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Dave D

FSG are not shit

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12 minutes ago, Horus said:

 

If you've got some accurate figures, then I'd genuinely be interested in seeing them if at all possible.

 

Our annual accounts can be found here https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00035668/filing-history

 

There's a couple of ways to calculate transfer spending, my preference is to you the cash flow figures as this will include what we spend on agent fees and other transfer related costs, as you are missing out a big part of the picture if you don't included them and it is how the club should look at it as well, but it is not quite the same as most view net spend.

 

If you open the accounts to May 2018 and go to Statement of Cash Flows on page 15, you can see see entries for "Proceeds from sale of player registrations" and "Acquisition of player registrations", we spent £49.2m in 2017/18 and £38.8m the season before that.

 

You could check the previous accounts for the earlier seasons, or you can believe me when I say it was £37.8m, £58.7m, £53.3m and £44.3m going each year going back (if you listened to my previous advice, you should realise that you should not trust me and you should check yourself to be sure...)

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7 minutes ago, The Guest said:

Google companies house beta and then type in Liverpool football club and athletic grounds.  Click on their profile and the top PDF is the latest set of accounts which is up to the end of May.  There’s loads of interesting stuff on there if you know what to look for.

 

The player acquisitions total was 195m.

 

And this is the other method of calculating the transfer spending, using the balance sheet.

 

The balance sheet disposals were £137.1m (you have to include profits of transfers to get to this number), giving Net transfer additions of £58.1m.

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It's quite hard to equate FSG's approach with the Red Sox to how they do things with Liverpool. The way the two sports and run and governed make that nearly impossible. One thing I like about American sports is the lengths they go to keep the sports competitive. You'll get teams every now and then who dominate on the field but you won't see a situation where a team can come along (like Chelsea, Man City and PSG) and ride roughshod over the financial rules others play by. You also don't get a situation where the sport is basically just a dick-waving contest between the two richest sides.

 

Talking about the years since FSG got involved in baseball, no side has managed to retain the World Series. Several sides have reached back-to-back World Series' since 2003 but there has been a new champion every year since then. The Red Sox (with 4 titles) have won it more than any other team since FSG took ownership. The last team to retain the World Series are the Yankees who won three in a row between 1998 and 2000. They last won the whole thing 10 years ago and haven't been to a World Series since.

 

If you equate the American League East Division (AL East for short) with the Champions League group stage, the AL Division Series (ALDS - the first play-off round) with the quarter finals, the AL Championship Series (ALCS - the penultimate play-off round) with the semi finals, and the World Series with the Champions League final, this is the Red Sox team record since 2003:

 

(new GM Theo Epstein; team manager still Grady Little)

2003 - 2nd in AL East; lost ALCS 4-3 against New York Yankees

 

(new team manager Terry Francona)

2004 - 2nd in AL East; won World Series 4-0 against St. Louis Cardinals

2005 - 2nd in AL East; lost ALDS 3-0 against Chicago White Sox

2006 - 3rd in AL East

2007 - 1st in AL East; won World Series 4-0 against Colorado Rockies

2008 - 2nd in AL East; lost ALCS 4-3 against Tampa Bay Rays

2009 - 2nd in AL East; lost ALDS 3-0 against LA Angels

2010 - 3rd in AL East

2011 - 3rd in AL East

 

(new GM Ben Cherington; new team manager Bobby Valentine)

2012 - 5th (bottom) in AL East

 

(new team manager John Farrell)

2013 - 1st in AL East; won World Series 4-2 against St. Louis Cardinals

2014 - 5th in AL East

 

(new GM Dave Dombrowski)

2015 - 5th in AL East

2016 - 1st in AL East; lost ALDS 3-0 against Cleveland Indians

2017 - 1st in AL East; lost ALDS 3-1 against Houston Astros

 

(new team manager Alex Cora)

2018 - 1st in AL East; won World Series 4-1 against LA Dodgers

2019 - currently 3rd in AL East, battling for 2nd with Tampa Bay Rays and a wild card slot but it looks unlikely that they'll reach the play-offs this year

 

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Good point about the parity, it is definitely by design in both MLB and NFL -- San Francisco Giants are a prime example. A second market team won it three times in five years and a few seasons later are dead last.

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3 hours ago, TheHowieLama said:

Good point about the parity, it is definitely by design in both MLB and NFL -- San Francisco Giants are a prime example. A second market team won it three times in five years and a few seasons later are dead last.

 

AFL in Australia is designed for parity too. 

 

 

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Throwing money into sport with no plan or intention to maintain a level of parity invariably means the sport begins to alienate a lot of people because of the absence of the very things that got (and kept) them interested in the first place. Of course it will attract new people but they'll treated as consumers rather than supporters, and most of them won't care. It's funny how the Americans insist on competitive parity within sport when capitalism is rampant in practically every other sphere of American society.

 

Turning football into a commercial operation has seen clubs like Bury questioned this week over whether they have as little as £1.5m to keep on as a going concern for an entire season, while players like Gareth Bale are being offered not far short of that per week by Chinese clubs for taking part in a few hours of training and one game.

 

Nobody involved in the game is seriously concerned enough to want to introduce some sort of financial controls and effective parity because they don't want to leave the gravy train. FFP was a good idea in theory but its introduction has resulted in a glass ceiling for many clubs while others just take the piss and flout the rules openly, knowing that any forthcoming punishments will do little to hurt them.

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3 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Thanks amigo -- sorry about the Eric Church thing in the Music Review thread...

 

Musically good in fairness but I just didn't like the singing style whatsoever. Personal taste is all it is! 

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Red Sox have fired their General Manager Dave Dombrowski. Apparently he'd been at loggerheads with the ownership for a while, and had contributed to the club having a payroll that is so high, it doesn't give them much leeway to invest in the playing squad. Certain players have been given very high contract extentions but haven't contributed a great deal since then, and they don't have very many good prospects in their farm system (their academy equivalent) to help pad out the roster. They need to find money to retain top players like Mookie Betts. It all sounds like Dombrowski is a bit like Mourinho - capable of winning titles but requiring an awful lot of short-term investment to do so, as well as leaving a mess to sort out.

 

After a brilliant 2018, the Red Sox have been very mediocre this term. They started badly, they won't make the play-offs, and their record at Fenway is terrible, losing more games than they've won. Scoring runs hasn't been that much of a problem but they've been haemorrhaging runs on a regular basis. To compound matters, the Yankees are having the sort of year the Red Sox had last year.

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8 hours ago, Trumo said:

Red Sox have fired their General Manager Dave Dombrowski. Apparently he'd been at loggerheads with the ownership for a while, and had contributed to the club having a payroll that is so high, it doesn't give them much leeway to invest in the playing squad. Certain players have been given very high contract extentions but haven't contributed a great deal since then, and they don't have very many good prospects in their farm system (their academy equivalent) to help pad out the roster. They need to find money to retain top players like Mookie Betts. It all sounds like Dombrowski is a bit like Mourinho - capable of winning titles but requiring an awful lot of short-term investment to do so, as well as leaving a mess to sort out.

 

After a brilliant 2018, the Red Sox have been very mediocre this term. They started badly, they won't make the play-offs, and their record at Fenway is terrible, losing more games than they've won. Scoring runs hasn't been that much of a problem but they've been haemorrhaging runs on a regular basis. To compound matters, the Yankees are having the sort of year the Red Sox had last year.

Do FSG have anything else in their portfolio that can cover any Red Sox financial losses ?

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1 hour ago, sir roger said:

Do FSG have anything else in their portfolio that can cover any Red Sox financial losses ?

Yeah. John Henry's yachts.

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12 hours ago, Trumo said:

Red Sox have fired their General Manager Dave Dombrowski. Apparently he'd been at loggerheads with the ownership for a while, and had contributed to the club having a payroll that is so high, it doesn't give them much leeway to invest in the playing squad. Certain players have been given very high contract extentions but haven't contributed a great deal since then, and they don't have very many good prospects in their farm system (their academy equivalent) to help pad out the roster. They need to find money to retain top players like Mookie Betts. It all sounds like Dombrowski is a bit like Mourinho - capable of winning titles but requiring an awful lot of short-term investment to do so, as well as leaving a mess to sort out.

 

After a brilliant 2018, the Red Sox have been very mediocre this term. They started badly, they won't make the play-offs, and their record at Fenway is terrible, losing more games than they've won. Scoring runs hasn't been that much of a problem but they've been haemorrhaging runs on a regular basis. To compound matters, the Yankees are having the sort of year the Red Sox had last year.

Who cares about rounders.

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12 minutes ago, Barry Wom said:

Aren't they incentivised to finish as low as possible once they won't make the playoffs? They do better in the draft next year?

From my limited knowledge that sounds feasible as most of the better teams seem to have peaks and troughs.

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When is Henry going to realise he’s better off fucking off his peaks and troughs stickball team, and throwing everything at Klopp’s invincibles....

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13 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

The club have failed to trademark "Liverpool" 

Good stuff. Bad bellend move from them.

 

They've been great in a lot of ways, but they can fuck off with that shite.

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