Inequality

[Creator Supreme]

Am I right in thinking that njackets is a cunt?

[mattyq]

Am I right in thinking that njackets is a cunt?

You don't have to be a cunt to be a cunt but njackets is a cunt

I don't really think he is...just a little daft

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Aren't most of the people in the top 10 self made?

 

Edit: I also heard at weekend that in 90% of cases family money is gone by the third generation. Unbelievable.

The real problem isn't the top 10; it's the top 70,000.  The richest 0.001% in the world are zooming away from the rest of the richest 1%, never mind the plebs like us.  I'm not convinced that they are all "self made".

 

Where did you get that about family money?  I'm not entirely convinced it applies to huge fortunes, but I'd be interested to see the data.

[Hades]

The real problem isn't the top 10; it's the top 70,000.  The richest 0.001% in the world are zooming away from the rest of the richest 1%, never mind the plebs like us.  I'm not convinced that they are all "self made".

 

Where did you get that about family money?  I'm not entirely convinced it applies to huge fortunes, but I'd be interested to see the data.

 

80% of the funding for new business in America comes from family.

[Rico1304]

The real problem isn't the top 10; it's the top 70,000. The richest 0.001% in the world are zooming away from the rest of the richest 1%, never mind the plebs like us. I'm not convinced that they are all "self made".

 

Where did you get that about family money? I'm not entirely convinced it applies to huge fortunes, but I'd be interested to see the data.

I heard it on the Franks Skinner show, but here's some articles;

 

http://time.com/money/3925308/rich-families-lose-wealth/

http://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/579236

[Rico1304]

80% of the funding for new business in America comes from family.

Not that you'll see this but 66% of new business fail in 2 years.

[Chairman Meow]

Not that you'll see this but 66% of new business fail in 2 years.

 

I always though that was fairly common knowledge? Certainly it's something I've heard said for years. Whether it's accurate or not I don't know though. 

 

Biggest issue I think amongst people I've seen try and get started on their own is taking money out immediately or buying shit they don't need / new cars on lease immediately and such like. That and a general lack of understanding that things take time and not taking a longer term view.

 

I've taken no money out whatsoever since I went full time in September 2014 and won't be taking anything out at all until I am at the point where I have a years worth of expenses (rent, insurance etc.) built up. Even then I actually want to work up to the point I have a minimum of 2 years reserve so will only be taking a small amount out until that is received.

 

The way I look at it this is the building blocks of the next 20 years but that seems to be the absolute opposite of what most people do. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Not that you'll see this but 66% of new business fail in 2 years.

That's a statistic I like to drag out whenever people talk about the private sector being so much more efficient than the public.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

I heard it on the Franks Skinner show, but here's some articles;

 

http://time.com/money/3925308/rich-families-lose-wealth/

http://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/579236

I admire your honesty. You could have said you got it from Radio 4 or something.

 

Thanks for the links.

[Rico1304]

I admire your honesty. You could have said you got it from Radio 4 or something.

Thanks for the links.

It sounded implausible so I looked it up. It came from his cohost Emily Dean, to be honest I think there was a degree of personal experience there.

[VladimirIlyich]

Aren't most of the people in the top 10 self made?

 

Edit: I also heard at weekend that in 90% of cases family money is gone by the third generation. Unbelievable.

Nobody is self made. Everybody who is rich and particularly those who are extremely rich has had to rely on somebody or something that another person has done for them. Even if you are a millionaire market trader you will have to get your goods to market relying on transport links that somebody else has provided,usually the taxpayer.

[Rico1304]

Nobody is self made. Everybody who is rich and particularly those who are extremely rich has had to rely on somebody or something that another person has done for them. Even if you are a millionaire market trader you will have to get your goods to market relying on transport links that somebody else has provided,usually the taxpayer.

I'm struggling to see the point here. Tax payers provide infrastructure, these people and institutions pay tax (granted not always the appropriate amount and mybviews on avoidance have been stated loads of times - lock the cunts up).

[Jose Jones]

I think the "self made" label does play a bit into the CEO as super hero mindset where the contributions of the thousands of staff who have worked for a company are overlooked because the founder is a bit of a visionary genius.

 

However most of them do get mega rich because they start the company and still own a large portion of it by the time the massive market success comes. So in that sense they have created the vehicle for their own wealth. Rather than just a high paid exec of an existing company.

[VladimirIlyich]

I think the "self made" label does play a bit into the CEO as super hero mindset where the contributions of the thousands of staff who have worked for a company are overlooked because the founder is a bit of a visionary genius.

 

However most of them do get mega rich because they start the company and still own a large portion of it by the time the massive market success comes. So in that sense they have created the vehicle for their own wealth. Rather than just a high paid exec of an existing company.

Like I hinted at before,having a brilliant idea that can possibly make millions(perpetual motion machines anybody?) getting it from an idea to mass manufacturing,customer base,competitive price and even the cost to patent the invention require the input of lots of people and usually financially too. Making use of taxpayer's infrastructure projects is just a simple example of how I don't buy this 'self made' bullshit that is usually thrown around in the likes of the USA and the UK to tell people who will be lucky to own the basics of life even when they do work long and hard.

[Strontium]

Not that you'll see this but 66% of new business fail in 2 years.

 

Which still isn't that bad when compared to the failure rate of Communist states.

[Strontium]

Like I hinted at before,having a brilliant idea that can possibly make millions(perpetual motion machines anybody?) getting it from an idea to mass manufacturing,customer base,competitive price and even the cost to patent the invention require the input of lots of people and usually financially too. Making use of taxpayer's infrastructure projects is just a simple example of how I don't buy this 'self made' bullshit that is usually thrown around in the likes of the USA and the UK to tell people who will be lucky to own the basics of life even when they do work long and hard.

 

If entrepreneurs providing jobs and opportunity to many other people is supposed to be an argument against them, then I'm afraid it's not a very good one.

[Rico1304]

Like I hinted at before,having a brilliant idea that can possibly make millions(perpetual motion machines anybody?) getting it from an idea to mass manufacturing,customer base,competitive price and even the cost to patent the invention require the input of lots of people and usually financially too. Making use of taxpayer's infrastructure projects is just a simple example of how I don't buy this 'self made' bullshit that is usually thrown around in the likes of the USA and the UK to tell people who will be lucky to own the basics of life even when they do work long and hard.

So if a murderer gets on a train, then a bus then drives a car, switches on a light and then kills someone we should all share the blame?

[VladimirIlyich]

If entrepreneurs providing jobs and opportunity to many other people is supposed to be an argument against them, then I'm afraid it's not a very good one.

No,they are not 'self made' they receive help somewhere along the way. Let's face it they either get a few bob from family members,and would be bankrupt if the had to start from scratch like Mr Trump,or they are helped along my grants and loans with which they couldn't do without. 'Self Made' indicates that its all done by one person with little or no help and thats never true.

 

PS,what has Communism got to do with anything?

[SasaS]

Self made usually means just that someone has earned their money buy starting or creating their business, rather than inheriting.

[Jairzinho]

50 shades of cunt.

[Rushies tash]

If entrepreneurs providing jobs and opportunity to many other people is supposed to be an argument against them, then I'm afraid it's not a very good one.

Except it's not all that way around really is it? The people are there to make more money for the entrepreneur. The fact that they get paid is just their incentive to do so. Not saying it's wrong, but pretending employers are philanthropically dishing out jobs that everyone should be grateful for is a little disingenuous.

[Strontium]

Except it's not all that way around really is it? The people are there to make more money for the entrepreneur. The fact that they get paid is just their incentive to do so. Not saying it's wrong, but pretending employers are philanthropically dishing out jobs that everyone should be grateful for is a little disingenuous.

 

I don't think anyone pretends that there's anything philanthropic about creating a business. I've certainly never seen anyone do that.

 

Entrepreneurs, like anyone who goes out to earn a wage, are unambiguously doing it to serve their own interests.

 

That doesn't mean they aren't producing a lot of socially desirable things as a by-product of them acting in their own rational self-interest.

[Bobby Hundreds]

It's weird how it's painted that the company's do the charitable act of providing jobs. Maybe the Apple board should be less charitable and build all their products them fucking selves, cut out the hangers on.

 

We are a society everybody relies on everybody else in one way or another, big ways or small. Success should be applauded but if it's achieved through exploitation either in pay or oppressive practices it should be highlighted and the state should step in.

 

I struggle to see optimism for the future. Technology/science really should make it optimistic but global politics makes it look grim. President trump for fuck sake and farage treated like a man of the working class.

 

It's like the system has gone into atrophy, everything needs more money for less back. Raise the council tax yet you gotta pay for your bins, the street lights get turned off, the police force cut, A+E cuts, NHS a shambles, firemen told to work till their 75, loads of stations shut down and turned into wine bars. Education giving you debt before you even begin. Company's creating bizarre family and social life destroying shifts for fuck knows what logical reason. Grandparent loses their partner and ends up getting kicked out of their family home because it's got a box room spare so now they gotta a 1 bedroom flat with no space for the grand kids. Not to mention council estates becoming a conveyor belt of strangers who don't give a fuck about their house or the community because it's all short termism. I think mostly that's the problem, constant short term thinking. Government after government fucking things up.

 

Where's the light on the horizon. I need a happy news source. Real news but with an optimistic outlook.

[Rushies tash]

It's weird how it's painted that the company's do the charitable act of providing jobs. Maybe the Apple board should be less charitable and build all their products them fucking selves, cut out the hangers on.

We are a society everybody relies on everybody else in one way or another, big ways or small. Success should be applauded but if it's achieved through exploitation either in pay or oppressive practices it should be highlighted and the state should step in.

I struggle to see optimism for the future. Technology/science really should make it optimistic but global politics makes it look grim. President trump for fuck sake and farage treated like a man of the working class.

It's like the system has gone into atrophy, everything needs more money for less back. Raise the council tax yet you gotta pay for your bins, the street lights get turned off, the police force cut, A+E cuts, NHS a shambles, firemen told to work till their 75, loads of stations shut down and turned into wine bars. Education giving you debt before you even begin. Company's creating bizarre family and social life destroying shifts for fuck knows what logical reason. Grandparent loses their partner and ends up getting kicked out of their family home because it's got a box room spare so now they gotta a 1 bedroom flat with no space for the grand kids. Not to mention council estates becoming a conveyor belt of strangers who don't give a fuck about their house or the community because it's all short termism. I think mostly that's the problem, constant short term thinking. Government after government fucking things up.

Where's the light on the horizon. I need a happy news source. Real news but with an optimistic outlook.

Here you go bud.

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/feel-good-news

[Rushies tash]

I don't think anyone pretends that there's anything philanthropic about creating a business. I've certainly never seen anyone do that.

 

Entrepreneurs, like anyone who goes out to earn a wage, are unambiguously doing it to serve their own interests.

 

That doesn't mean they aren't producing a lot of socially desirable things as a by-product of them acting in their own rational self-interest.

It is often used as a defence for poor working conditions though. As if being a 'wealth creator' gives someone an absolute right to treat someone like shite. It should be a symbiotic relationship but increasingly it is becoming more skewed towards the employer with no little encouragement from a complicit Tory government and right wing media.