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Should the UK remain a member of the EU

  

281 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the UK remain a member of the EU

    • Yes
      226
    • No
      55


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1 minute ago, rico1304 said:

Piece of piss. Just get a plan.  Don’t know why anyone is worried, we’ll have a plan.  

That's Boss's post you're quoting mate. I agree with you

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9 hours ago, Boss said:

No deal is actually a better deal than May's deal. At least with a No deal Brexit we can forge tariff free trade deals with countries outside the EU. We have clarity over the fact we've left, so there isn't this 20__ stuff written into the agreement that causes us to be a vessel state impertuity. All member states have to agree for us to leave, and a blind man can see that's not going to happen.

 

The inevitable stock market crash (caused by speculation) will take place and then we set up a plan in earnest to bounce back as quickly as possible. Otherwise there's just constant uncertainty for years. We don't have Sovereignty because of the Backstop. We don't have strong borders because of the Backstop. Illegal immigration will increase in numbers, again, because of the Backstop. We're still bound to most of the EU's laws and directives, which defeats the whole point of leaving, and we have no means to vote on these laws because we've vetoed our right to do so.

 

If Labour veto the possibility of a No Deal Brexit they are basically consigning the country to a far worse fate long term. They are taking off the table the only negotiating tactic we have to acquire an improved deal from the EU. 

Say South Korea for example are negotiating a trade deal with the EU and a separate one with Britain, who do you think will get the best deal?  

 

If you invent a revolutionary new bicycle pump and Halfords say they will stock it but not if you agree to also sell it to Jimmy's Independent Corner Shop. What you going to do? Now imagine Halfords are the EU and Britain is the corner shop. It may very well have been the best corner shop in the world 100 years ago but that won't put bread on the table now and it certainly won't give access to 27 countries. 

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1 hour ago, rico1304 said:

I didn’t think they had.  I’m amazed only one other person picked up on it though.  Blatantly dishonest.  Anyone else pulling a trick like that would get hammered. 

I quoted something without checking the source. I came back to caveat my original post, but a couple of people had already queried it.

 

The gist of what I read (but not properly sourced) is what Tyler D says - that the EU won't negotiate anymore around May's "red lines", but would be willing to negotiate with a new Government with a new set of parameters. 

 

No biggie.

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12 hours ago, Boss said:

No deal is actually a better deal than May's deal. 

Much as I like you Boss, I can't believe people have let this slide. No deal is as bad as it gets. The May deal is shite obviously but it is still better than no deal at all. 

 

Remain > Maybot deal > no deal

 

As in degrees of harm. 

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15 minutes ago, cloggypop said:

Much as I like you Boss, I can't believe people have let this slide. No deal is as bad as it gets. The May deal is shite obviously but it is still better than no deal at all. 

 

Remain > Maybot deal > no deal

 

As in degrees of harm. 

 

I like you too cloggy mate. May's deal is worse. From what i'm aware, the backstop means the whole of the UK stays within the Customs Union to prevent constant checks at the Irish border. This means all imports of non-EU goods incur a tariff based on what they are or where they come from. It's called the Common Customs Tariff, and it's non negotiable. It destroys any possibility of free trade deals being struck with the likes of America, China or anywhere outside of the EU. It kills us. 

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1 hour ago, Boss said:

 

I like you too cloggy mate. May's deal is worse. From what i'm aware, the backstop means the whole of the UK stays within the Customs Union to prevent constant checks at the Irish border. This means all imports of non-EU goods incur a tariff based on what they are or where they come from. It's called the Common Customs Tariff, and it's non negotiable. It destroys any possibility of free trade deals being struck with the likes of America, China or anywhere outside of the EU. It kills us. 

Being in the Common Customs Tariff is actually the best thing for the UK.  What with the EU being the UK's biggest export market by far. 

 

Likewise, the best trade deals the UK can get is going to be as part of the EU. 

 

No big country is going to care to have a free trade deal with the UK.  They are all likely to be one-sided in favour of the country with the clout.  The UK would have to accept shit like chemically enhanced chicken from the US, massively long patent extensions on medicines manufactured in the US, dodgy milk powder from China, etc. in order to get anything through the door.  

 

The EU is a big enough bloc - the largest single market in the world - to be able to negotiate better deals. The UK on it's own would get massively fucked. 

 

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1 hour ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

None of that takes into account bendy bananas.. None of it!

JJ has completely dismissed blue passports there. 

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7 hours ago, Jose Jones said:

Being in the Common Customs Tariff is actually the best thing for the UK.  What with the EU being the UK's biggest export market by far. 

 

Likewise, the best trade deals the UK can get is going to be as part of the EU. 

 

No big country is going to care to have a free trade deal with the UK.  They are all likely to be one-sided in favour of the country with the clout.  The UK would have to accept shit like chemically enhanced chicken from the US, massively long patent extensions on medicines manufactured in the US, dodgy milk powder from China, etc. in order to get anything through the door.  

 

The EU is a big enough bloc - the largest single market in the world - to be able to negotiate better deals. The UK on it's own would get massively fucked. 

 

 

Have you ever had meat in America? It's the best tasting meat in the world, and yes they use things like HGH to make the cows grow massive. However, I don't think a country that caused Mad Cow Disease by feeding it's own livestock the dead bodies of it's own species has the right to cast judgement on such matters, especially when it comes to rearing livestock.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Boss said:

 

Have you ever had meat in America? It's the best tasting meat in the world, and yes they use things like HGH to make the cows grow massive. However, I don't think a country that caused Mad Cow Disease by feeding it's own livestock the dead bodies of it's own species has the right to cast judgement on such matters, especially when it comes to rearing livestock.

 

 

Humans are becoming more resistant to antibiotics but you're happy to have our foodchain chock full of the stuff? 

 

Mental.

 

Leave voters are disappearing down the rabbit hole quicker than Alice here.

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8 minutes ago, skend04 said:

Humans are becoming more resistant to antibiotics but you're happy to have our foodchain chock full of the stuff? 

 

Mental.

 

Leave voters are disappearing down the rabbit hole quicker than Alice here.

I'm sorry to tell you this, because you're seemingly unaware, but UK meat has antibiotics in it, as well as pesticides, fungicides and herbicides. 

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3 minutes ago, Boss said:

I'm sorry to tell you this, because you're seemingly unaware, but UK meat has antibiotics in it, as well as pesticides, fungicides and herbicides. 

US levels of antibiotics in their products are 5 times more than here. Something like 70% of antibiotics produced in America are pumped into their livestock. 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, skend04 said:

US levels of antibiotics in their products are 5 times more than here. Something like 70% of antibiotics produced in America are pumped into their livestock. 

 

 

 

Okay, but what are you concerned about here? You say human beings are growing resilient to antibiotics - which is true - but what does that lead to? superbugs like MRSA, right? But you can't contract MRSA from eating meat. MRSA is to do with the hygiene procedures in hospitals. So, my question is, what are the antibiotics in meat doing to the human body that you find specifically egregious? 

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I lived in the UK during the mad cow period of the late 80s.

 

Cheap steak and lashings of it.

 

It was nirvana.

 

And perhaps, goes some way to explaining my madness.

 

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No disrespect to any Americans, but when it comes to safety and health regulations, if the choice is between morphing into the 51st State or agreeing to Europe's rules, then stick a baguette up my arse and call me René. 

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So to summarise, the UK shouldn't fear a no deal exit because America has delicious burgers.

 

This is certainly a novel and unique perspective on Brexit.

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1 hour ago, Boss said:

 

Okay, but what are you concerned about here? You say human beings are growing resilient to antibiotics - which is true - but what does that lead to? superbugs like MRSA, right? But you can't contract MRSA from eating meat. MRSA is to do with the hygiene procedures in hospitals. So, my question is, what are the antibiotics in meat doing to the human body that you find specifically egregious? 

https://www.wired.com/story/farm-antibiotics-human-illness-hidden-link/

 

In brief, this is a report on a study that was carried out over several years in America which is showing direct links between the antibiotics used, the animal they were used on and the presence of bacteria in the person that ate that animal. 

 

There's also incidents of e.coli in animal manure finding its way into plant based foods like spinach.

 

In fact according to a study commissioned by the NHS 70% of papers agree on a link between antibiotic use and infections in humans. In Europe, countries like the Netherlands and Denmark decided to reduce or ban the use of antibiotics after growing incidences of MRSA infections in humans caused by being in contact with animals but in America the use grows unabated.

 

So, what I find egregious is that American agribusiness promotes antibiotic use in the face of growing evidence of the effect on people and animals, and leave voters are now promoting urinary tract infections as one of the unicorns of a no deal.

 

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5 minutes ago, skend04 said:

https://www.wired.com/story/farm-antibiotics-human-illness-hidden-link/

 

In brief, this is a report on a study that was carried out over several years in America which is showing direct links between the antibiotics used, the animal they were used on and the presence of bacteria in the person that ate that animal. 

 

There's also incidents of e.coli in animal manure finding its way into plant based foods like spinach.

 

In fact according to a study commissioned by the NHS 70% of papers agree on a link between antibiotic use and infections in humans. In Europe, countries like the Netherlands and Denmark decided to reduce or ban the use of antibiotics after growing incidences of MRSA infections in humans caused by being in contact with animals but in America the use grows unabated.

 

So, what I find egregious is that American agribusiness promotes antibiotic use in the face of growing evidence of the effect on people and animals, and leave voters are now promoting urinary tract infections as one of the unicorns of a no deal.

 

 

So the study you've posted deals with E coli samples from raw meat, and tests the bacterial strains resistance to antibiotics, yeah? Yet we know E coli is destroyed at 160 degrees Fahrenheit, so square that circle genius. 

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1 hour ago, Boss said:

 

Okay, but what are you concerned about here? You say human beings are growing resilient to antibiotics - which is true - but what does that lead to? superbugs like MRSA, right? But you can't contract MRSA from eating meat. MRSA is to do with the hygiene procedures in hospitals. So, my question is, what are the antibiotics in meat doing to the human body that you find specifically egregious? 

Here you go. 

https://www.nhs.uk/news/medication/antibiotic-use-in-farm-animals-threatens-human-health/

 

 

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