Other football

[Strontium]

Nine Euro qualifying games tonight, and not a single home win.

 

Okay, three of the home sides were San Marino, Gibraltar and the Faroes, and one match abandoned due to Serbs being Serbs, but that's still not something you see very often.

[BCM]

Nine Euro qualifying games tonight, and not a single home win.

 

Okay, three of the home sides were San Marino, Gibraltar and the Faroes, and one match abandoned due to Serbs being Serbs, but that's still not something you see very often.

 

Actually it was sparked by the president of Albania's brother who was remote controlling a drone that was flying above the pitch, that had a flag underneath with the albanian flag covering the outline of Kosovo............... Didnt think i would be typing that tonight

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0h9mWv2hqA#t=15

[Jairzinho]

Nine Euro qualifying games tonight, and not a single home win.

 

Okay, three of the home sides were San Marino, Gibraltar and the Faroes, and one match abandoned due to Serbs being Serbs, but that's still not something you see very often.

 

Wait, what?

[Jim MM]

Finbarr Saunders doing match reports on BBC:

 

"The Irish were wasteful in possession, while Aiden McGeady handed a free hole behind lone striker Robbie Keane, was unable to influence affairs."

 

When you're a Liverpool supporter you expect to win all the time, contrary to all logical reason a lot of the time. Anything short of a win is at best disappointing and is usually catastrophic.

 

No such hardship when your national team is Ireland though and sometimes you get to experience the other side of a poxy park the bus spawny result for a change.

[BCM]

[Adebisi]

Just reading up on what happened to Kyle Lafferty after hearing he scored tonight and came across this 
 

"Lafferty is sold as a result of a precise request from my coach Beppe Iachini,"Zamparini told Radio 24.

"He is an out-of-control womaniser, an Irishman without rules. He is someone who disappears for a week and goes on the hunt for women in Milan.

"He has two families with six children, he never trains, and he's completely off the rails. On the field he's a great player, because he gave us everything he had and more.

"In terms of his behaviour, however, he is uncontrollable. My coach told me he cannot sort this player out, so he has to go."

Amusing. He won Palmero's player of the year too. 

[Jairzinho]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/29614980

 

Price of Football: Ticket increases outstrip cost of living

 

The average price of the cheapest tickets across English football has risen at almost twice the rate of the cost of living since 2011.

 

BBC Sport's Price of Football study analysed how much fans are charged at 207 clubs.

 

The average price of the cheapest match-day ticket from the Premier League to League Two is now £21.49.

 

It has increased 13% since 2011, compared to a 6.8% rise in the cost of living.

 

Year-on-year it is up 4.4%, more than treble the 1.2% rate of inflation.

 

Critics of the price hikes said clubs had lost touch with fans and argued that the recent £3.1bn windfall from television rights should have resulted in a drop in ticket prices for supporters.

 

But some clubs, particularly those in the Premier League, point to packed-out stadiums as proof they have got pricing right.

 

The Price of Football is in its fourth year and is the largest study of its kind in Britain, covering 176 clubs across 11 division in British football and 31 clubs from 10 different leagues in Europe.

 

As well as ticket prices, information was gathered about the price of replica shirts, pies, programmes and a cup of tea. For the first time this year Price of Football worked out the cost to supporters for each home goal their team scored.

 

Here are some key findings:

• Arsenal have the most expensive match-day ticket in the Premier League at £97. That's down £29 on last season but still more than double the most expensive match-day ticket at seven other top-flight clubs
• The Gunners also have the most expensive season ticket in the top flight at £2,013, although it includes seven credits for cup competitions. Their cheapest season ticket is £1,014, which is more than 17 Premier League clubs charge for their most expensive one.
• Manchester City have the league's cheapest season ticket at £299. That's cheaper than at 15 Championship clubs, 10 clubs in League One, four in League Two and even one in the Conference.
• Charlton's £150 season ticket is the cheapest in England's top four divisions. However, Barcelona charge around £103 for their lowest-priced season ticket.
• In Scotland's Premiership the average price for the cheapest day out at Premiership matches, including a match-day ticket, pie, cup of tea and a programme, increased by just 61p to £26.95 from last season.

Premier League transfer spending hit a record £835m during the summer window, up from £630m the previous year, boosted by the bumper television deal, which was 70% higher than the previous package.

 

This summer financial analysts Deloitte said Premier League clubs now spend 71p on player wages for every £1 generated, the first time the 70p mark had been broken. Match-day revenue increased by 6% in the Premier League last season to £585m.

 

In addition to the cheapest match-day ticket rise, the average price of the cheapest Premier League season ticket has gone up 8.7% since 2012, from £467.95 to £508.55.

 

Shadow sports minister Clive Efford MP said the "inflation-busting" increases "just cannot be acceptable".

 

"Any business that thinks it can simply rely upon the loyalty of its customers, regardless of how they treat them, in the end will fail. It's an absolute fact," he added.

 

"Therefore I would be asking clubs, 'are your fans happier today than they were five years ago with the experience that they get, the value for money that they feel they're getting?'"

 

The Football Supporters' Federation had called for clubs to use the TV deal to cut ticket prices, saying they could knock about £30 off each ticket and still generate the same revenue.

 

Malcolm Clarke, chairman of the group, said there was "no excuse at all" for the continuing rises.

 

"Three times the rate of inflation is completely unacceptable from an industry that's got megabucks going in at the top," he said.

 

Despite the ticket price rises, Premier League attendances are on the increase. The average last season was 36,695.

 

"For the Premier League and our clubs, keeping the grounds as full as possible is our top priority," said Cathy Long, the Premier League's head of supporter services.

 

"The attendances so far this season are very encouraging, with more than 95% of seats sold and average crowds tracking with last season's, which were the highest in English top-flight football since 1949-50."

 

BBC Sport asked Arsenal for an interview but they declined. Instead, they sent us a statement that read: "Work is continually undertaken to offer tickets at various prices, with the highest match ticket only applicable for five Premier League fixtures in a season.

 

"Across the course of a campaign, we offer up to 300,000 reduced price tickets to adult and junior supporters, from £5 and £10."

 

Queen's Park Rangers chief executive Philip Beard added: "Our pricing structure is very fair and I've never had any significant complaints from any fans."

Dan Roan, BBC sports editor

 

"Two months after fans marched on the Premier League's HQ in protest at rising ticket prices, these findings will only serve to reinforce the sense of an impending divorce - between those at the top of the sport, and the game's traditional audience. The fortunes clubs have made through unprecedented TV deals have not been passed down and used to alleviate the pressure on fans' pockets, and it is easy to see why many now feel English football is becoming more of a middle-class pursuit, exploiting the loyalties of its customers in order to pay players and their agents more and more. The Premier League argues that prices are based on demand, and they make a good point, with attendance rates again at more than 95%. The clubs operate as businesses after all, and have used match-day revenue to improve stadia and attract the best playing talent in a highly competitive market. Some have also made concessions, adopting discount initiatives to help cash-strapped younger fans and away supporters. But many others will still feel the sport they love is gradually leaving them behind."

 

In the Football League, the average cost of the cheapest match-day ticket increased 31.7% in League One and 19% in League Two. In the Championship, the average price has fell 3.2%.

 

Crowds in the Football League increased by 136,000 last season. The Championship had a total audience of more than 9.1m fans, at an average of over 16,500 per match. Only the Premier League (13.9m), Germany's Bundesliga (13.1m) and Spain's La Liga (10m) can boast more fans through the turnstiles in Europe.

 

Football League chief executive Shaun Harvey said: "Season ticket holders are making up an ever greater proportion of the supporter base and account for 10 million of the 15 million admissions to Football League matches each season.

 

"As the study also suggests, a consequence of providing greater value to the majority of fans at one end of the spectrum is that those fans at the other end of the spectrum, those adults paying on the day for a single match, may now find themselves paying a bit more at some clubs."

 

We also contacted clubs in 10 other European countries to find out how prices in Britain compare with those in the Bundesliga, Serie A and La Liga.

 

While some of those clubs sell very cheap match-day tickets, with French side Lille offering one for only £5.87, many charge more than £100 for their most expensive.

 

It is a similar story for season tickets, with AC Milan charging about £163 for their cheapest but almost £3,600 for their most expensive.

 

The Serie A side also have a match ticket that costs about £298.

 

The Bundesliga is often held up as a league that puts fans first by keeping ticket prices low.

The four clubs we contacted - Bayer Leverkusen, Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund and Schalke - all charge less than £13 for their cheapest match-day ticket.

 

Dortmund's commercial director said Arsenal's match-day revenues were impressive but insisted his club would not entertain the idea of charging such large amounts for tickets.

 

"If we were to ask for prices like this, we would lose the people," Carsten Cramer told BBC Sport. "The people are one of the most important assets for our club. We have to care for them."

[Jairzinho]

"Any business that thinks it can simply rely upon the loyalty of its customers, regardless of how they treat them, in the end will fail. It's an absolute fact," he added.

 

This isn't a normal business. If a supermarket is shit, you use a different one. In football, not for me, Clive.

[BCM]

 

"If we were to ask for prices like this, we would lose the people," Carsten Cramer told BBC Sport. "The people are one of the most important assets for our club. We have to care for them."

 

 

Thats the key difference right there. Greed rules in this country and has for years.

[Jairzinho]

Thats the key difference right there. Greed rules in this country and has for years.

 

 

'We do not think the fans are like cows, who you milk. Football has got to be for everybody.

'That's the biggest difference between us and England.'

 

[RoboRiise]

 

Insania.  Top trolling from the Albanians though.

[Nunavut Patrick]

Insania.  Top trolling from the Albanians though.

Love the stool being thrown as it kicks off....pwoper nasty....wonder if Danny Dyer was there? I guess Serbia gets the WWE channel.

[PestiRed]

I blame Martin Atkinson. He completely lost control of the game

[aRdja]

Great article on Dortmund

 

http://m.bbc.com/sport/football/29624410

 

[aRdja]

Borussia Dortmund's slogan "echte liebe" - or "true love" - says it all. The final whistle goes at the majestic Westfalenstadion. Dortmund have lost at home.

And yet none of the players disappear down the tunnel. None of the fans leave the ground. Defiant, determined, the 25,000 fans who religiously flock to the mythical south stand continue to serenade their team.

Manager Jurgen Klopp joins his players on the edge of the penalty area, where they stand for five minutes in awe, gazing up at one of European football's great sights, the "Gelbe Wand" (Yellow Wall), a sea of luminous shirts, scarves and flags. Towers of smoke rise from pockets of fans and waves of noise cascades down the steep terrace and onto the players.

This love is unconditional.

Moments such as this are why Dortmund are one of the last great romantic clubs. The tickets - and beer - are cheap, the atmosphere is raw and seductive and fans, not finance, come first.

When Dortmund reached the 2013 Champions League final, the club received 502,567 applications for 24,042 tickets. The entire city has a population of 580,956. True love, indeed.

Football is all encompassing here, it reaches ever facet of life. One fan even leaves the club shop having just bought a Borussia Dortmund-branded lawn mower. The chance to experience this love affair is attracting more than 1,000 fans from England to every home match.

 

The scene in the Westfalenstadion after Dortmund's defeat by Hamburg

It is a scarcely believable figure, but walk around the stadium and British accents are audible among the 80,000 at Signal Iduna Park. "We jump on the Channel Tunnel train," says Matthew Gerrard, from Kent.

"We make a weekend of it. With tickets, accommodation, transport, this trip will cost £65. When you think it cost me £51 to see the Arsenal game last season, you can see the benefits."

Another group soaking up the beer and bratwurst outside the stadium are wearing Stoke shirts, while there are also fans from Aston Villa, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Port Vale. When you discover that the majority of Dortmund's 55,000 season-ticket holders have paid an average of £9 to see this match, this influx begins to make perfect sense.

Jack, a Chelsea fan, is here with two of his friends from London.

"Prices are too high in England," he says. "But here, everything is cheap. It's a better experience for the fan and the atmosphere is incredible."

Dortmund are increasingly aware of the English invasion. The club has even begun to conduct stadium tours in English. "It's amazing," says marketing director Carsten Cramer. "It's always nice when English fans tell me that including the cost of a flight, two beers and a ticket, they do not pay more than a match in England.

"Why are tickets cheap? Football is part of people's lives and we want to open the doors for all of society. We need the people, they spend their hearts, their emotions with us. They are the club's most important asset."

It is a phrase that many clubs use, but two stories demonstrate why it is, perhaps, far more than words here in Dortmund. In recent months, the club's caterers asked them to increase beer prices for the first time in three years. But Dortmund said no.

"What is the economic sense for the club to increase the price by 10 cents?" Cramer added. "For the overall economic success of the club it is not important to increase the price of a litre of a beer. It is still money, but not a lot to the club. But it does affect our fans, if they are spending their money match after match."

The Gelbe Wand/The Yellow Wall

Bayern Munich and Germany midfielder Bastian Schweinsteiger was recently asked whether he feared Dortmund's players or their manager, more. He responded by saying: "It is the Yellow Wall that scares me the most." The sudtribune, or south stand, has the capacity to assault the senses with its raw passion and noise. More than 25,000 people stand on the terrace during Bundesliga games. For European games, safe standing rails are replaced by seats.

Puma, the club's shirt manufacturer, also urged them to increase the price of the kit after three seasons at the same figure. Dortmund, once again, said no.

"We try to be as fair as possible. It is easier to ask sponsors for cash than the fans," Cramer says.

Dortmund plan to introduce free wifi to all fans inside the stadium from January. Other clubs are doing the same, but not quite in the way that Dortmund are.

While the club want to encourage fans to engage with them online, order food and send tweets, once the match starts, they want their fans to put their phones down, use their hands to clap, their eyes to watch and the voices to sing.

And to ensure that remains the case, the club are discussing plans to dip the wifi signal once the match begins. Supporting the team is the be all and end all.

 

Borussia Dortmund have the highest average attendance in the world

It is why Dortmund do not sell drinks in their corporate boxes during the game. It is why the stadium announcer demands fans return to their seats in time for the start of the second half. The club could allow fans to spend more money buying food and drink. But not at Dortmund.

"We are a football club," Cramer adds. "If the football doesn't run properly, the rest of the business would not work. The business is part of a train, but not the engine."

Cramer arrives in the room having spent much of the past 15 minutes on the phone to a fan with a complaint - yes, they do exist.

"It is important that the fans know that their concerns are being listened to, that as a club we have a feeling for what they want," he says.

"Our CEO is in a deep conversation with the fans, we have five guys who just work for our supporters. Our fans know we care about what they think."

Dortmund fan Marc Quambusch, from Kein Zwanni (external) (Not Twenty), a supporter campaign to keep tickets cheap, admits he is proud of what Dortmund has become, having grown up looking to England as the home of football's soul.

Dortmund stats - the club:

Season ticket holders: 55,000

Waiting list for season ticket: 30,000

Stadium capacity: 80,645

Average home attendance: 80,291 (highest in the world)

Number of fans attending in 2013-14 season: 1.855 million

"When I was young, we all watched English football, the Kop and said 'yes, that is what football is all about'," he says.

"Now, when we go to English football, the stadiums are quiet and we say that it is actually quite boring. If you price people out, you change the atmosphere. If you price people out, it isn't the people's game anymore."

Dortmund's fervent atmosphere is the envy of Europe but it is not there by accident.

The club keeps prices low precisely to ensure all areas of society are represented in the crowd. There is no such thing as the 'prawn sandwich brigade' (external) in these parts.

"Prices are also going up here and have gone up in recent seasons. But Dortmund is one of the homes of fan culture now, every type of person in this city can afford to go to the stadium," Quambusch adds.

"Not just the old people or the rich. That isn't the case in England."

It is important to remember this is a club run by the fans, for the fans. The Bundesliga's (external) "50% plus one" rule requires clubs to be owned by their members. All but three of the 36 Bundesliga clubs are owned or controlled by their members, with Wolfsburg, Bayer Leverkeusen and Hoffenheim the exceptions.

It is a model that is the envy of many in Europe, especially when it is so successful, as Dortmund have been since 2010, winning two Bundesligas and reaching the Champions League final.

"You have to find your own way," Cramer says. "I am not that arrogant to think that our way might be the right way for all clubs.

 

Visit the Price of Football calculator to see how much you spend supporting your team.

"This way fits to the core values of our club. We are a very, very down to earth club.

"If you know what your club stands for, it helps you know how to act. But I could put the figures to other clubs and say there you go. It is the Dortmund way, and for us, it is most certainly the right way."

The Dortmund model may not, though, be as attractive for those clubs determined to make money above all else. The amount of money Arsenal generate on match days dwarfs those of the German club, despite having 20,000 less seats.

"This is impressive," Cramer added. "But if we were to ask for prices like this, we would lose the people. And the people are one of the most important assets for our club."

English fans will continue to flock to this unglamorous corner of Germany. It is an intoxicating experience, it is cheap and the football is among the best in Europe. What is not to like? Perhaps it is that Germany reminds English football fans of something they think the game in this country has forgotten.

Modern football may be the land of the sporting superstar, but in Germany the fan is king.

 

[deiseach]

A disappointing squad, beard-wise...

Mullets, on the other hand...

[Bamo]

Just reading up on what happened to Kyle Lafferty after hearing he scored tonight and came across this 

 

 

Amusing. He won Palmero's player of the year too.

 

Shouldn't be too much of an issue in Norwich!

[magicrat]

Great article on Dortmund.

They really have got the balance right . 

[Jairzinho]

"When I was young, we all watched English football, the Kop and said 'yes, that is what football is all about'," he says.

"Now, when we go to English football, the stadiums are quiet and we say that it is actually quite boring. If you price people out, you change the atmosphere. If you price people out, it isn't the people's game anymore."

"If you know what your club stands for, it helps you know how to act..."

 

 

 

Germany, you're doing it right.

[Gym Beglin]

I think there could be cause for concern with the Germans because they don't have a proper striker.

 

You could argue that Reus is a striker, and he's currently out, but you look at that team and their striker options are:

 

Reus

Schurrle

Volland

Lassogga

Kruse

Gotze

Muller

 

 

For whatever reason, they stopped using Mario Gomez.

 

I think the last couple of games where they've dominated the play but been unable to win the game could be indicative of a slight problem they have going forward.

[Faustus]

I went to a St Pauli game recently and it was top drawer. Absolute bargain at €13 a ticket. Fair does, it's not top flight, but one of my mates who came with us us a Tranmere fan and his League 2 season ticket works out at £20+ a game.

 

I'm on my phone so can't really go into much detail, but the fans are treated with so much more respect over there. I was chatting to one of their supporters and he said you can even buy a season ticket for life for them for €1,910 (1910- the year they were formed). I couldn't believe it when he told me that!

[Jim MM]

I think there could be cause for concern with the Germans because they don't have a proper striker.

 

You could argue that Reus is a striker, and he's currently out, but you look at that team and their striker options are:

 

Reus

Schurrle

Volland

Lassogga

Kruse

Gotze

Muller

 

 

For whatever reason, they stopped using Mario Gomez.

 

I think the last couple of games where they've dominated the play but been unable to win the game could be indicative of a slight problem they have going forward.

Nah, they just came up against a better side last night.

[Rapey Hugh]

Jim MM knows

 

That said what ever did happen to Gomez? He was Munich frontman banging in the goals not too long ago. Fight with manager or something?

[Carvalho Diablo]

Snazzy

[Nightcat]

The "great albania", sounds like "his great 3inch cock" or something.