Was it a penalty?

[Jay86]

What’s one of the dick head refs said on SSN or whatever channel they drag them out on whenever there’s been a controversy. I’ll bet that they’ve said it was a penalty and Klopp and Lovren had no rights to be angry at the end.

 

It was a shitty decision that everyone can see why it was given, it shouldn’t have been but from some angles it looks way worse than it was. Even if it went to a VR system it would have been given because the general feeling around it was everyone else thinks it was a pen, literally everyone I’ve seen talking about it on tv has said it was a defo pen, only Klopp I think has said he doesn’t think it was.

 

Carragher is really playing up to this “I’m semi-neutral” shit at the moment, he mocks and takes the piss whenever we win or do something good but the moment that there’s a 50/50 decision he immediately goes against us, whether that’s sky’s influence on him I don’t know. Giggs and Scholes defend Utd to the hill and I’d expect nothing less even if it winds me up at the time, you defend your own if you can.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Carragher gets on my nerves, has for a while.

[Jay86]

Carragher gets on my nerves, has for a while.

Whenever Stevie’s on BT he doesn’t even pretend to hide that he’s biased, it just gets laughed off by the others on there as if they knew it was coming. BT pundits don’t even try to be neutral, Ferdinand backs Utd at every opportunity, Lampard defends Chelsea, Keown defend Wenger quite a bit even when he doesn’t deserve it, Lineker might aswell wear his Leicester kit on their! Even that Jake Humphries defends Norwich properly whenever he gets the chance. I don’t know what it is about Carra and Neville, they seem so dishonest when criticising their respective clubs, people would have more respect for them if they was honest. It would wind me up at the time if Neville was chatting shit about Utd but afterwards my reaction would be “what do you expect, I’d do the same”.

[Guest Pistonbroke]

Never a penalty. Big game, on the telly, and a referee that couldn't resist the opportunity to show the watching world what a fearless human being he is. 

 

When you look at the incident again I'm sure Pawson was going to red card Lovren n all, he just gave himself a split second as our players approached him and it was probably enough for him to decide red would be taking the piss too far. 

[Guest Pistonbroke]

Carragher gets on my nerves, has for a while.

 

He's a shit pundit at times and talks an awful lot of bollocks. 

[VladimirIlyich]

Yes it was. The view the referee had saw an arm across the back when the lad was travelling at a good rate of knots and over he went. The argument is not with the ref,its with that stupid dickhead of defender of ours who was too close and only needed to keep shepherding the lad away from the goal in the direction he was already travelling. We all accept that Klavan isn't particularly good but at least he isnt as stupid as Lovren. The penalty at Brighton was never a penalty but this one was,but didn't even have to be.

[KMD7]

Yes it was. The view the referee had saw an arm across the back when the lad was travelling at a good rate of knots and over he went. The argument is not with the ref,its with that stupid dickhead of defender of ours who was too close and only needed to keep shepherding the lad away from the goal in the direction he was already travelling. We all accept that Klavan isn't particularly good but at least he isnt as stupid as Lovren. The penalty at Brighton was never a penalty but this one was,but didn't even have to be.

 

Hard to shepherd someone when they literally run into you.  Plus it was a great pass from Rughead into the box in the first place. Shit happens sometime. This is not on Lovren imo.

[Jockey]

I think there would be a lot more said about the penalty had we got that decision. Instead of 'plucky' Everton (you know - the Everton who spent £150m and would challenge). That said - if the interpretation of the law is a 'touch' then, you can't touch. 

 

That it was Lovren (and not Gomez, or Klavan), doesn't help. 

[El Rojo]

Sky ran a pre-match feature of Carra swanning around Melwood like he was still a player or like he owned the place, giving a guided tour effectively, while some of the coaching staff were still around.

 

Then he lays into Klopp, Lovren or whoever afterwards, or if he didn't he will next week.

 

I've no issue with him criticising the manager or players - it's a key part of his new job, but he shouldn't have any more access to the club and its facilities than Jeff Stelling or Gary Neville would.

[Colt Seavers]

Let’s be honest the reason the media think it was a pen is because it was an English player that went down and they have a love in with Fat Sam.

If that was a penalty we may as well go the whole way and just make it a non contact sport

[JustTosh]

It's odd because it seems like almost everyone except Liverpool supporters thought it was a pen. The simple fact is that you can't put your hand on the back of an attacker in the box like that.

 

Correct, Lovren barely touched him but he's played long enough to know cheaters take advantage of stupid behaviour.

 

There seems to be two discussions going on.

 

1. Was it a dive? Yes it was and the ref took the bait.

2. Could Lovren do better? Yes, he shouldn't have his hands on the back of Calvert-Lewin, as that might mislead the ref to believe there was a push.

 

Bad call from the ref and bad defending from Lovren.

[dave u]

This is what is baffling me. Why are people saying he deliberately put his hands on him? His arms are in a natural running position as the lad jumps into him and makes contact. There is no way to avoid it, yet people are talking like Lovren made a conscious decision to put his hands on him.

 

If he'd put his hands up in the air to avoid touching him, there would have been contact anyway and he'd have looked guilty as fuck, as when defenders do that it's usually because they've fouled someone.

 

As I said in the match report, this isn't one of those greay area, debatable calls for me. It's 100% not a pen and I don't think there was anything Lovren could have done to avoid what happened, other than deal with the initial pass better.

[dave u]

And everyone except Liverpool fans are saying its a pen because they want it to be. Everton are being treated like some plucky little lower league team that just pulled off an incredible result against all the odds.

 

I don't give a fuck about any of them, what is wrecking my head is how many of our fans think it was a pen. I'm genuinely staggered by it.

[Gym Beglin]

The question Klopp should have asked back at the report is

"if it was Cahill on Lukaku in a the World Cup group stage next summer, is it still an definite pen".

[A_S]

Morata's goal against Newcastle all of a fortnight ago stood, despite the most blatant hands in the back of an opponent you will ever see.

 

No wonder nobody has a fucking clue anymore when the far bigger push is allowed while the near-incidental contact is punished. The difference between the two is far too great to be dismissed as a slightly different point of view.

[Guest Pistonbroke]

And everyone except Liverpool fans are saying its a pen because they want it to be. Everton are being treated like some plucky little lower league team that just pulled off an incredible result against all the odds.

 

I don't give a fuck about any of them, what is wrecking my head is how many of our fans think it was a pen. I'm genuinely staggered by it.

 

No way was it a penalty, all of us think so agree that the little shit barged into Lovren whilst changing direction to do so and no way can you get out of the way in a split second. It's a natural body movement to raise your arms in defence. 

 

 

On a side note. I watch our matches with German commentary on a streaming portal for sport, none of them thought it was a penalty. 

[El Rojo]

And everyone except Liverpool fans are saying its a pen because they want it to be. Everton are being treated like some plucky little lower league team that just pulled off an incredible result against all the odds.

 

I don't give a fuck about any of them, what is wrecking my head is how many of our fans think it was a pen. I'm genuinely staggered by it.

 

It's the Lovren confirmation bias in full effect, I reckon.

 

Gomez or Matip would get a more sympathetic reception.

 

I agree with you. Never a penalty and Lovren wasn't at fault.

[Gym Beglin]

And everyone except Liverpool fans are saying its a pen because they want it to be. Everton are being treated like some plucky little lower league team that just pulled off an incredible result against all the odds.

 

I don't give a fuck about any of them, what is wrecking my head is how many of our fans think it was a pen. I'm genuinely staggered by it.

 

 

I think that pundits especially should be ashamed of themselves for making a narrative that Allardyce is some guru, and that it's ok for him to reduce a club like Everton to the sort of uber-defensive bollocks that you'd expect from Halifax against Barcelona in a pre-season friendly. 

 

If they want a reason why English football is shite then they need to take a look at themselves and what they're praising. 

 

They just spent £130m in the summer, and have United and England's all-time top scorer up front.  

 

They had 20% possession and had 3 shots against us.

 

Last year in the cup, Plymouth had 23% of possession and 4 shots on goal.

 

 

 

All that aside, it still wasn't a penalty, but knock yourselves out.  We got a point and we're in the knockout stages of the Champions League.

[Dave D]

I take it you didn't see his "Tweet" regarding the champions league draw so?

"Porto it is, decent draw. Let's do this! #UCL #LFC

 

Fans, happy with our draw?

 

As for Lovren. He touched the bitters back. Unfortunately, in today's game, thats a penalty.

 

Uh oh. Bit like touching the stone men in Game Of Thrones.

 

 

 

 

[Jockey]

It's the Lovren confirmation bias in full effect, I reckon.

 

Gomez or Matip would get a more sympathetic reception.

 

I agree with you. Never a penalty and Lovren wasn't at fault.

 

Yep. I think that pretty much nails it. Not just wish us - but media as well, similar to what happened with Mignolet against Leicester 'oh he must have fucked up, that is what he does'!

 

Remember the Ozaki goal? How many people said that Mignolet should have been stronger, it wasn't a foul!  

[VladimirIlyich]

This is what is baffling me. Why are people saying he deliberately put his hands on him? His arms are in a natural running position as the lad jumps into him and makes contact. There is no way to avoid it, yet people are talking like Lovren made a conscious decision to put his hands on him.

 

If he'd put his hands up in the air to avoid touching him, there would have been contact anyway and he'd have looked guilty as fuck, as when defenders do that it's usually because they've fouled someone.

 

As I said in the match report, this isn't one of those greay area, debatable calls for me. It's 100% not a pen and I don't think there was anything Lovren could have done to avoid what happened, other than deal with the initial pass better.

Any coach will tell you that getting your body between ball and goal and showing the player away from goal are key factors as well as the first key factor of pressure on the ball. You are also supposed to be able to see the ball and Lovren was far too close to him to see it. It's just another in his long history of fuck ups and won't be his last either. Those decisions are about 50/50 over time.

[Anubis]

Yes it was. The view the referee had saw an arm across the back when the lad was travelling at a good rate of knots and over he went. The argument is not with the ref,its with that stupid dickhead of defender of ours who was too close and only needed to keep shepherding the lad away from the goal in the direction he was already travelling. We all accept that Klavan isn't particularly good but at least he isnt as stupid as Lovren. The penalty at Brighton was never a penalty but this one was,but didn't even have to be.

 

He jumped into Lovren. All Lovren had was his hands up against his chest guarding himself. This is some serious effort to try and blame Lovren. Fuck it, I'm not a fan of his, but to suggest that was a penalty and he was responsible is laughable.

[JustTosh]

This is what is baffling me. Why are people saying he deliberately put his hands on him? His arms are in a natural running position as the lad jumps into him and makes contact. There is no way to avoid it, yet people are talking like Lovren made a conscious decision to put his hands on him.

 

If he'd put his hands up in the air to avoid touching him, there would have been contact anyway and he'd have looked guilty as fuck, as when defenders do that it's usually because they've fouled someone.

 

As I said in the match report, this isn't one of those greay area, debatable calls for me. It's 100% not a pen and I don't think there was anything Lovren could have done to avoid what happened, other than deal with the initial pass better.

I've had another look at the GIF from the front of the players and I reconsider my view.

 

It was a blatant dive as I've always ment it was.

 

I felt Lovren should keep his hands away from the dirty bas****s back, but now realize it's difficult to have them anywhere else. They are after all attached to his body.

 

Looking at the GIF FA should actually ban the scumbag for his dive.

[moof]

This idea that it’s an automatic penalty if you touch someone in the box is possibly the biggest load of bollocks I’ve ever heard in my life.

[Redder Lurtz]

It's odd because it seems like almost everyone except Liverpool supporters thought it was a pen.

Klopp's comment to that interviewer after the game has resulted in the press pack closing ranks to "protect" one of their own. That's why everyone thinks it was a pen, because you've got bellends like Jim fucking White and Danny Murphy all helping out their "bullied" colleague and telling their mouth-breathing audience that it was a pen. I gather Klopp asked the media afterwards if they thought it was a pen and they all put their hands up and said it was. Anyone who's looked at the vid Dave has posted on the match report can see it was a dive.