Keir Starmer

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 minute ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

Maybe Kier should take inspiration from the legion of Corbynite grifters and just stick his Paypal details on his Twitter.

‘I’m doing this for my family, please help’. I’d give him... nothing, actually, but fuck it, it’s worth a try. 
 

Weird thing is, when somebody calls her out for it she makes a tweet about it, then asks for money straight after. Legendary bullshitting.  

[Duff Man]

9 minutes ago, Numero said:

Yes, I do like evidence though. Im not questioning it, it’s probably true. Did Corbyn return it? Did Corbyn return the thousands he got from that guy who supported terrorism by Hamas? 
 

Wither way, I don’t think Corbyn is responsible for everything a donor says, and I don’t think Starmer is either. I do think it’s hypocritical to talk about one and not the other though, which ha been happening a lot. No doubt if I searched for Ibrahim Hamami on here, it would come up with you picking Corbyn up on it, so I’m talking about others and not you. 

Whoever the leader is, they shouldn't be personally writing to someone like that and asking for donations. If Corbyn did similar I'd have no problem calling it out.

[Strontium]

7 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Is it not just one woman? 

 

Rachael Swindon we all know, so I checked the first two accounts I could think of - Novara Media, and Harry Leslie Smith (whose death has predictably been no obstacle to him posting all the time) - and both have donation links in their bio and pinned tweets.

 

It's a cottage industry.

[Duff Man]

"Maybe the leader of the party should do something that people on Twitter do."

 

Yes, what an excellent and relevant point.

[Numero Veinticinco]

21 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

Whoever the leader is, they shouldn't be personally writing to someone like that and asking for donations. If Corbyn did similar I'd have no problem calling it out.

If he did write to them personally and it wasn’t just a load of letters printed out and signed. Interesting distinction though, you can take their money, like Corbyn did, as long as you didn’t write to them. Fair enough, I guess. I think the problem is a little bigger than one letter. I don’t think I heard of the guy before that article I linked and gave it almost no thought whatsoever. I assume you’ve been on about him for a while and not just no, because that would look like the real issue wasn’t letters or donors. 

[Duff Man]

Well yes the letter is the distinction, isn't it, because it's the leader personally asking someone for donations. A person whose previous donations had to be returned because they weren't lawfully declared, and who has made very questionable comments on his social media about race. There's no equivalence with Corbyn or Milliband, unless they also wrote to him/personally signed off on his donations.

[Numero Veinticinco]

3 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

Well yes the letter is the distinction, isn't it, because it's the leader personally asking someone for donations. A person whose previous donations had to be returned because they weren't lawfully declared, and who has made very questionable comments on his social media about race. There's no equivalence with Corbyn or Milliband, unless they also wrote to him/personally signed off on his donations.

Yeah, it’s clearly the distinction for you because you had no issues with those funding Corbyn who praised terrorism as a legit tactic, or those Hamas supporters creating Corbyn fundraisers. In fact, you had no problem with the same person donating to Corbyn’s Labour. It’s the letters that are the real problem. Not politicians accepting dodgy donations but the letters. 
 

I wonder if any of the characters - all angels I’m sure - from the City and financial organisations that Corbyn ‘chased’ ever did or said anything you disagreed with. I suspect not. I wonder if any of these former donors were David Abraham. 
 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6425629/Jeremy-Corbyn-branded-hypocrite-begging-Blair-era-donors-Labour.html

 

Bottom line from me is that I don’t judge Corbyn as guilty by association - and his associations were a lot more dubious than Dodgy Dave - and I argued it here at the time. I judge Starmer by the same standard. No doubt the party needs these donors badly, because driving away donors in the first place leads to that. Party donations is a dirty business and needs to be cleaned up, and talking about a letter is little to do with the problem and more to do with having a pop at Starmer. Unless, of course, you already brought it up about Corbyn over the passed five years, and criticised his ‘chasing’, at which point I humbly apologise. If not... I think focusing on the issue and not the person is a better use of time. 

[Bjornebye]

53 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

 

It's a cottaging industry.

Surprised you're not all over it then 

[Duff Man]

1 minute ago, Numero said:

Yeah, it’s clearly the distinction for you because you had no issues with those funding Corbyn who praised terrorism as a legit tactic, or those Hamas supporters creating Corbyn fundraisers. In fact, you had no problem with the same person donating to Corbyn’s Labour. It’s the letters that are the real problem. Not politicians accepting dodgy donations but the letters. 
 

I wonder if any of the characters - all angels I’m sure - from the City and financial organisations that Corbyn ‘chased’ ever did or said anything you disagreed with. I suspect not. I wonder if any of these former donors were David Abraham. 
 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6425629/Jeremy-Corbyn-branded-hypocrite-begging-Blair-era-donors-Labour.html

 

Bottom line from me is that I don’t judge Corbyn as guilty by association - and his associations were a lot more dubious than Dodgy Dave - and I argued it here at the time. I judge Starmer by the same standard. No doubt the party needs these donors badly, because driving away donors in the first place leads to that. Party donations is a dirty business and needs to be cleaned up, and talking about a letter is little to do with the problem and more to do with having a pop at Starmer. Unless, of course, you already brought it up about Corbyn over the passed five years, and criticised his ‘chasing’, at which point I humbly apologise. If not... I think focusing on the issue and not the person is a better use of time. 

I mean yes, I would be happy to criticse any leader who chased someone like Abrahams for donations. In this case it's Starmer.

[Numero Veinticinco]

6 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

I mean yes, I would be happy to criticse any leader who chased someone like Abrahams for donations. In this case it's Starmer.

Yes, whilst having no issue with terrorist sympathisers. It’s all about the letters. ‘I don’t care about him donating I care about writing him a letter’. Haha. The corners we hide in, eh? 

[Duff Man]

Just now, Numero said:

Yes, whilst having no issue with terrorist sympathisers. It’s all about the letters. 

You're so weird. It's simply about the current leader asking a man whose previously made an unlawful donation to the party, as well as a series of odd posts about race on his social media, for more donations. I don't think he should do that. You're howling at the moon with the terrorist sympathiser stuff.

[Numero Veinticinco]

10 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

You're so weird. It's simply about the current leader asking a man whose previously made an unlawful donation to the party, as well as a series of odd posts about race on his social media, for more donations. I don't think he should do that. You're howling at the moon with the terrorist sympathiser stuff.

It might seem weird to you to have hypocrisy pointed out, but fuck it; you’re going to have to deal with it. I suspect you give zero fucks about it, having never mentioned it before, never had an issue with the same guy giving Corbyn donations, and not having raised Corbyn’s chasing of pretty dubious, anti-socialist money. You’ve boxed yourself into a corner. Do you honesty give a single fuck about him writing letters to a load of people or are you just regurgitating some shit you read about the last couple of days? I mean, who cares more about letters to donors more than the actual donations? I would be shocked if you actually do. 

[Duff Man]

1 minute ago, Numero said:

It might seem weird to you to have hypocrisy pointed out, but fuck it; you’re going to have to deal with it. I suspect you give zero fucks about it, having never mentioned it before, never had an issue with the same guy giving Corbyn donations, and not having raised Corbyn’s chasing of pretty dubious, anti-socialist money. You’ve boxed yourself into a corner. Do you honesty give a single fuck about him writing letters to a load of people or are you just regurgitating some shit you read about the last couple of days? I mean, who cares more about letters to donors more than the actual donations? I would be shocked if you actually do. 

Someone having an issue with the current leader writing to a man whose previously made an unlawful donation to the party, as well as a series of odd posts about race on his social media, and who in your own words is a "dickhead", is not in any way hypocritical. It also doesn't mean they're cool with terrorist sympathisers.

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Duff Man said:

Someone having an issue with the current leader writing to a man whose previously made an unlawful donation to the party, as well as a series of odd posts about race on his social media, and who in your own words is a "dickhead", is not in any way hypocritical. It also doesn't mean they're cool with terrorist sympathisers.

No. You’re right. That’s not what’s hypocritical. 

[Duff Man]

I didn't have an issue with him donating to the party under Corbyn because I didn't know he was doing so. Did anyone? Regardless, there's still no equivalency with the current leader writing to him and asking for a donation.

[Numero Veinticinco]

2 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

I didn't have an issue with him donating to the party under Corbyn because I didn't know he was doing so. Did anyone? Regardless, there's still no equivalency with the current leader writing to him and asking for a donation.

Nope, it’s the letters you care about. You’ve made that clear. Like I said, an interesting distinction. You know this guy was cleared by police over donations, right? I’m guessing that’s why Corbyn didn’t give a fuck. Though judging by some of the other donations, he probably wouldn’t give a fuck anyway. No other count seems to care, so, I can’t blame him. Can’t really blame Starmer either. 

[Duff Man]

2 minutes ago, Numero said:

Nope, it’s the letters you care about. You’ve made that clear. Like I said, an interesting distinction. You know this guy was cleared by police over donations, right? I’m guessing that’s why Corbyn didn’t give a fuck. Though judging by some of the other donations, he probably wouldn’t give a fuck anyway. No other count seems to care, so, I can’t blame him. Can’t really blame Starmer either. 

Did Corbyn know he was donating? Did anyone?

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Duff Man said:

Did Corbyn know he was donating? Did anyone?

He knew about those giving him money with Hamas supporting tendencies because he spoke about it. No idea if he knew about Abrahams, but he’d long been cleared by then. No need to not take his money. 

[Duff Man]

Well, I wouldn't, just based on that alone, because it still broke Labour's rules. And then of course there's still all the weird posts about race on his social media.

[Numero Veinticinco]

That’s the crux of it. That’s the new thing, it’s to associate Starmer with Islamophobia. There’s just no meat on that bone. Thing is, those attacking Corbyn over antisemitism were 1) competent 2) there was a lot of grey areas with Corbyn they could point to 3) there is a significant amount of hatred in the Labour Party that sometimes seeps out as antisemitism. Those on the left who are hell bend on punishing Starmer for it are 1) generally idiots 2) there is no grey area with Starmer on Muslims 3) the important one, people in the UK generally don’t give a fuck about Muslims. 
 

[Duff Man]

I'm not trying to associate him with Islamophobia, I just don't think he should have written to that person asking for donations, for all the reasons previously stated. I totally agree that nobody gives a fuck about Muslims, though.

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

#NotACult

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Duff Man said:

I'm not trying to associate him with Islamophobia, I just don't think he should have written to that person asking for donations, for all the reasons previously stated. I totally agree that nobody gives a fuck about Muslims, though.

To clarify, I wasn’t saying and didn’t think for a second you were. It’s why this story has come up though. There’s been a couple of things recently. It’s a terrible tactic because it’s essentially only going to convince those who already seem to think he’s Satan’s more evil brother. Others will either see that it’s hideous or actually think ‘one of us, one of us, one of us’. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

Just now, Nelly-Torres said:

#NotACult

Yeah, I’ll tone down the support I just gave him. I don’t want people thinking I’m a Corbynite. Oh, wait, you were meaning the application of standards and logic. Yeah, I’m in that cult. You don’t meet the criteria. 

[Nelly-Szoboszlai]

You say standards, I say excuses. 

You say logic, I say whataboutery. 

 

Let's call the whole thing a thoroughly nice chap, and doesn’t matter what race he is.