Spirit of Shankly: FSG - We Still Need Direction

[Whelan]

Most fans were busy hailing Carroll as Messi incarnate? Hmmmmm hahahahahahaha

 

They were!

 

This isn't based on evidence on here, it is based on what I saw with my own eyes against West Brom with fans cheering him warming up, coming on and singing his name whilst on the bench.

 

He got far more support against West Brom than he got for the whole of last season.

 

Plus I was exagerating for effect. But I have heard some shit about him from Liverpool fans at the match.

[Guest ShoePiss]

They were!

 

This isn't based on evidence on here, it is based on what I saw with my own eyes against West Brom with fans cheering him warming up, coming on and singing his name whilst on the bench.

 

He got far more support against West Brom than he got for the whole of last season.

 

Plus I was exagerating for effect. But I have heard some shit about him from Liverpool fans at the match.

 

Ah, I wasn't able to telly clap that one as I was away on my hols!

[Whelan]

Ah, I wasn't able to telly clap that one as I was away on my hols!

 

Maybe that is my problem, that has been my hols so far!

 

I'm not sure how true the stories are but it is telling that we were (supposedly) offering Henderson, Downing and Adam for Dempsey and still no takers.

 

I am by nature a cautious cunt. So taking you medicine and not taking a risk is entirely keeping with my personality.

[zigackly]

I don't blame them for saying enough is enough.

 

A month ago you stormed off this site complaining that you don't understand Liverpool Fans anymore because there was support for their decision to get rid of Kenny, you were completely against that decision so I don't for one moment think that you are neutral in this.

 

And it wasn't a childish outburst as you know! Read back, you came on with the sarcastic comment about 'net spend' and then proceded to dismiss those comments as 'waffle'.

 

Seeing our current situation as simple as Keep spending or fuck off, is childish and is petulant.

 

Tomorrow morning, when you get up, have a cup of coffee, clear your head and read back what you've written there. If you still think it's both fair and reasonable then discussing anything with you would be a massive waste of both of our time.

 

I apologise if I caused offence with my earlier comments. The context was that I was trying to defuse the discussion with a bit of humour and get to the crux of the matter, instead of descending into a mire of inaccurate figures and conjecture.

 

What you've presupposed about my opinion is simplistic and inaccurate, but I'm not interested in throwing insults, so I'll just tell you flat out that you don't have a clue what I think.

 

If you want to discuss it like adults, you know where I am.

Edited September 5, 2012 by zigackly

[Whelan]

None of this is about Carroll or the fact THEY spunked 35 mil on him, nor is it about a tory like mantra of taking medicine because some before us spent some money... wheres the planning? it seems a case of rip it up and start again every season.. :wallbutt:

 

There is a plan, you just disagree with it! So you can't use that.

 

They ain't ripping anything up, and since they have only one full season in charge, that isn't entirely accurate either.

 

And sadly, it is about Caroll and the fact that we spent £35m on him!

[Whelan]

Tomorrow morning, when you get up, have a cup of coffee, clear your head and read back what you've written there. If you still think it's both fair and reasonable then discussing anything with you would be a massive waste of both of our time.

 

I apologise if I caused offence with my earlier comments. The context was that I was trying to defuse the discussion with a bit of humour and get to the crux of the matter, instead of descending into a mire of inaccurate figures and conjecture.

 

I think it is best we don't waste anymore of each others time.

[Guest ShoePiss]

There is a plan, you just disagree with it! So you can't use tha.

 

They ain't ripping anything up, and since they have only one full season in chage, that isn't entirely accurate either.

 

And sadly, it is about Caroll and the fact that we spent £35m on him!

 

They don't know what they're doing and they're acting quite American in that they go from one extreme to another. Do we have time for them to find their feet? It's a worry.

[zigackly]

I think it is best we don't waste anymore of each others time.

 

Fair enough, and easy to set up with the ignore list. Bye now.

[TheHowieLama]

How did these hillbillies buy the club anyway?

[zigackly]

How did these hillbillies buy the club anyway?

 

It was available for only £200M and we were absolutely desperate.

[Ginny]

care to expand on your 'crying scouser' comment?

 

im a scouser born and raised in L4. All my family live there. I have done quite a bit of travelling and have lived away for a while. I can categorically say that Scousers are the most self pitying and whinging race of people I've ever met. Its took me 7 years to chip away at the negative programming I have received from my area.

[Whelan]

They don't know what they're doing and they're acting quite American in that they go from one extreme to another. Do we have time for them to find their feet? It's a worry.

 

It seems to be quite a strange period, that could in all fairness go any number of ways. They lacked knowledge and experience so they appointed Commoli to provide football knowledge, and Ayre to provide local knowledge and both decisions have backfired, some more spectacularly than others.

 

So now they need to appoint experience without any knowledge and experience of their own. They need a CEO who is experienced in football, and they need to trust that person. I think we should appoint a Sporting Director like they do in Germany, no influence on the team as such but negotiates and advises. Although I am only saying this because Sammer was appointed to this role with Munich and he was one of my favourite players.

[TheHowieLama]

It was available for only £200M and we were absolutely desperate.

 

Nobody bid more than 200m?? A year after coming 2nd??!! Fuckity, we lost our value faster than Andy Carroll.

[Whelan]

Steadfast on a DoF, oh wait no that can go... yeah rock steady! one season in charge yet they sacked Kenny on I presume either their or anothers say so.. that to me weakend us it didn't make us stronger, Enlighten me what's the plan? you can say I have an agenda as I didn't agree with the sacking of Kenny, but then I wouldn't of sanctioned 35mil on the pony tail.. :eek:.. if it all hinges on CL money for them, surely they should of speculated to a safe degree or used their own cash in the short term to accumulate with the revs from the CL? at least moores sometimes put his hand in his pocket short term.

 

There isn't one plan!

 

They have said from day one that they want young players with a sell on value, so refusing to sanction Dempsey is entirely with keeping with their plan. As I say, you disagree.

 

I didn't want Kenny sacked either - but can't really defend his performance which was poor. And since every manager they approached said they wouldn't work under a DoF then what do you want them to do? Keep going until they find someone who will take the job, or realise their mistake and re-evaluate.

 

Maybe if they get rid of Rodgers and appoint someone else next season my mind will change, but I think they are getting some unwarranted stick at the moment. The good point, is that it isn't Rodgers which was my real worry at the start of the season.

[Guest ShoePiss]

im a scouser born and raised in L4. All my family live there. I have done quite a bit of travelling and have lived away for a while. I can categorically say that Scousers are the most self pitying and whinging race of people I've ever met. Its took me 7 years to chip away at the negative programming I have received from my area.

 

I've been away for 11 years now and don't feel anything like that at all. You could say the programming is strong in this one but when I've introduced fresh off the boat Scousers to friends here they've always been very well received as have I.

 

I think there's an overriding negativity in the UK as a whole, it's certainly not specific to Liverpudlians. I think we're more positive than most actually.

[Whelan]

Whinging about what? the tories? the royals? the south? i'm down with all 3, fuck em..... scouse solidarity, if I had my way we'd have a wall up and passports ... oh for my own utopia and whelan ain't gettin in til he gets with the program :P

 

Good god!

 

Walled in with Scousers! Nah, i'll have an island where I am king - discussions on Net spend will be the law.

[corro]

Fair play to Ronnie. He's put you all to bed tonight and tucked you all up good and proper.

Enjoyed that bout of sparring but Whelan gets the decision.

[zigackly]

Nobody bid more than 200m?? A year after coming 2nd??!! Fuckity, we lost our value faster than Andy Carroll.

 

That wasn't the problem, the problem was that no-one including this lot fancied spending £200M and also had the resources to invest in both a stadium and the squad, in a time of deep financial crisis. We essentially swapped Hicks and Gillett to go back to a swisher Moores and Parry, except that these don't give a shit.

 

I refer you to the prophetic words of Christian Purslow, who doesn't know his football but knows everything there is to know about dodgy financiers:

 

"To get it straight, I think we should avoid the natural temptation to jump straight in to the deal with NESV. Whilst they are charming, intelligent and credible their bid is by any standards at the extreme bottom end of the 'right deal' threshold we set for ourselves: it [...] is I feel unlikely to yield incremental equity to fund a stadium."

 

"They may say they have money if necessary but I do not take this very seriously. Their eyes only lit up at the idea of other opportunity improvements. An American deal guy simply can't avoid using other people's money if they can."

 

"There is no extra money on the table to enable short-term investment in what remains a squad palpably needing more quality if we are to be definitively top four. New American sport team owners with the senior guy being a hedge fund manager could not be worst [sic] from an image standpoint, which is an issue for us independents.

 

"I have not even talked about valuation. I leave that to other members of the board. So what is positive? Answer, they exist. Which is not a lot, but it is not to be underestimated in importance."

[TheHowieLama]

That wasn't the problem, the problem was that no-one including this lot fancied spending £200M and also had the resources to invest in both a stadium and the squad, in a time of deep financial crisis. We essentially swapped Hicks and Gillett to go back to a swisher Moores and Parry, except that these don't give a shit.

 

I refer you to the prophetic words of Christian Purslow, who doesn't know his football but knows everything there is to know about dodgy financiers:

 

"To get it straight, I think we should avoid the natural temptation to jump straight in to the deal with NESV. Whilst they are charming, intelligent and credible their bid is by any standards at the extreme bottom end of the 'right deal' threshold we set for ourselves: it [...] is I feel unlikely to yield incremental equity to fund a stadium."

 

"They may say they have money if necessary but I do not take this very seriously. Their eyes only lit up at the idea of other opportunity improvements. An American deal guy simply can't avoid using other people's money if they can."

 

"There is no extra money on the table to enable short-term investment in what remains a squad palpably needing more quality if we are to be definitively top four. New American sport team owners with the senior guy being a hedge fund manager could not be worst [sic] from an image standpoint, which is an issue for us independents.

 

"I have not even talked about valuation. I leave that to other members of the board. So what is positive? Answer, they exist. Which is not a lot, but it is not to be underestimated in importance."

 

 

I read that before a couple times. Why didn't we just wait for another buyer?

[zigackly]

It was NESV, or go bust, or let Hicks acquire sole control and go bust later.

[TheHowieLama]

It was NESV, or go bust, or let Hicks acquire sole control and go bust later.

 

I know man - just wanted to see it in writing - that way when Whelan says they saved the club a couple times tomorrow he can go back and quote you.

[Guest ShoePiss]

I have no problem with the old lyon come arsenal approach, though even wenger recognises you need a blend... I feel it's the only approach to compete with the big spenders.. perhaps it's also right to have a system of play or style and target players to suit that style, rather than get players and then try to make a style round them...

 

For me they made mistakes from the off, asking beane/bream(baseball fella) about comolli.. and targeting CL footy.. they should of realised sometimes slowly slowly catchy monkey!... (albeit with a big net spend;))...

 

my mine beef with Brendan is when he says "like i said".... and his trigger happy mouth.. maybe he just has tourettes

 

I only hate it when he says 'like I said' when he hasn't actually said it previously. The big fucking liar!

[ternando_forres]

There was Kenny Huang , who was in the news recently regarding Inter Milan...

 

BBC News - Inter Milan sells stake to Chinese investors

[xerxes]

There was Kenny Huang , who was in the news recently regarding Inter Milan...

 

BBC News - Inter Milan sells stake to Chinese investors

 

According to Broughton, Huang was unable to put up either a deposit, or prrof of funds to purchase.

 

His proposition was the same as Carson Yeung's at Birmingham City - agree a fixed price, then sell that postion on for a profit.

[zigackly]

I know man - just wanted to see it in writing - that way when Whelan says they saved the club a couple times tomorrow he can go back and quote you.

 

Whelan won't read it, because he already knows what everyone thinks without them saying so, and he believes you're either for or against the owners and can't have compex opinions such as not wanting rid of them or wanting them to spend Abramovich style money but just wanting them to fork out a small amount of money to get the manager one of the two forwards they promised him, or wanting them not to make idiots of both themselves and the manager in the press.

 

For Whelan, like many on here now, you have to have allegiance to some imaginary "side" and can't just want the best for the club.

 

It's tiresome, pointless, and why most discussions on this forum are no longer worth bothering with.

Edited September 5, 2012 by zigackly