PODCAST: Manchester United 2 Liverpool 2 - Match Reaction

[tlw content]

Another game where the Reds completely battered a sorry Manchester United side, but criminally failed to win. That's three times now, with this one potentially the most damaging of all as top spot has been relinquished to Arsenal.

 

TLW Editor Dave Usher is joined by Paul Natton and Stu Montagu to look back - mostly in anger - at a wasteful display that may prove to have dire consequences in the chase for the title.

 

 

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[KMD7]

This must have been a hard one to make. Fair play for putting it up so quickly. 

[dave u]

It was. Didn't want to do it, not looking forward to writing the report. Might just copy and paste the FA Cup one.

[Kevin D]

Was surprised to hear two of you saying that you were angrier here than the cup match. 
 

Last month was way worse, I was fuming about that for weeks. 

[HazelyCosmicJove]

Away games against teams in top half of the table:

Played 7, Won 1, Draw 4, Lost 2, GD -2 Pts 7.

We still have to go to Villa and West Ham.

City and Arsenal  also have two of these games to play, they have picked up 11pts and 9pts respectively.

[The Midnight Rambler]

Fair fucks lads. Must be hard enough for Dave to just write the description of the pod we see on Spotify, let alone talk about it for an hour. I did enjoy what you said about Suarez and what he would’ve done to that defence. Must be impossible to calculate your love for Luis, when you add up how much you stick up for Darwin. 

 

One thing on Atalanta, they knocked out our new boys Sporting CP out in the last round. 

[Bobby Hundreds]

We can win the league, we won't but we can. There will be at the very least 2 more games we drop points in. We will dominate them, have more possession probably after poor starts but we will be wasteful and an individual will make a massive fuck up that undoes all our play. It's what we do. We are a good side but with bigger flaws than City or Arsenal.

[Antynwa]

I have also not been this angry in a long time, it's everything

 

1. Repeating of the same mistakes as 3 weeks ago

2. Repeating of the same story of previous seasons I.E losing out on the league 

 

I know we haven't lost out yet but we've been here before, you can't drop points you just can't. I know it's Arsenal as well this time but both City and Arsenal look ruthless. 

[Spy Bee]

Not quite finished the pod yet, but I have woken up this morning with a bit of an epiphany. Roy Keane was talking about 'this' Liverpool team needing to win another title for their legacy, but what is 'this' Liverpool team exactly?

 

Arsenal dropped off at the end of last season and everyone said it was only to be expected, as they'd not been in that position before and you need a season of coming close before you win it. Well, of our starting line-up yesterday, only 3 players (an underpowered Andy Robertson, Virj and Mo) were in our squad last time we won the league. Three more came of the bench, but only Gomez had any real playing time that season, the other to had a combined total of 6 appearances.

 

I think we've got to consider that a lack of experience came into play. In fact, I think it was obvious in the way we played in the final third, and the way we lost our heads for ten minutes or so. I think it will continue to over the next 7 games. I genuinely think we'll finish third.

 

To be slightly more optimistic, over the last 12 months, we have a shite record against Arsenal, but have still accumulated more points than them, meaning that they are significantly not as good against the other teams as we are. So with them already having won 9 out of 10 and having only dropped 2 points, you would expect them to drop points in the coming games.

[Dapower]

Good pod lads under circumstances but we can do it it’s 7 game shoot out well 6 really because we have to be top going into last game otherwise no title 

[UnwelcomeinPeru]

Salah is playing like someone who has been told he's off in the summer. 

[johnsusername]

3 hours ago, Spy Bee said:

Not quite finished the pod yet, but I have woken up this morning with a bit of an epiphany. Roy Keane was talking about 'this' Liverpool team needing to win another title for their legacy, but what is 'this' Liverpool team exactly?

 

Arsenal dropped off at the end of last season and everyone said it was only to be expected, as they'd not been in that position before and you need a season of coming close before you win it. Well, of our starting line-up yesterday, only 3 players (an underpowered Andy Robertson, Virj and Mo) were in our squad last time we won the league. Three more came of the bench, but only Gomez had any real playing time that season, the other to had a combined total of 6 appearances.

 

I think we've got to consider that a lack of experience came into play. In fact, I think it was obvious in the way we played in the final third, and the way we lost our heads for ten minutes or so. I think it will continue to over the next 7 games. I genuinely think we'll finish third.

 

To be slightly more optimistic, over the last 12 months, we have a shite record against Arsenal, but have still accumulated more points than them, meaning that they are significantly not as good against the other teams as we are. So with them already having won 9 out of 10 and having only dropped 2 points, you would expect them to drop points in the coming games.

 

We're great at accumulating points over 12 month periods, unfortunately we've not been able to convert that into league titles.

 

Keane of course is taking out of his arse and every time fails to mention the cheating going on by the club taking the titles which should be ours. And of course none of the other pundits mention it. It's the elephant in the room. 

[JeanMichelFerriacrosstheMersey]

Echo what a lot of people here have said - fair play lads for not only getting the pod out but perfectly summing up the frustration we all feel about that game yesterday. I was in the away end and basically spent all of the half-time break ranting at my mate about the missed chances and how we were definitely going to pay for it in the second half. Was desperate to be proved wrong. Sadly I wasn't. 

 

Spent the car journey home reflecting on Klopp's time as manager of the club and while it's undeniably been the best era I've experienced as a Red it's also been one that's provided me as a supporter with some almighty lows, from the two last-day title deciders, to Paris, to the Covid season ... it's been emotionally exhausting and now here is another period that is incredibly draining and feels like it's going to end in heartbreak. I so wish  could make our minds up as a team and either be balls-out brilliant or totally mediocre - this so-close-yet-so-far thing is doing me over!

 

In all seriousness, I love this manager and I love this team and as horrible as yesterday was, we are right in this title race. Arsenal have momentum and are playing really well but they also have the sharp end of the Champions League to navigate, something their squad has close to zero experience of, as well as tough run in. They WILL drop points. City almost certainly will, too, given they're simply not the team they were last season. But as Paul said on the pod - we need that big emotional moment to truly drive our title hopes; we all hoped it would come at Old Trafford, maybe it'll come at Goodison Park. This generation's Gary Mac moment. Fingers crossed. 

 

 

[rubble-rouser]

I’m angrier than the cup game because we played so much better. In the cup we made virtually no big chances. In the first half here we had 3 or 4 massive chances and we were much more in control than we had been in the cup. 
 

In the cup game they started well and were bang up for it. Yesterday they were limp lettuce and looked like they’d given up.

[No2]

Man City and Arsenal both turn that performance into a 5 nil win. You would say you could play that game 100 times and win 99 only for the fact we know its 98.

[Spy Bee]

Arsenal haven't won at Old Trafford since 2006

[Chris]

Didn't see the game yesterday as one of my best friends was in town (v. early TLW-ers will remember Haje, he helped redesign the forums when we moved from Bravenet and designed one of the first TLW logos) so it was a good excuse to spare myself the misery.

 

So, I can't comment too much.

 

However: "It's not the best result I have ever seen but I am fine with it."

 

The one thing he shouldn't be is "fine with it."

 

Maybe that's why we fail. 

[Chris]

On @Paul's point on the drilling/patterns of play.

 

I think there will still be the drilling there, because why wouldn't it be?

 

I think it's a personnel issue: 

 

Old Mo > Current Mo

Bobby > Nunez

Mane > Diaz

 

[JohnnyH]

1 hour ago, Spy Bee said:

Arsenal haven't won at Old Trafford since 2006

Hard not to see Arsenal racking up the goal difference this time though. 

[lebron]

1 hour ago, Chris said:

On @Paul's point on the drilling/patterns of play.

 

I think there will still be the drilling there, because why wouldn't it be?

 

I think it's a personnel issue: 

 

Old Mo > Current Mo

Bobby > Nunez

Mane > Diaz

 

 

I’d obviously (as would all I assume) have Mane over Diaz and Old Mo over current Mo. The biggest difference maker is Darwin’s lack of game intelligence (and skill) compared to Bobby’s though. For all of Darwin’s threat and pace, he just doesn’t knit our attack together the way Bobby would. No big harm in that, nearly every other forward of the last 20 years would have trouble replicating what he did for our attacking three. Darwin’s unpredictability and poor decision-making makes for a pretty stark contrast though.

[stringvest]

That’s Firmino of four years ago though.  We need a clinical finisher more than anything.  I’d be happy to see Diaz and Nunez go, though if it has to be one, I’d keep Nunez.  It may well be that there is a change in several experienced personnel at the end of the season, so it may not be possible to switch these two out

[DJLJ]

24 hrs on and still as angry as yesterday. Been a very long time since I have been this invested. Was really really hoping to see a hreat sending off of Klopp by the end of the season. Which I don’t think will happen now. 
 

totally inexcusable what happened yeaterday. In total 2 draws and a loss against the worst Utd side I can remember in my 49 years of existence. Just fuck off. 

[Sut]

21 hours ago, dave u said:

It was. Didn't want to do it, not looking forward to writing the report. Might just copy and paste the FA Cup one.

Why not? The team did.

 

Good listen, as always, despite the circumstances.

[TheBitch]

I’d deffo give Dave a pass on not putting out a match report as it’d just get me riled up all over again having to think about that shitfest. 

[No2]

Heard an interesting point yesterday around our butchering of 5v2s. Next time leave a couple a couple behind, too many choices confuses the situation. 3 times this season we have it and not managed to hit the target from one of them.