Why are we too loyal too our managers?

[old skool tom]

i dont understand how so many of our supporters (and boardroom members) have backed our recent managers like they were shankly and paisley.it was obvious (to some) that both houllier and rafa were to cautious/defensive to win us a title after 3 seasons in charge.

 

supporters (and ex players) who are negative are called mancs and traitors for voicing opinion and concerns.

 

is it simply because of the bond that was forged between shanks and the kop?

 

or is because some of the younger lads on the kop dont know what tactics it needs to win the league and some of the older fellas have forgot what it takes to win the marathon of a championship?

[Zurbaran]

No, It's because with the injuries we have and our defence loosing form. Conceding far to many goals is making me think we're turning into fucking Spurs at the moment. Add to that If he was sacked tomorrow who would we get in? We have no money.

[Carlos Durninio]

Stats and internet forum posturing.

[Acid]

Personally Im loyal to our manager because I think its fucking embarrassing seeing Chelsea get rid of their manager because they could only get 2nd in the league and lose the final of the CL.

 

I've never seen us win the league, and have only been paying proper attention to the stuff off the pitch probably since Istanbul so haven't seen us be anything of a challenging force in the league, so until we actually drop out of the top 4, then we're not dropping below my expectations for us.

[kop]

Continuity. Without patience and continuity we can't achieve continuous improvement. It's what all developement is based on, and luckily our club has a history of acknowledging that fact.

[Herp McDerp]

i dont understand how so many of our supporters (and boardroom members) have backed our recent managers like they were shankly and paisley.it was obvious (to some) that both houllier and rafa were to cautious/defensive to win us a title after 3 seasons in charge.

 

supporters (and ex players) who are negative are called mancs and traitors for voicing opinion and concerns.

 

is it simply because of the bond that was forged between shanks and the kop?

 

or is because some of the younger lads on the kop dont know what tactics it needs to win the league and some of the older fellas have forgot what it takes to win the marathon of a championship?

 

What difference will getting rid of Rafa make? We'll still be in debt, still be skint[(we'd be skinter(yes I know its not a real word) infact as we'd have to pay him and his backroom posse off], still have no new stadium and still have no means of competing financially, so I ask you, what the fuck is the point of getting rid of Rafa?

 

And please don't give me that bollocks about getting the likes of Mourinho in, why would any top manager like Mourinho want to manage a club that's increasingly looking like a sinking vessel? But for the sake of it lets just assume that we do somehow persuade Mourinho to manage us, just where do you think his hyperinflated salary would be drawn from? We'll have Purslow the cunt telling us that the transfer funds were used up to get him to sign the new manager most probably, and that thats how Liverpool Football Club has alway operated.

 

My point is that if we do lose Rafa you can forget about getting any quality manager like Mourinho in, with owners like ours we're far more likely to see the perma-tanned mike sporting, life saving* disco orange step in.

 

 

*like hell thats true, she was prolly blinded by his glow and stumbled back onto the pavement.

[23_Carra_Gold]

It's because we aren't classless cunts who don't appreciate the ammount of pressure and stress being a manager of such a high profile football club takes.

[Herp McDerp]

I also think you raise some very good points about fan's expectations for our club, I grew up supporting a club that seems to specialise in underachieving and shooting itself in the foot over and over again, I've never seen us win the title, never watched us during the glory days, so yes, my standards are invariably going to be lower than those of someone who started supporting us before the 90's rolled around.

[trefoil]

take the two longest standing members of the "big four", Arsenal and Man United, coincidently have the longest serving managers

[Funkasy]

im a young lad and im not used to liverpool football club winning so many things, maybe thats why i dont have so high demand to the manager to pull the ace up his sleve and walk the title home every year or 5 for that matter.

 

+ sacking a manager is rarely the answer, at least not a manager that has given the club so many good memories.

[Ramjet]

i dont understand how so many of our supporters (and boardroom members) have backed our recent managers like they were shankly and paisley.it was obvious (to some) that both houllier and rafa were to cautious/defensive to win us a title after 3 seasons in charge.

 

supporters (and ex players) who are negative are called mancs and traitors for voicing opinion and concerns.

 

is it simply because of the bond that was forged between shanks and the kop?

 

or is because some of the younger lads on the kop dont know what tactics it needs to win the league and some of the older fellas have forgot what it takes to win the marathon of a championship?

 

 

Because we dont want to become Newcastle. By your reckoning we should have sacked Shankly, he had his barren spell too.

[trefoil]

Because we dont want to become Newcastle. By your reckoning we should have sacked Shankly, he had his barren spell too.

 

same with Paisley, once had to publicly ask the fans to stop being bellends and get behind the team, I think we were 5th at the time and went on to win the league (this isnt going off memory like just off history videos and that)

[craigLCF]

I don't believe we are too loyal. I think Evans was given too much time. He was a really good guy who everyone desperately wanted to succeed and in retrospect we kind of shot ourselves in the foot by keeping with him for so long and then with the folly of the joint managers. It was time wasted. However, this is the exception to the rule. I think Houllier was given the correct amount of time. We steadily improved to the point of being runners up in 2002. Then went backwards the following year. This was said to be a blip so he got another year. At the end of this year when we didn't progress any further or challenge we changed to Rafa. This seems like a sensible, rational approach to me. I don't think sacking Rafa is the way forward either.

 

Who's better than Rafa? Arguably Hiddink, Capello, Ferguson. We can't get any of them so it's basically gonna be a pretty wild gamble as to whether a new manager would improve us or not. Our "loyalty" is one of the reasons I love the club as it's a major part of what was "The Liverpool Way." At least before the two clowns took charge anyway. In fact the thought of those twats sacking Rafa and making another appointment is one that would terrify me. The only reason I'm not worried is that it's unlikely they'd want to pay off the rest of his contract.

[Hermes]

The rot has to be stopped and Rafa isn't going to stop it. It's not because of injuries or loss of form. We are losing to teams who have smaller squads than us, less money, you name it they've got less than us.

 

There is something fundamentally wrong with how the team is being managed. We can't defend, there appears to be a lack of motivation and most of the players in the squad are nowhere near the standard required. It isn't going to change without a change of manager, his time is up.

[Red Nick]

Every manager since Souness has been given too much time.

 

That will only apply to Rafa if he is here next season.

[Hermes]

Every manager since Souness has been given too much time.

 

That will only apply to Rafa if he is here next season.

 

So you want him to stay until the end of the season and then sack him?

 

If it's going to be done it has to be done and move on. Why have a lame duck manager?

[Unrighteous]

So you want him to stay until the end of the season and then sack him?

 

If it's going to be done it has to be done and move on. Why have a lame duck manager?

 

I've got to agree with this... Why have a guy in charge who knows that he's doomed? It didn't work for Ramos at Madrid, and it wouldn't work for Rafa, here.

[Red Nick]

So you want him to stay until the end of the season and then sack him?

 

If it's going to be done it has to be done and move on. Why have a lame duck manager?

 

I dont really care there are much bigger issues at the club but as long as he doesnt look like finishing 5th then no point making a change as we cant win fuck all this season anyway.

 

The next two games are vital IMO, if we took 1 point from those 2 then we might have to think about a change now. However the flipside is win them both and 4th looks ok

[Hermes]

I've got to agree with this... Why have a guy in charge who knows that he's doomed? It didn't work for Ramos at Madrid, and it wouldn't work for Rafa, here.

 

Look at Ranieri at Chelsea. He knew he was going and was even accused of throwing the CL semi in Monaco through maverick substitutions.

[craigLCF]

Surely it did work for Ramos and Ranieri though if you look at their performances on a long enough timeline. I can't see how anyone could criticise the job Ramos did at Madrid. He completely turned them around and pushed a Barcelona team all the way to the end which eventually ended up with the most points in La Liga history. He did this from a poor starting point as well as they were quite far behind already before he arrived I think.

 

Also, whilst I agree Ranieri had a total mare in that Monaco semi-final. I think he was progressing well. He reached CL semis and was runner up in the league. He had added Robben and Cech to his squad for the next season and he presumably would have strengthened further in the Summer as well if he'd stayed. He may well have won either the European Cup or the title the next season.

 

Do you not think the fundamental problem at these clubs is their hiring and firing policies? Thing is they have the resources to consistently attract big name managers. We don't have a pot to piss in. Who'd want to be our manager with high expectations and no money to spend?

[old skool tom]

Because we dont want to become Newcastle. By your reckoning we should have sacked Shankly, he had his barren spell too.

 

 

tbf i said recent managers.shankly was given the time because we were in the 2nd division and completely shite.tbh if you ask older supporters,theres an argument that we let him stay on too long before paisley took over? anyway my point is rafa,houlier,evans took over one of the wealthiest and most successfull clubs in england so succes should of been much quicker than when shankly took over because of our much greater financial and pulling power.

[ratcatcher]

I think a manager needs to be given time, there's no doubt about that. However after a number of years when you can see the manager is actually going backwards and is making his team worse than the one he inherited, then, the situation needs to be re evaluated.

 

Even so, Im not in favour of changing managers mid season unless there's some real, pressing need to do so.

[Royal Family]

There' snothing at all wrong with loyalty, and every manager needs to be give time (when managers get sacked after just months in the job, it only confirms that the board made the wrong appointment in the first place!). BUT shouldn't the question be why our managers - rafa and Gerard before him - become more interested in finding excuses and claiming lowered expectations rathe rthan actually spending their time and energy sorting out what has gone wrong. as Henry Winter rightly says in the telegraph, rafa will blame ANYONE and ANYTHING but himself - injuries, referees, senior players. it's all sadly reminiscent the final years of gerard "the wrong type of grass" houllier... Why does the job do this to our managers?

[WaltonRed]

People are making out he's had 5 months and not 5 years.

[Lefti]

Rafa is a top quality manager, although he pissed me off on Saturday, hauling off Torres and then Yossi was just like sending a message out to the players on the pitch that this game doesn't matter, its all about the CL game again Lyon. Now, weather this is to do with off pitch politics with the owners getting on his back saying we need the CL money, however we live for the league and we've lost too much ground already. The Fulham game was ours for the taking and Rafa's substitution policy cost us imo, the two red cards didn't help either but we were a beaten team before either of those.