Thank you - Zinedine Zidane

[Count Morfeo]

Well, I'm not banning you either. I have to work on my comedy.

 

I think Zidane is the best ever, as I've said previously in this thread. The reason I hold him ahead of Maradona (I've just not seen enough of Pelé to have him as an alternative) is that he's far more effective than him. Take that film clip someone posted in this thread; Maradona was class but highly ineffective. He could drible but he did it far too often and often without anything to show for it. What's impressed me with Zidane though is his awareness to other players combined with a creative head and a silky touch and pass (often in the same movement). He could also decide a game on his own (but so could every contender for "best ever", I admit). When he peaked, he did things in every single match that other "world class" players did once or twice a season. Often small details that wasn't obvious unless you followed him closely.

 

The Count can sadly not concur with Kop.

 

Maradona was all about the end product. What defines a great player, in the count's opinion, is the ability is not just the ability to act as an individual, like the perception of George Best, but his contribution to the whole part. Maradona was the ultimate in both respects, in The Count's opinion.

 

Zidane is one of the greats of the game but he only really produced a the top level for a shorter period than many of the other greats you could mention.

 

People have this notion of him taking Serie A by storm, but it took him some time to adapt. There was also an opinion in Italy, that Italian defences and midfields had worked him out by the time he left for Madrid.

[aws]

Great player but in my opinion not one of the truly great players of the game.

 

Pele,Maradonna,Cruyff,Beckenbauer and others operated in a higher class.

[Zippy]

Maradona had all of Zidanes passing ability but combined it with a change of pace and dribbling ability that meant he was able to hurt teams himself whereas Zidane for all his grace and ability to play beautiful football was predominantly a creator for others (although obviously he got some very important goals).

 

However Zidane was a master at creating time and space and his record of success in three top European leagues is probably unsurpassed. IMO he would have had no problem in England as his performances against United in the CL showed.

 

One more thing I have to disagree with the Count on is the idea that he is 2 stone heavier than Crouch. The Counts counting has gone astray as he makes Crouch look like Arnie Schwarzenegger! ;)

[Rashid]

The fact that Zidane is being compared with Maradona says it all in fairness. The guy is a legend.

[Guest Momo Sissoko]

I think it's the first time I've ever heard someone say that Maradonna was "highly ineffective"

 

Strewth.

[Count Morfeo]

Maradona had all of Zidanes passing ability but combined it with a change of pace and dribbling ability that meant he was able to hurt teams himself whereas Zidane for all his grace and ability to play beautiful football was predominantly a creator for others (although obviously he got some very important goals).

 

However Zidane was a master at creating time and space and his record of success in three top European leagues is probably unsurpassed. IMO he would have had no problem in England as his performances against United in the CL showed.

 

One more thing I have to disagree with the Count on is the idea that he is 2 stone heavier than Crouch. The Counts counting has gone astray as he makes Crouch look like Arnie Schwarzenegger! ;)

 

The Count accepts your mockery but withdraws his service as a get-that-ball-off-the-roof-for-us-la operator to Zippy and all his fellow inhabitants of Dingle land.

Any more indiscretions and the Count will dish out a Sesame street whooping on your Rainbow ass.

[05 Milan]

I must say I'm quite surprised to see the views of a couple of forumites on here. If I remember correctly, in a thread a couple of days back you created in your mind a kind of fantasy footballer and had to decide whether he was better than Pele and Maradona. I'm sure a lot of you answered yes.

[Zippy]

The Count accepts your mockery but withdraws his service as a get-that-ball-off-the-roof-for-us-la operator to Zippy and all his fellow inhabitants of Dingle land.

Any more indiscretions and the Count will dish out a Sesame street whooping on your Rainbow ass.

 

No we need you to get our Casey back mate. You have called my bluff and Zippy will acknowledge that The Count is the nearest thing in Wales to Ivan Drago!

 

Now get that ball for me La!

[kop]

I think it's the first time I've ever heard someone say that Maradonna was "highly ineffective"

 

Strewth.

 

That was a bit over the top I admit, but it was ment as a relative comment. Relative in context with "Maradona is the best ever", not in the context of every other ineffective player.

[Jose Jones]

That was a bit over the top I admit, but it was ment as a relative comment. Relative in context with "Maradona is the best ever", not in the context of every other ineffective player.

 

They must have done some weird editing on Norwegian tv.

[Spanish_fan]

No way. the Count can't believe you said that about Ronaldinho. he was class in his first 6 months. Just the rest of the side were demoralised after the previous season. But Davids did play a big part in the post-xmas revival. Even if he is a sted head.

 

Then we got a player much better at it: Deco. The question about the importance of Davids is an interesting one. Before he arrived Barcelona were playing with a 4-2-3-1 system, typical of Spanish teams at the time. Then Davids came in and Rijkaard reverted to the now established 4-3-3. With that system Barcelona were far more compact in midlfield. Davids was very good on the defensive side but poor in attack, as he has always been. Deco has done an excellent job defensively and he is 10 times the player Davids is on the ball. Even when Deco has not been available (Milan away for instance) Barcelona have been far more solid. So the impact of Davids is exageratted IMO. He contributed but the change of system helped too.

[Spanish_fan]

I think it's the first time I've ever heard someone say that Maradonna was "highly ineffective"

 

Strewth.

 

He was pretty inefective for Barcelona though. Yet he produced some moments of magic. BTW, if any of you have ever heard of a player named Julio Alberto (Spanish international) that was the one who introduced him to his life addiction, cocaine.

[Captain]

Well, I'm not banning you either. I have to work on my comedy.

 

I think Zidane is the best ever, as I've said previously in this thread. The reason I hold him ahead of Maradona (I've just not seen enough of Pelé to have him as an alternative) is that he's far more effective than him. Take that film clip someone posted in this thread; Maradona was class but highly ineffective. He could drible but he did it far too often and often without anything to show for it. What's impressed me with Zidane though is his awareness to other players combined with a creative head and a silky touch and pass (often in the same movement). He could also decide a game on his own (but so could every contender for "best ever", I admit). When he peaked, he did things in every single match that other "world class" players did once or twice a season. Often small details that wasn't obvious unless you followed him closely.

This is the Maradona that almost single-handedly made Napoli champions? :no

 

I'd say he had a hand (no pund intended) in Argentina winning the World Cup in 1986 too.

 

As for Zizou, he was the best player of his generation. I'll never forget the way he played for Juve in the nineties, sheer class. I think they figured in three CL-finals on the trot.

 

Zidane was world class indeed and one of the very best players to ever grace the game. His vision and touch was second to none, and his ability to recieve the ball and keep it under the most difficult of circumstances was astonishing. His eye for the pass was exquisit, a true maestro on the pitch.

 

Thank you for the entertainment, Zizou.

[Chocoholic]

...Zippy and all his fellow inhabitants of Dingle land.

 

Any more indiscretions and the Count will dish out a Sesame street whooping on your Rainbow ass.

 

:D :D :D

 

Zidane has been a great player, But to be honest, I think he's over rated too. Certainly not THE greatest as some have deemed him.

 

I'm not necessarily putting them in the greatest bracket, but I'd rather have watched the sublime skills and more effective and productive end product of the masterful Zola or Dennis Bergkamp. Only last week, we saw Bergkamp can still turn it on, playing the intelligent pass and scoring a beautifully placed goal, with that trademark no-backlift kick.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm far from an Arsenal fan, but I just admire master craftsmen and artistry. Arsenal have been extremely lucky to have had two

of the best at the peak of their careers, overlapping for so long.

 

At the time Zola was at Chelsea, I'd have loved to see him rewarded with a title at that time. It wouldn't have been for any love of them, but only as an option other than the manure. Despite Ken Bates being there at the time, and being such a twat, he's still nowhere near as bad as the combined force of the maureen-kenyon-abramobitch axis of evil.

[Count Morfeo]

No we need you to get our Casey back mate. You have called my bluff and Zippy will acknowledge that The Count is the nearest thing in Wales to Ivan Drago!

 

Now get that ball for me La!

 

The Count is glad that Zippy knows it makes sense. And remember oscar the grouch and big bird have got The Count's back. They'd hand out an old-fashioned educational whooping to Geoff and Bungle.

 

Then the Count would say: "If Bungle dies. He dies."

[Dundalis]

Well, I'm not banning you either. I have to work on my comedy.

 

I think Zidane is the best ever, as I've said previously in this thread. The reason I hold him ahead of Maradona (I've just not seen enough of Pelé to have him as an alternative) is that he's far more effective than him. Take that film clip someone posted in this thread; Maradona was class but highly ineffective. He could drible but he did it far too often and often without anything to show for it. What's impressed me with Zidane though is his awareness to other players combined with a creative head and a silky touch and pass (often in the same movement). He could also decide a game on his own (but so could every contender for "best ever", I admit). When he peaked, he did things in every single match that other "world class" players did once or twice a season. Often small details that wasn't obvious unless you followed him closely.

The reverse is true. Zidane is someone who would turn up for the big stage. A player who would come good for the games that really counted as though he couldn't gather up the motivation to do it consistantly for the regular season. He would go missing for HUGE chunks of the regular season for both Juventus and Madrid, but then turn up when it counted. Some say that is the sign of a great player, but a greater player does it all the time. The man is lackadaisical by nature, and this is no exception.

 

That is where Maradona comes into his own. He is THE greatest combination of flash/entertainment, and effectiveness/teamwork, that has ever played the game. He scored some great goals, but that wasn't his forte. I don't believe he ever scored 20 goals in a season in Italy. His passing and ability to pick out a pass where even spectators wouldn't, made him the ultimate number 10 playmaker that has ever played. I would say vision-wise only Cruyff was superior. He was also a master at drawing the ultimate number of defenders possible to him, to create space for his teammates. He was simply a great team player.

 

In my honest opinion, and I've held it for a long while, Rivaldo is the best player of the last ten years. I watched just about every televised game he played in 98-99. I never saw Zidane dominate for his club nor score so many match winning goals as I saw Rivaldo do for Barcelona. The man was as complete an attacking force as there was. He had great skill and technical ability, but when combined with his strength and big frame, made him just about impossible to knock off the ball. He was a dominant goal scorer. Consistantly scoring 20 plus goals a season as an attacking midfielder. He scored long range wonder strikes, from free kicks, and open play, close range poachers goals, was as clinical as I have seen from the penalty spot and he was absolutely dominant in the air. At a time when Manchester United were developing a habit of scoring late winners, Rivaldo himself was doing the same thing consistantly for Barcelona. He WAS the main man carrying them to their title victories, despite having Figo and Luis Enrique in the team. He won them countless games off his own boot or head. His obvious weaknesses being his lack of defensive ability. But for me what he did in attack more than made up for it. Oh and he could pass as well. But being a clutch goal scorer was his best attribute.

 

Having said that I rate Zidane a great. Smooth is the word. I just don't think he delivered game in game out like some other greats.

 

Dalglish was a better player than Zidane in my opinion- ergo fact.

 

Maradonna is the greatest of all.

 

Pele will always be poo in my mind cos he only ever played to a high standard every four summers. rest of teh time he was prancing around America having a piss easy time of things.

Just wanted to add that not many people know that Pele did play and dominate in the Brazilian League with Santos. He scored over 1000 goals. Most people would say that it is only Brazil, not a big European League. What they would be forgetting is that, at that time, when Brazil had great players falling out of its arse like diarrhea, even more so than they do now, all those players stayed in Brazil. Meaning the league at the time was every bit as good as leagues like Spain and Italy. Santos even smacked just about every European team they played albeit mostly in friendly matches including the likes of AC Milan.

 

One other thing, Pele was not an out and out striker. He was a player that played anywhere, midfield, defense, even as a goal keeper, in addition to where he played for Brazil. He was a great playmaker, and even decent defensively. It was just that Brazil needed him to play as an out and out striker, because they had others to fill the roles he might have played. Hence it was the only time the world got to see him play, he is therefore branded as simply a goal poacher, when he was far FAR more. He certainly wasn't prancing around America either, at least not until his later years.

[Big Ig]

Watching him and all his skills made me hate Houllier even more for his disgusting brand of football. We then had the Zidanny Murphy debacle - which infuriated me even more.

You've definitely got something wrong with your brain sonny. Since I've been watching too many medical dramas recently, I'd say you've got a benign tumour on top of your adrenal gland which makes you fly into a rage. A lot. A pparently.

[Jose Jones]

:D :D :D

 

Zidane has been a great player' date=' But to be honest, I think he's over rated too. Certainly not THE greatest as some have deemed him.

 

I'm not necessarily putting them in the greatest bracket, but I'd rather have watched the sublime skills and more effective and productive end product of the masterful Zola or Dennis Bergkamp. Only last week, we saw Bergkamp can still turn it on, playing the intelligent pass and scoring a beautifully placed goal, with that trademark no-backlift kick.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm far from an Arsenal fan, but I just admire master craftsmen and artistry. Arsenal have been extremely lucky to have had two

of the best at the peak of their careers, overlapping for so long.

 

At the time Zola was at Chelsea, I'd have loved to see him rewarded with a title at that time. It wouldn't have been for any love of them, but only as an option other than the manure. Despite Ken Bates being there at the time, and being such a twat, he's still nowhere near as bad as the combined force of the maureen-kenyon-abramobitch axis of evil.[/quote']

 

No way man, Zidane was much better than Bergkamp or Zola. Both great players, but not a patch on Zizou.

And this:

At the time Zola was at Chelsea, I'd have loved to see him rewarded with a title at that time

is one of the most bizarre comments of all time. Whathefuh?

[RedKnight]

Rob Jones was world class. One of the greats.

[Neil G]

Zidane isn’t the best player I’ve ever seen, that’s a toss-up between Maradona and Ronaldinho. However he is my favourite non-LFC player in all that time. He has one of the best football brains I can think of, right up there with Kenny, his choice of pass is always spot-on. Of his immediate contemporaries I’d say only Rivaldo was more technically gifted, but unlike him Zidane was a complete team player. His role in Euro 2000 was for me just as big a tournament-winning performance as Maradona’s in 86.

 

Off the pitch too he seems like a true gent, and he is a fantastic role model for kids in France and a figurehead for race relations there. I’m privileged that I got to see him play live, for France at Wembley when he completely bossed the midfield and made Redknapp and Ince look like pub players.

[lifetime fan]

Quality player but in that second tier of brilliant players (Van Basten, Gullit, Nedved etc) below those who can be described as genius (Marradona, Pele, Cruyff etc)

 

Thems the facts.

[Jose Jones]

Quality player but in that second tier of brilliant players (Van Basten, Gullit, Nedved etc) below those who can be described as genius (Marradona, Pele, Cruyff etc)

 

Thems the facts.

 

 

Not that I saw that much of Cruyff, but I'd put Zidane up with him. But behind Maradona.

[sh#t waffle]

Quality player but in that second tier of brilliant players (Van Basten, Gullit, Nedved etc) below those who can be described as genius (Marradona, Pele, Cruyff etc)

 

Thems the facts.

Exactly what I think. The best of the not quite best. Still owns property in the area, doesn't he?

[Spanish_fan]

Quality player but in that second tier of brilliant players (Van Basten, Gullit, Nedved etc) below those who can be described as genius (Marradona, Pele, Cruyff etc)

 

Thems the facts.

 

Technique alone, Zidane was miles better than the players you put in his bracket.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/results?search=zidane&search_type=search_videos

 

 

If you find any goals and skills like these from those players, please let me know. I would alse argue that Zidane was tecnhically a better player than Cruyff. Cruyff had that turn of pace that helped him beat defenders in an era were there wasn't many fast players around. Only Maradona had a similar level of technique, and all down to his left foot (his right foot was just decent) On the other hand Zidane could pick a player 40 yards out with any feet, either using the inside or outside of his foot. His ball control was unbelieveble.

[sh#t waffle]

Technique alone, Zidane was miles better than the players you put in his bracket.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/results?search=zidane&search_type=search_videos

 

 

If you find any goals and skills like these from those players, please let me know. I would alse argue that Zidane was tecnhically a better player than Cruyff. Cruyff had that turn of pace that helped him beat defenders in an era were there wasn't many fast players around. Only Maradona had a similar level of technique, and all down to his left foot (his right foot was just decent) On the other hand Zidane could pick a player 40 yards out with any feet, either using the inside or outside of his foot. His ball control was unbelieveble.

But Cruyff invented that turn. I think it was called the 'turn that couldn't slow down'.