No one on this forum could have done any better with the funds Rafa was handed

[JMARKH]

Glen Johnson, quality signing, upgrade on arbeloa?. Aqualini - quality?- I think he will be. Rafa probably knows his previous mistakes but has not got the funds to correct them, blame the yanks for that, 4th will be an achievement. Last year, I think Rafa cost us, but even Keane has not been replaced, he did fill in well for Torres in some games, (people forget), we've been shafted, even the likes of stoke and Sunderland have out spent us this summer. I've no grudges with Rafa this season, seeing him bring the likes of Eccelston on this year is great, I am behind his vision, who could do a better job in these circumstances?. Since he has stopped with the politics he has done everything right and has just been hampered with injuries, I've still faith in Rafa.

[Herp McDerp]

3, 2, 1, bash...

 

 

Seriously though, I do think it's pointless sacking him, doubt anyone would do better under these circumstances. Poor choice of a thread title though, sure way to get the usual suspects steaming in and rehashing the same points for the umpteenth time, you should have disguised it maybe, you know, named it the Lucas appreciation thread or something.

[JMARKH]

3, 2, 1, bash...

 

 

Seriously though, I do think it's pointless sacking him, doubt anyone would do better under these circumstances. Poor choice of a thread title though, sure way to get the usual suspects steaming in and rehashing the same points for the umpteenth time, you should have disguised it maybe, you know, named it the Lucas appreciation thread or something.

 

Ha ha I was one of the "mongs" last year! But I felt he had the tools to do better, and before late March when we started playing I felt I was justified in my criticism of Rafa but not this season. He can't turn water into wine.

[Herp McDerp]

Yup, but that won't stop some, already we've got people claiming he knew what his budget was, knew that he wouldn't be getting a transfer budget, they conveniently ignore all counter arguments and repeat the same points ad infinitum. And yes I was one of those who was pissed off with him last year as well, but things have changed since then, he's been well and truly fucked over. If he does walk we can only hope he's as shit as all the naysayers have been saying, I just can't shake the feeling that we'll be finding out soon.

 

edit: Mongs? Who said anything bout mongs?:whistle:

[Paul]

No offence mate, but so what if no-one off this forum couldn't have done better. It's an absolutely infantile argument (and I'm still of the opinion that he should see the season out).

[The 5th Benitel]

If we're at a point where after 5 years and hundreds of millions spent we cant expect to compete past October cos we only had £40m to replace a right back and a centre mid then i mustn't get footy anymore.

 

Maybe, towards the end of the season we might have fallen away cos of lack of depth, but we've been beaten by half the teams we've played and only one of those defeats was by a team who has spent more than us.

[stevienando]

To the dude above:

 

LIVERPOOL: NET SPEND £0

 

IN: Alberto Aquilani (Roma, £17m), Chris Mavinga (Paris St Germain, undisclosed), Glen Johnson (Portsmouth, £17m), Sotirios Kyrgiakos(AEK Athens, £1.5m)

 

OUT: Xabi Alonso (Real Madrid, £30m), Alvaro Arbeloa (Real Madrid, £3.5m), Sebastian Leto (Panathinaikos, £3.5m)

 

ASTON VILLA - NET SPEND £24m

 

IN: James Collins (West Ham, £5m), Richard Dunne (Manchester City, £6m), Habib Beye (Newcastle, £2m), Fabian Delph (Leeds, £8m), Stewart Downing (Middlesbrough, £12m), Andy Marshall (Coventry, free), Stephen Warnock (Blackburn, £7m)

 

OUT: Zat Knight (Bolton, £4m), Stuart Taylor (Manchester City, free), Gareth Barry (Manchester City, £12m), Martin Laursen (retired)

 

CHELSEA - NET SPEND £15m

 

IN: Yuri Zhirkov (CSKA Moscow, £18m), Ross Turnbull (Middlesbrough, free), Daniel Sturridge (Manchester City, tribunal), Nemanja Matic (MFK Kosice, £1.5m)

 

OUT: Claudio Pizarro (Werder Bremen, £4m), Jimmy Smith (Leyton Orient, free), Ben Sahar (Espanyol, £800,000)

 

FULHAM - NET SPEND £5m

 

IN: Jonathan Greening (West Brom, loan), Damien Duff (Newcastle, £4m), Bjorn Helge Riise (Lillestrom, £1.5m), Stephen Kelly (Birmingham, undisclosed), Kagisho Dikgacoi (Golden Arrows, undisclosed), David Elm (Kalmar, undisclosed)

 

OUT: Leon Andreasen (Hannover 96, undisclosed)

 

SUNDERLAND - NET SPEND £11m

 

IN: Michael Turner (Hull, £6m), Lee Cattermole (Wigan, £6m), Darren Bent (Tottenham, £10m), Lorik Cana, (Marseille, £5m), Paulo Da Silva (Deportivo Toluca, free), Fraizer Campbell (Manchester United, £4m),

 

OUT: Grant Leadbitter (Ipswich, £2.6m), Carlos Edwards (Ipswich, £1.3m), Danny Collins (Stoke, £2.75m), Paul McShane (Hull, £1.5m), Anthony Stokes (Hibernian, £2m), Dean Whitehead (Stoke, £3m), Michael Chopra (Cardiff, £4m), Greg Halford (Wolves, £2m)

 

TOTTENHAM - NET SPEND £3m

 

IN: Niko Kranjcar (Portsmouth, £2m), Sebastien Bassong (Newcastle, £8m), Peter Crouch (Portsmouth, £9m), Kyle Naughton, Kyle Walker (Sheffield United, joint £8m)

 

OUT: Darren Bent (Sunderland, £10m), Chris Gunter (Nottingham Forest, £1m), Didier Zokora (Sevilla, £7m), Kevin-Prince Boateng (Portsmouth, £4m), Pascal Chimbonda (Blackburn, £2m)

[Little Sammy]

No offence mate, but so what if no-one off this forum couldn't have done better. It's an absolutely infantile argument (and I'm still of the opinion that he should see the season out).

 

Fucking right mate. And fuck off with the rose-tinted specs. I've had enough of your Tomkinsian arguments for the past 20 years.

 

Rafa has been given hundreds of millions of dollars, and while some of his buys have been good, the other teams around us have improved even more. So your argument about "no one int he forum could have done a better job" is a pointless, immature and outright stupid opinion.

 

Who the fuck knows whether one of us would have done a better job? Perhaps the 100k a week in wages would be an incentive, or the millions he would get in compensation should he be sacked.

 

Just fuck off.

[ThePositiveOne]

Glen Johnson, quality signing, upgrade on arbeloa?. Aqualini - quality?- I think he will be. Rafa probably knows his previous mistakes but has not got the funds to correct them, blame the yanks for that, 4th will be an achievement. Last year, I think Rafa cost us, but even Keane has not been replaced, he did fill in well for Torres in some games, (people forget), we've been shafted, even the likes of stoke and Sunderland have out spent us this summer. I've no grudges with Rafa this season, seeing him bring the likes of Eccelston on this year is great, I am behind his vision, who could do a better job in these circumstances?. Since he has stopped with the politics he has done everything right and has just been hampered with injuries, I've still faith in Rafa.

 

 

Excellent post....

[2pak]

Ha ha I was one of the "mongs" last year! But I felt he had the tools to do better, and before late March when we started playing I felt I was justified in my criticism of Rafa but not this season. He can't turn water into wine.

 

He can certainly turn wine into water...

[Stouffer]

No more net spend, please.

[The 5th Benitel]

To the dude above:

 

LIVERPOOL: NET SPEND £0

 

IN: Alberto Aquilani (Roma, £17m), Chris Mavinga (Paris St Germain, undisclosed), Glen Johnson (Portsmouth, £17m), Sotirios Kyrgiakos(AEK Athens, £1.5m)

 

OUT: Xabi Alonso (Real Madrid, £30m), Alvaro Arbeloa (Real Madrid, £3.5m), Sebastian Leto (Panathinaikos, £3.5m)

 

ASTON VILLA - NET SPEND £24m

 

IN: James Collins (West Ham, £5m), Richard Dunne (Manchester City, £6m), Habib Beye (Newcastle, £2m), Fabian Delph (Leeds, £8m), Stewart Downing (Middlesbrough, £12m), Andy Marshall (Coventry, free), Stephen Warnock (Blackburn, £7m)

 

OUT: Zat Knight (Bolton, £4m), Stuart Taylor (Manchester City, free), Gareth Barry (Manchester City, £12m), Martin Laursen (retired)

 

CHELSEA - NET SPEND £15m

 

IN: Yuri Zhirkov (CSKA Moscow, £18m), Ross Turnbull (Middlesbrough, free), Daniel Sturridge (Manchester City, tribunal), Nemanja Matic (MFK Kosice, £1.5m)

 

OUT: Claudio Pizarro (Werder Bremen, £4m), Jimmy Smith (Leyton Orient, free), Ben Sahar (Espanyol, £800,000)

 

FULHAM - NET SPEND £5m

 

IN: Jonathan Greening (West Brom, loan), Damien Duff (Newcastle, £4m), Bjorn Helge Riise (Lillestrom, £1.5m), Stephen Kelly (Birmingham, undisclosed), Kagisho Dikgacoi (Golden Arrows, undisclosed), David Elm (Kalmar, undisclosed)

 

OUT: Leon Andreasen (Hannover 96, undisclosed)

 

SUNDERLAND - NET SPEND £11m

 

IN: Michael Turner (Hull, £6m), Lee Cattermole (Wigan, £6m), Darren Bent (Tottenham, £10m), Lorik Cana, (Marseille, £5m), Paulo Da Silva (Deportivo Toluca, free), Fraizer Campbell (Manchester United, £4m),

 

OUT: Grant Leadbitter (Ipswich, £2.6m), Carlos Edwards (Ipswich, £1.3m), Danny Collins (Stoke, £2.75m), Paul McShane (Hull, £1.5m), Anthony Stokes (Hibernian, £2m), Dean Whitehead (Stoke, £3m), Michael Chopra (Cardiff, £4m), Greg Halford (Wolves, £2m)

 

TOTTENHAM - NET SPEND £3m

 

IN: Niko Kranjcar (Portsmouth, £2m), Sebastien Bassong (Newcastle, £8m), Peter Crouch (Portsmouth, £9m), Kyle Naughton, Kyle Walker (Sheffield United, joint £8m)

 

OUT: Darren Bent (Sunderland, £10m), Chris Gunter (Nottingham Forest, £1m), Didier Zokora (Sevilla, £7m), Kevin-Prince Boateng (Portsmouth, £4m), Pascal Chimbonda (Blackburn, £2m)

 

 

How about the 5 years he's been here?

[2pak]

How about the 5 years he's been here?

 

Also notice how Manure is conveniently excluded from the "factsheet".

[stevienando]

but we've been beaten by half the teams we've played and only one of those defeats was by a team who has spent more than us.

 

Also notice how Manure is conveniently excluded from the "factsheet".

 

I was responding to that post. And we beat Man Utd. Or have you forgotten already?

[2pak]

I was responding to that post. And we beat Man Utd. Or have you forgotten already?

 

Hard to forget the one victory of seven games.

So did we beat them because we 'spent' more than them this summer?

[goatboy59]

Aquilani for Alonso

Johnson for Arbeloa

 

Says so in the original post.

 

That should then trigger 7 defeats by Nov 1st (fuck Arsenal, add that to the reserves' defeats).

 

10 wins at the end of season? Rafa's a genius.

Losing half your first 16 games? Fucking Yanks.

 

Tiresome, tiresome bollocks. Smokescreen getting more transparent as the winds blow harder.

[stevienando]

but we've been beaten by half the teams we've played and only one of those defeats was by a team who has spent more than us.

 

Hard to forget the one victory of seven games.

So did we beat them because we 'spent' more than them this summer?

 

Do you understand what he is saying? He is saying that we were beaten by 5 teams this season, and only one of them have spent more than us. He is wrong, as proved by the net spend stats. I am neither supporting nor attacking Rafa, I am just saying that he is wrong.

[The 5th Benitel]

Do you understand what he is saying? He is saying that we were beaten by 5 teams this season, and only one of them have spent more than us. He is wrong, as proved by the net spend stats. I am neither supporting nor attacking Rafa, I am just saying that he is wrong.

 

 

I gurantee you that if you added up the cost of the squads between us and those teams ours will have cost a lot more. He may have only had £40 to replace a right back and centre mid but that doesn't come close to explaining why we've lost more games than we've won. He's been here 5 years. You cant point to his sucssess 5 years ago and then completely ignore all the money he's spent inbetween then and this summer.

[kelster]

Philipp Degen is a hundred times the footballer I am. Doesn't mean he should be playing for Liverpool.

[Paul]

Philipp Degen is a hundred times the footballer I am. Doesn't mean he should be playing for Liverpool.

 

Agreed. Context is all.

[goatboy59]

even Keane has not been replaced, he did fill in well for Torres in some games, (people forget),

 

Including the manager himself, who couldn't railroad him out of the club fast enough.

 

even the likes of stoke and Sunderland have out spent us this summer.

 

Totally nonsensical, compare what was already here to what those clubs have.

 

seeing him bring the likes of Eccelston on this year is great,

 

He can tell his grandchildren about the 5 minutes he had in a meaningless cup competition and the 5 minutes he had in a long-since-lost debacle.

 

he has stopped with the politics he has done everything right

 

Oh dear.

[Hermes]

But Ferguson has done better with less. Are their fans screaming "What's happened to the £80m from Ronaldo?". The myth continues to be peddled and the ostriches continue to bury their heads in the sand.

[stevienando]

For Spurs against Liverpool:

 

Gomes 8 Bassong 8 Corluka 8 Assou-Ekotto 3.5 Huddlestone 3 Lennon 1 Palacios 12 Modric 16.5 Defoe 7 Pavlyuchenko 14 Crouch 10 Keane 15

 

total 106m

 

Reina 6 Johnson 17 Insua 1 Skrtel 6.5 Mascherano 20 Lucas 6 Torres 20 Kuyt 8 Babel 11.5 Benayoun 5

 

total 101m

[The 5th Benitel]

For Spurs against Liverpool:

 

Gomes 8 Bassong 8 Corluka 8 Assou-Ekotto 3.5 Huddlestone 3 Lennon 1 Palacios 12 Modric 16.5 Defoe 7 Pavlyuchenko 14 Crouch 10 Keane 15

 

total 106m

 

Reina 6 Johnson 17 Insua 1 Skrtel 6.5 Mascherano 20 Lucas 6 Torres 20 Kuyt 8 Babel 11.5 Benayoun 5

 

total 101m

 

So that's one team out of the 9 defeats and it doesn't include a £20m midfielder and £7m left back.

 

That's sound then, its fine we're out of the league in October.

[danielo]

Defensive problems and lack of motivation against the supposed weaker teams are the main issues. Benitez is going to have to delve into those skills of his to turn this one around.