Would Gerrard and Carragher have made it today?

[Magellan06]

I remember going and watching England under 21s play at bradford. At the time, all the football world was talking about this wonder kid Michael Owen. I started telling every one who would listen 'forget Owen, you should see this kid Gerrard' It was obvious then he was the next LFC captain.

[Red Banjo]

Fucking love Carra me. He's one of those players who people won't really appreciate until he's gone. I always rated him, but didn't love him until Istanbul, and my abiding memory will always be of him stretching to make a tackle and then crying out in pain. Same again in the FA cup against west ham, doubled up with cramp. He's just a fucking warrior, and in a world that has odious creations like Ronaldo doing the rounds, what price on a player who's actually willing to risk his career to keep you in the game? He's basically Rocky to modern football's Tommy Gunn, not the most technically gifted, but he doesn't need to be talked up and re-branded, and he's got where he is through heart. Like LFC as an institution, I suppose you could say.

 

I've included Wikipedia's meaning of the word to sum this up -

 

"

[/quoteIT]Analysis is the process of breaking a complex topic or substance into smaller parts to gain a better understanding of it. The technique has been applied in the study of mathematics and logic since before Aristotle, though analysis as a formal concept is a relatively recent development.

[/quoteIT]"

 

That is quite possibly the greatest analysis of Carra you could possibly have written. Utter reppage

[cochcaer]

Gerrard yes, Carra I'm not sure as were he a youngster now he'd be confront by Skertel and Agger, and I'm not sure there'd be the patience to allow him to develop and learn his trade in the first team.

[Magellan06]

Gerrard was obvious. However, Carra's progression was not some under-the-radar, through gritted teeth and a lot of sweat fluke, either; he was at Lilleshall and therefore considered one of the best 16 boys in the country at his age. The only question mark surrounding Carra is whether John Terry and Rio Ferdinand would have had such fulsome international careers if he had been played in his best position from the outset. People used to go on about Gerrard being damned by his versatility (until Rafa made everyone eat their words by proving his best position is as a forward), but Carra played all over the place for many years as a professional and it almost certainly cost him at least 30 caps, if not many more.

 

That’s part of the problem really; he was at Lileshall as a striker. The years he spent finding his niche were wasted in many ways. But as has been said, a warrior in the true sense; and never any mention of him playing for anyone else.

[RedKnight]

Gerrard is a given and I'd like to think Carra would too. I always liked the look of Carra though, dunno why. That's not as if I'm some great talent spotter though as I loved Steven Wright too and I was gutted when we sold him, I also thought Davie Thommo was better than Gerrard.

[ToxtethTerror]

I don't think Carra would be a given, he was no way as good as Skrtel and Agger are at the same age. Agger is a much more accomplished player than Carra was at the same age.

[PaulMcC]

They both would've made it.

[PaulMcC]

Carra in the 99 season was a better defender than Agger is now.

[gaz181]

I don't think Carra would be a given, he was no way as good as Skrtel and Agger are at the same age. Agger is a much more accomplished player than Carra was at the same age.

 

Can't agree with that. Agger might have caught the eye more with his quality on the ball but Carra had other attributes that were equally as important.

[SpeedyG]

I think both would have to be honest.

 

Gerrard playing against Celta Vigo played a pinpoint 40 yards pass with the outside of his boot and I nearly spat my beer out, he was weak compared to what he is now, but his ability was easy to see.

 

Carragher always looked solid to me, I remember him playing with Ince in the middle against Arsenal and although he lacked the skill you need to play there, he was eager and he had that wide-eyed fire he's still got now. I think he'd always be a cult favorite because of that kind of attitude, even if he only got the odd game, sooner or later he'd have the chance to play the game of his life and would then be hard to drop.

 

The reason people don't rate players like Lucas is actually less about their apparent skill and more about their attitude. Lucas is scared of the ball and, let's face it, plays a bit like a girl. Neither charge could ever have been leveled at these two.

 

That statement surprises me, I've never seen him hide and I'm sure you don't mean to suggest his rapid ball circulation is anything other than one touch pass and move. Do you?

[Tyler Durden]

Can't agree with that. Agger might have caught the eye more with his quality on the ball but Carra had other attributes that were equally as important.

 

For me Carragher's biggest attribute is his reading of the game and that got better as he got older

[philyhamann]

I don't think either of them would get a chance under Benitez.

[Tyler Durden]

Do you ever add anything other then snipe and moan

[JBarnes]

Gerrard would have pissed it, a lot of fans would have been cunts over carra

 

A lot of people were cunts about Carra when he played full back. I remember when Blackburn were interested in him when Souness was in charge and a lot and I mean a lot of fans thought we should have sold him.

[Tyler Durden]

A lot of people were cunts about Carra when he played full back. I remember when Blackburn were interested in him when Souness was in charge and a lot and I mean a lot of fans thought we should have sold him.

 

Did he even make many/any starts under Souness?

[gaz181]

For me Carragher's biggest attribute is his reading of the game and that got better as he got older

 

Agreed, but his positional sense has always been good, and he's always been a good talker!

 

I just think he has always been willing to do the dirty work and managers appreciate that quality. Didn't Houllier say he'd always find a place for Carra in his team.

[philyhamann]

Do you ever add anything other then snipe and moan

 

How am I sniping you fucking dickhead? He hasn't given any of the Academy lads a chance because of reasons other than their ability, so I don't think he'd give Gerrard/Carragher a chance.

 

Do add anything other than blowing the trumpet for the Benitez Defense Force?

[Tyler Durden]

I personally think they both would have made it, Gerrard for obvious reasons and Cara because it wasn't like he wasn't up against it anyway, we used to buy a player for his position every summer. Remember seeing an interview with him and i think (not sure who it was) we had just got Babel in for the position he had just played and he said ''every year I'm told i would lose my place in the team and i still play'' mostly because he was willing to adapt to a new position. Its that type of resilience that would have got him in to any team under ANY manager

[Tyler Durden]

How am I sniping you fucking dickhead? He hasn't given any of the Academy lads a chance because of reasons other than their ability, so I don't think he'd give Gerrard/Carragher a chance.

 

Do add anything other than blowing the trumpet for the Benitez Defense Force?

 

Get on you big bollocks, you dive into every thread with little one liners just like above, the academy lads havent played because they arnt good enough. The only one you could even make a claim for is spearing anyway so its not like there is a fucking tribe of them being blocked from their chance, nugget.

[philyhamann]

Get on you big bollocks, you dive into every thread with little one liners just like above, the academy lads havent played because they arnt good enough. The only one you could even make a claim for is spearing anyway so its not like there is a fucking tribe of them being blocked from their chance, nugget.

 

You would be saying the same about Gerrard and Carragher while they rot in the reserves. I would bet all the money I have that Darby is a more competent right back than both Mascherano and Skrtel.

[Tyler Durden]

You would be saying the same about Gerrard and Carragher while they rot in the reserves. I would bet all the money I have that Darby is a more competent right back than both Mascherano and Skrtel.

 

Well carragher and gerrard arnt so stop using hypothetical points to try and back up your argument. Darby has the build of a girl, thats not to say he is a bad player because i like him but he looks incredibly weak. Why do you think we have had insua building up before he got a proper chance?

Same with El zhar, maybe the manager doesnt like putting them in when they dont appear physically ready, but that cant be proved either way because there arnt enough of these supposed blocked superstars waiting to come in. Thats 2 players out the whole academy/reserves that you are basing your whole 'Benitez wont play locals' argument on despite both them players not looking ready to me.

Edited June 13, 2009 by Tyler Durden

[Hermes]

Reading Gerrards comments on the criticism of Lucas made me think back to when both he and Carragher were starting out and how both players needed time to grow into the incredible players they are today.

 

 

I don't see any relevance with Lucas. He's 22, not a young kid just starting out with the big boys. He is, and will never be anything more than a poor version of Robbie Savage.

[Section_31]

I don't see any relevance with Lucas. He's 22, not a young kid just starting out with the big boys. He is, and will never be anything more than a poor version of Robbie Savage.

 

He's like a gelded Robbie Savage, possessed of the same appearance but completely bereft of any spunk. I reckon if you tried to strangle Lucas he'd close his eyes and put his hands in his pockets.

[SpeedyG]

You would be saying the same about Gerrard and Carragher while they rot in the reserves. I would bet all the money I have that Darby is a more competent right back than both Mascherano and Skrtel.

 

When both Insua and Darby were playing for the reserves you could see Insua was light years ahead of Darby. He is nowhere close to being ready, he's a weakling and he doesn't know how to attack.

 

I think his career will follow a similar pattern to Carraghers, he's a decent one on one defender, so when he develops physically, he'll be a squad player that will fill in in a few different places and if he really works maybe he'll eventually be able, like Carragher, to cement a particular role.

[Hermes]

Did he even make many/any starts under Souness?

 

Not many people have played for Liverpool's first team when they were 15.