The McCanns...

[JohnnyH]

22 minutes ago, Anubis said:

 

Apologies for the delay in replying but work intervened.

 

I have said what I think about the case a long time ago, but possibly not on this thread as there have been several. As you may not have read it I'll quickly say that I think Madeline died accidentally in the apartment after she'd been left alone, and that the McCann's and the others present acted to cover that up, both in terms of what happened on the evening and the rather aggressive PR campaign since.

 

I reached that conclusion based on reading the case file which the Portuguese police have previously made available on the internet.  I do not, and have never subscribed to any theory that they murdered her or killed her, or they are part of some paedophile ring or any such nonsense.

 

As for their culpability for leaving her, well they have worked very hard to control the narrative from day one and their PR operation has been very good at shutting down criticism that I do think most other families would have faced.

 

However, other than setting out the above I've never been particularly vocal about that. If I can be accused of being vocal, on this thread, its my criticism of the continued funding of a specific group of officers to investigate the case. By all means continue to investigate it as part of a cold case unit or missing persons unit, but to dedicate a team of officers doesn't sit well with me unless all missing children cases get the same treatment.

 

It seems to me that every few years we get a flurry of excitement and are told about a new suspect (wasn't it some burglar a couple of years ago?) or witness, only for it all to die away. Now we have a suspect who is hardly new as he's been on the suspect list for at least a year, and we still don't seem any further on. For all the furore over the recent media reports, it now transpires that the German police have not written to the McCann's stating she is dead. I'm also a bit cynical that it tends to be around the time further funding is required. So yes, I've been vocal about that.

 

That all seems reasoned and not abusive or snidey. Obviously the police reports didn't have enough to arrive at a conclusive decision like you did or they'd have been arrested (and no, for anyone else, they didn't NOT get arrested because they're middle class....). I'd probably say that covering it up would be extremely hard.  Experienced hitmen and planned murderers have struggled to hide bodies over the years, so not sure how a few lay people could do it in a busy holiday resort.  But it's a hypothesis. One I think kind of falls apart under scrutiny regarding the cover-up.  

 

I think they have been slaughtered for leaving the child alone. But even for papers at some point they can't make headlines out of the same part of the issue. The story is now all about sightings or new suspects so they are not re-telling the story as they don't need to because everyone knows it.  But just look at the messages under a news story that appears on twitter.  It's a cesspit.  

 

[Anubis]

2 minutes ago, JohnnyH said:

 

Experienced hitmen and planned murderers have struggled to hide bodies over the years, so not sure how a few lay people could do it in a busy holiday resort.  But it's a hypothesis. One I think kind of falls apart under scrutiny regarding the cover-up.    

 

 

Yes. I'm quite sure there are no undiscovered bodies out there in the world. None whatsoever.

[Rick Sanchez C-137]

16 minutes ago, Anubis said:

 

Yes. I'm quite sure there are no undiscovered bodies out there in the world. None whatsoever.

 

He's not suggesting it's impossible, as I'm sure you know, but the theory that two middle class parents (as opposed to hardened criminals or hitmen) who just found their child dead after an accident managed to pull it off on a whim, in a panic, is a little hard to believe.

[JohnnyH]

21 minutes ago, Anubis said:

 

Yes. I'm quite sure there are no undiscovered bodies out there in the world. None whatsoever.

 

5 minutes ago, Aw Geez said:

 

He's not suggesting it's impossible, as I'm sure you know, but the theory that two middle class parents (as opposed to hardened criminals or hitmen) who just found their child dead after an accident managed to pull it off on a whim, in a panic, is a little hard to believe.

Asked and answered.

 

Although I should add I'm not looking to get into the debate of the girls probable death.  I think every base has been covered.

[Rico1304]

5 minutes ago, Aw Geez said:

 

He's not suggesting it's impossible, as I'm sure you know, but the theory that two middle class parents (as opposed to hardened criminals or hitmen) who just found their child dead after an accident managed to pull it off on a whim, in a panic, is a little hard to believe.

In a foreign country, in the evening, with police crawling all over a couple of hours later. 

[Anubis]

Neither am I. We’ll leave it there.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

1 hour ago, JohnnyH said:

 

I think we'd probably all be surprised how many parents have left kids alone to do something at some point. And if some murderous paedophile is watching and looking for a chance to grab a kid, they'll probably get them at some point.  Now having said that, what they did was absolutely wrong by any measurement.  But the punishment does not fit the crime.  And without said child abductor, the crime simply doesn't happen. That is the person everyone needs to be fixated with.  

 

I can only speak for myself and I have never done that. If possible you don’t give the abductor any chance but we know it only takes a second. 

[SasaS]

Maybe some paedophile necrophiliac snatched the body after the accident?

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

10 minutes ago, SasaS said:

Maybe some paedophile necrophiliac snatched the body after the accident?

 

 

Was Jimmy Saville in the Algarve at the time?

[Rico1304]

27 minutes ago, SasaS said:

Maybe some paedophile necrophiliac snatched the body after the accident?

 

 

Was he out walking his cadaver puppy? 

[Barrington Womble]

4 hours ago, JohnnyH said:

Your first paragraph I completely disagree with. I think when any kid has gone missing, the headlines have been about finding the kid. Even that awful woman who hid her daughter under her brothers bed got immediate positive headlines. I googled Shannon Matthews and it’s all the S*n headlines so I’m not going to post them. But all positive. 

Next, and the bit I’ve highlighted. Nobody has any idea where the kid is because some evil fucker has taken her and probably murdered her.  Yes, the parents played a part in leaving her by herself. But without Mr Murdering probably paedo, the kid is fine. You’re victim blaming. 

 

If you find it strange that I’m “upset at the mean spirit of people on a forum” then fine. It’s just empathy. It’ll happen again when I see people acting like cunts. 

Finally, you’ve based your whole narrative around the idea they are getting an easy ride. I absolutely disagree with that. So I disagree with your post. 

So the crux is that final paragraph. I think they've had an easy time for people who chose to leave their kids. I have to be honest and say I don't recall the Shannon Matthews crime, so I can't compare. But I don't think we'll ever agree.

 

Finally, with regards the evil fucker, you're making an assumption someone other than her parents took her. I think it's equally as likely that the parents are involved as not. It might have been an evil fucker. It could have been parents who fucked up. I don't think we'll ever know unless they find the body or someone confesses. I certainly don't think we can read any more into these announcements from the German police than we could when the Portuguese police made the McCann's suspects. 

[Bjornebye]

8 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

So the crux is that final paragraph. I think they've had an easy time for people who chose to leave their kids. I have to be honest and say I don't recall the Shannon Matthews crime, so I can't compare. But I don't think we'll ever agree.

 

Finally, with regards the evil fucker, you're making an assumption someone other than her parents took her. I think it's equally as likely that the parents are involved as not. It might have been an evil fucker. It could have been parents who fucked up. I don't think we'll ever know unless they find the body or someone confesses. I certainly don't think we can read any more into these announcements from the German police than we could when the Portuguese police made the McCann's suspects. 

She got someone to hide her daughter under their bed so they could claim and share the reward money. Went on telly pleading for her to be found etc. From a council estate. Got sent down for a good few years and rightly so. Christ I forgot how shocking it was until I typed that. 

[Barrington Womble]

3 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

She got someone to hide her daughter under their bed so they could claim and share the reward money. Went on telly pleading for her to be found etc. From a council estate. Got sent down for a good few years and rightly so. Christ I forgot how shocking it was until I typed that. 

I vaguely remember that now you describe it. I've just googled it. I was partially living in Geneva at that time, which explains why it's probably passed me by. 

[Bjornebye]

11 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

I vaguely remember that now you describe it. I've just googled it. I was partially living in Geneva at that time, which explains why it's probably passed me by. 

Convenient.... 

[Bobby Hundreds]

The sheer lack of imagination to hide somebody under the bed.

 

Hide the bed aswell!

 

 

 

 

[KMD7]

8 hours ago, Rico1304 said:

So they were at least involved in a cover-up of her death and since then they’ve spent 13 years managing a media campaign to put them in a good light, lobbying for the investigation to continue all whilst hoping they wouldn’t be found out?  Seems perfectly logical.  
 

And, that no one involved has ever cracked, got pissed and let it slip, found god or any of the million reasons why no fucker can ever keep a secret. Ever. 

This is what i went back to when I weighed it up. Imo they couldn't all keep up the pretence over the 13 years or so without slipping up. I just can't see it being possible to the point of it being ludicrous to even think it could be.

[Bjornebye]

TK shagged Kate McCann. Thats my analysis for today. Ill be back tomorrow to either try and rationalise or argue with one of the two gemini. 

[Josef Svejk]

12 hours ago, Anubis said:

 

Yes. I'm quite sure there are no undiscovered bodies out there in the world. None whatsoever.

[Rico1304]

5 hours ago, Josef Svejk said:

That was a planned ‘kidnap’ and criminal conspiracy. This is a load of people on holiday that go from having a meal to covering up for the death of a child in the blink of an eye. Everyone agrees immediately, everyone keeps quiet for 13 years and they hide the child so well that the police forces of at least 2 countries can find no evidence of her. It’s just completely implausible. 
 

We’ve admitted over the years to being a group of degenerate reprobates. Do you think anyone here would spontaneously agree to covering up the death of a child and keep it quiet for 13 years?  Fuckers on here flounce because of the most minimal perceived slight by complete strangers.  You are asking me to believe these lot have never flinched under this enormous pressure. Bollocks.  
 

And the idea it’s throwing money away because other missing victims don’t get the same treatment. Sour grapes and jealousy. 
 

[YorkshireRed]

14 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

She got someone to hide her daughter under their bed so they could claim and share the reward money. Went on telly pleading for her to be found etc. From a council estate. Got sent down for a good few years and rightly so. Christ I forgot how shocking it was until I typed that. 

Fifteen minutes drive from me where this happened. Only a few miles between this and where Jo Cox was murdered as well.

 

Extreme events but much of the attitudes and many of the views aren’t that far below the surface in these parts. I guess that’s the same in many other places of though.

 

Depressing state of affairs. 

[Bjornebye]

42 minutes ago, YorkshireRed said:

Fifteen minutes drive from me where this happened. Only a few miles between this and where Jo Cox was murdered as well.

 

Extreme events but much of the attitudes and many of the views aren’t that far below the surface in these parts. I guess that’s the same in many other places of though.

 

Depressing state of affairs. 

I know this is a sad thread discussing sad things but why doesn't this surprise me? 

[Barrington Womble]

1 hour ago, Rico1304 said:

That was a planned ‘kidnap’ and criminal conspiracy. This is a load of people on holiday that go from having a meal to covering up for the death of a child in the blink of an eye. Everyone agrees immediately, everyone keeps quiet for 13 years and they hide the child so well that the police forces of at least 2 countries can find no evidence of her. It’s just completely implausible. 
 

We’ve admitted over the years to being a group of degenerate reprobates. Do you think anyone here would spontaneously agree to covering up the death of a child and keep it quiet for 13 years?  Fuckers on here flounce because of the most minimal perceived slight by complete strangers.  You are asking me to believe these lot have never flinched under this enormous pressure. Bollocks.  
 

And the idea it’s throwing money away because other missing victims don’t get the same treatment. Sour grapes and jealousy. 
 

Who's everyone? It only needs 2 people, maybe even 1, it's more than plausible whatever happened if it was the parents it was just one of them. It certainly does not to have to include the tapas group of mates. 

[Rico1304]

10 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

Who's everyone? It only needs 2 people, maybe even 1, it's more than plausible whatever happened if it was the parents it was just one of them. It certainly does not to have to include the tapas group of mates. 

Because they all said they were together eating a meal at the time. If one of them had disappeared for the length of time it took to hide a body it’d have been noticed. I’d hope that the police had searched all toddler sized holes within a couple of mins of the apartment. They’ve had 13 years. 
 

plus, as well as the police you've has private detectives, newspapers, tv shows all searching for what would be one of the biggest scoops in the last 20 years.  Nothing.  

[Barrington Womble]

7 minutes ago, Rico1304 said:

Because they all said they were together eating a meal at the time. If one of them had disappeared for the length of time it took to hide a body it’d have been noticed. I’d hope that the police had searched all toddler sized holes within a couple of mins of the apartment. They’ve had 13 years. 
 

plus, as well as the police you've has private detectives, newspapers, tv shows all searching for what would be one of the biggest scoops in the last 20 years.  Nothing.  

You talk like there's never been an unsolved murder or lost child. This crime was mismanaged by the police from the outset. They didn't even preserve the crime scene. The simple truth as I posted earlier, unless they find the body or someone confesses, we will never know who did it, because pretty much any case will be circumstantial otherwise. The McCann's are as likely suspects as anyone else. It doesn't need a conspiracy to hold, it just needed one or the both of them to hold their nerve. We can't even be sure whatever happened didn't happen at during the meal and the statements from the tapas crowd were inconsistent. Literally anything could and did happen. 

[VladimirIlyich]

22 hours ago, Josef Svejk said:

I haven't been following this closely. But is there any reason to suppose this creepy German fucker did it apart from the fact that he's a creepy German fucker who was in the area at the time?

Not a nice way to speak about Pistonbroke.