post there, kudos.

Will you agree that the vaccines reduce transmission?

 

Last time I checked, the vaccines reduce transmission by about a third. Not quantified is how much extra transmission occurs due to the false sense of immunity provided by the vaccine.

 

Just now, TheHowieLama said:

Strontsy - you travel internationally right?

 

When the border Nazis don't stop me, yes.

[TheHowieLama]

1 minute ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

When the border Nazis don't stop me, yes.

When you show your passport - are you being controlled?

[Strontium]

1 minute ago, TheHowieLama said:

When you show your passport - are you being controlled?

 

It's not the same thing, is it. You expect to show documentation when you enter someone else's country, because you have no inherent right to be there. You don't expect to have to produce documentation to exist in your own country.

[Bjornebye]

People have a right not to take the vaccine. "yes hurrah! freedom!" 

 

Owners of establishments have the right not to want unvaccinated people on their premises. "what? hang on that doesn't suit my agenda! Nazis!" 

[Strontium]

Just now, Bjornebye said:

People have a right not to take the vaccine. "yes hurrah! freedom!" 

 

Owners of establishments have the right not to want unvaccinated people on their premises. "what? hang on that doesn't suit my agenda! Nazis!" 

 

What does this have to do with owners of establishments? We're talking about government-mandated vaccine passports.

[Jose Jones]

Vaccine passports are blackmail really, whether you consider that “control” or not depends on your mindset I suppose.

I doubt they will exist long term anywhere except maybe international travel.

[TheHowieLama]

Pretty sure you can "exist" without documentation. Certain activities you will not be able to take part in.

You have a drivers license? Cuz you cannae drive without one - but you can "exist".

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

What does this have to do with owners of establishments? We're talking about government-mandated vaccine passports.

Do you have a problem with an establishment owner (restaurant, bar, hotel etc) wanting to see a vaccine passport before allowing you to enter? 

[Strontium]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

Do you have a problem with an establishment owner (restaurant, bar, hotel etc) wanting to see a vaccine passport before allowing you to enter? 

 

Establishments should be able to refuse access to whoever they want. I've never argued otherwise. This is about the government TELLING THEM who they can and can't admit.

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

Establishments should be able to refuse access to whoever they want. I've never argued otherwise. This is about the government TELLING THEM who they can and can't admit.

You have a problem with the government trying to reduce the spread of the virus? masks, lockdowns now this. I bet you wash your hands through gritted teeth and all. I don't think it will become a 'norm' and to be honest I wouldn't trust this government to get anything right anyway I'm sure they don't even know what the vaccine passport plan looks like. 

[TD_LFC]

45 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

It's not the same thing, is it. You expect to show documentation when you enter someone else's country, because you have no inherent right to be there. You don't expect to have to produce documentation to exist in your own country.

Unless you show you photo ID to prove your age, driving license to prove you can drive, your work pass to enter your place of work, your address and photo ID to prove you are who you say you are when you sign up/want access to certain things etc etc etc

[Red Phoenix]

3 hours ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

As you point out, vaccines don't prevent transmission. That's how you know vaccine passports aren't about stopping the spread of the virus, they're about control.

 

Yeah it looks like that's the case and it's fucked up how many people are fine with going along with it if so. I guess more will change their minds as this goes on though because I don't see govs letting this go so easily.