Should the UK remain a member of the EU

[Gnasher]

4 hours ago, Mudface said:

OK. So suddenly, a whole swathe of the population can't afford to buy fruit grown here. Imported fruit becomes massively cheaper, and UK farms go out of business. 

 

Now what? Do we start banning foreign imports, and engage in a tit for tat trade war? Or just go it alone, pricing a load of our population out of fresh produce?

Or alternatively swamp the country with cheap labour. A bosses/paymaster/landowners wet dream,. 

 

Nah I'd rather pay a bit extra.

[TheHowieLama]

Agriculture has been built on migrant workers worldwide for generations.

 

@Gnasher you know well that you wouldn't because you don't. You could buy local fresh veg now, if you were you would be crowing about it.

[Gnasher]

6 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Agriculture has been built on migrant workers worldwide for generations.

 

@Gnasher you know well that you wouldn't because you don't. You could buy local fresh veg now, if you were you would be crowing about it.

I'd rather see farmers pay the going rate for a change instead of flying in cheap labour. Farmers are low down in the people I give a fuvk about to be honest. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

14 hours ago, Gnasher said:

Havnt read the link but.its got the smell of a boss taking advantage of cheap labour,  pay the right money with the right working conditions you wouldn't need to fly anyone in from anywhere. 

Extend those rights to workers from the EU and any negative impacts of immigration on low-paid UK workers just vanish.

 

(I may have mentioned this before: you don't improve workers' rights by reducing workers' rights.)

[AngryOfTuebrook]

11 hours ago, Gnasher said:

Well that depends on the money, it's as simple as that.

 

The alternative is to cram a load of east Europeans onto a plane, let them work for a lower rate than local labour and house them in temporary shack.

That's the Tory alternative. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Tory cunts are still committed to their arbitrary 31st December cliff-edge. They know that this was barely feasible before the coronavirus crisis and it is genuinely impossible now. They know that the No Deal Brexit they are hurling us into will be economically devastating for 99% of the population.  But they're doing it anyway, because they're sociopaths and the 51.9% in 2016 gave them free rein to rob us all blind. Brafuckingvo! 

 

 

 

[Gnasher]

7 hours ago, TheHowieLama said:

Agriculture has been built on migrant workers worldwide for generations.

 

Yep, so was slavery.

7 hours ago, TheHowieLama said:

@Gnasher you know well that you wouldn't because you don't. You could buy local fresh veg now, if you were you would be crowing about it.

 

No I wouldn't. 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

10 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Yep, so was slavery.

 

Slavery wasn’t built on migrant labour.  Slaves didn’t go home at the end of the season. 

 

Nothing is going to change the fact that harvesting will always be seasonal, insecure work: biology dictates those facts. That sort of work will be unattractive to workers unless (a) they are absolutely desperate; or (b) they are willing to do some temporary work by way of adding a bit of experience to their life, to gain a bit of insight into other cultures. 

 

Tories want to keep it for (a). I  prefer  (b).

[No2]

24 minutes ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

Tory cunts are still committed to their arbitrary 31st December cliff-edge. They know that this was barely feasible before the coronavirus crisis and it is genuinely impossible now. They know that the No Deal Brexit they are hurling us into will be economically devastating for 99% of the population.  But they're doing it anyway, because they're sociopaths and the 51.9% in 2016 gave them free rein to rob us all blind. Brafuckingvo! 

 

 

 

There is a scene in Sunderland til I die season 2 where they are negotiating to buy Will Grigg from Wigan on deadline day.

 

The Tory looking owner bids £1m, the manager advises them they will be over paying if they go as high as £1.25m. Six bids later Wigan finally buckle and accept £4m for him. The largest ever fee ever paid by a league one team, a year on he's scored 5 goals.

 

When December 31st comes it will be quite appropriate that Sunderland are metaphorically representing the UK at negotiating table, somehow I don't think Wigan will sitting opposite them.

[skend04]

35 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Yep, so was slavery.

 

Fucking idiot.

[Gnasher]

20 minutes ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

Slavery wasn’t built on migrant labour.  Slaves didn’t go home at the end of the season. 

 

Nothing is going to change the fact that harvesting will always be seasonal, insecure work: biology dictates those facts. That sort of work will be unattractive to workers unless (a) they are absolutely desperate; or (b) they are willing to do some temporary work by way of adding a bit of experience to their life, to gain a bit of insight into other cultures. 

 

Tories want to keep it for (a). I  prefer  (b).

Oh come on angry please ,  

 

" gain a bit of insight into other cultures" 

 

They are on a farm being worked like a fuvking carthorse for less than the value of their labour.

 

In the words of Ricky Tomlinson " culture my arse.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 hours ago, Gnasher said:

Oh come on angry please ,  

 

" gain a bit of insight into other cultures" 

 

They are on a farm being worked like a fuvking carthorse for less than the value of their labour.

 

In the words of Ricky Tomlinson " culture my arse.

Have you ever bothered leaving your home town?

[Gnasher]

5 minutes ago, AngryofTuebrook said:

Have you ever bothered leaving your home town?

I'm tempted to do a Souy here and say ok go on then coz I've got a fucking big table but I wont go down that route. I do suggest you stop casting aspersions about posters lives though angry as you are wide of the mark

 

I can say I've lived and worked abroad and , I' admit I was fortunate to travel.and work in a time where exploitation of others was not so readily excused. I

 

Does that answer your irrelevant question?

[Pidge]

What work did you do abroad, Gnasher?

[Gnasher]

5 minutes ago, Pidge said:

What work did you do abroad, Gnasher?

Construction. Worked all over europe, did a spell on the ships , the states and south America (loved S America)  I have family in Italy who until recently I regularly go and see.  

[Gnasher]

I hope it's got better since this report but I'm not holding my breath.

 

 

https://theecologist.org/2011/oct/10/bitter-harvest-how-exploitation-and-abuse-stalks-migrant-workers-uk-farms

 

It is what it is. Cheap labour run by unscrupulous gang masters.

[Gnasher]

The answer as I see it is quite simple. It's being done now with the virus and was done with the bankers crash. Subsidise the wages. 

 

If the government wants the nation to est healthy for the health of the nation, nhs etc  subsidise the pay of young pickers on British farms.  

 

The solution gived the youth employment, gives the landowners their pound of flesh and gives the consumer market priced fruit and veg. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Gnash - Let me know which of these statemented you disagree with. 

 

1. Harvesting is temporary, seasonal work.

 

2. Harvesting doesn’t have to be low-paid.

 

3. The fact that harvesting is underpaid is because employers can get away with it. 

 

4. Exploitative employers get away with underpaying workers because the rules put in place by successive neoliberal UK Governments.

 

5. Harvesting should be paid at least at the real Living Wage.

 

6. Whether or not you like farmers, the provision of affordable food is, y'know, sort of important. 

 

7. The countryside  - where the farms are - is not full of fruit and veg pickers, sitting idle for 9 months of the year.

 

8. Because of Points 6 and 7, we depend on migrant labour to provide much of our food.

 

9. Being driven by poverty to carry out seasonal work is a shit way to live.

 

10. A decent society, in which all jobs are decently paid and workers have the right to defend themselves from exploitation, would have room for fairly-paid seasonal work, carried out by migrant workers.

 

11. Temporarily moving away from home and working in a different part of the country  - or a different country  - can be a valuable developmental experience: millions of people  (myself and quite a few of my friends included) have benefited from such an experience. 

 

12. Opportunities for working people should not be constrained by borders: all workers should share equal rights.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

26 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

I hope it's got better since this report but I'm not holding my breath.

 

 

https://theecologist.org/2011/oct/10/bitter-harvest-how-exploitation-and-abuse-stalks-migrant-workers-uk-farms

 

It is what it is. Cheap labour run by unscrupulous gang masters.

"It is what it is"... but it doesn't have to be that way.

 

Do you think that handing unconstrained power to the Johnsons, Duncan Smiths and Rees-Moggs of this world would make things better or worse?

 

Better?

Or worse?

[Pureblood]

3 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

The answer as I see it is quite simple. It's being done now with the virus and was done with the bankers crash. Subsidise the wages. 

 

If the government wants the nation to est healthy for the health of the nation, nhs etc  subsidise the pay of young pickers on British farms.  

 

The solution gived the youth employment, gives the landowners their pound of flesh and gives the consumer market priced fruit and veg.

This will all happen once the implosion of the Tories happens, as planned.  Just waiting for that implosion.  Should be any minute now.

[Gnasher]

22 minutes ago, TK421 said:

This will all happen once the implosion of the Tories happens, as planned.  Just waiting for that implosion.  Should be any minute now.

Er it wont as long as the opposition puts bombs under each others arses.

[Bjornebye]

Go onto the Daily Mail comments sections and keep saying "if it wasn't for Brexit we wouldn't be in this mess, look what you have all done" 

 

Its worth it trust me. 

[Pureblood]

5 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Er it wont as long as the opposition puts bombs under each others arses.

But you told me it would.  You assured me in robust terms that Brexit would destroy the Tories.  You didn't mention any caveat about weak opposition.

 

I want my money back. 

[Gnasher]

49 minutes ago, TK421 said:

But you told me it would.  You assured me in robust terms that Brexit would destroy the Tories.  You didn't mention any caveat about weak opposition.

 

I want my money back. 

Can I pay you in euros?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

24 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Can I pay you in euros?

Safer than Sterling.