Entitlement and Unrealistic Expectations

[Royal Family]

I read a small thing in the papers yesterday which got me thinking about the unrealistic expectations of Liverpool fans these days. Owen Coyle – if he stays at Burnley – has been told he has a transfer budget of £15-20m this summer. My point is that this is the same as Liverpool’s budget (which, if you think about it, is simply the funds we got for selling Keane in January and nothing else).

 

I wonder if Rafa’s biggest critics on these pages – we all know who they are - who have claimed that this season has been a "disappointment" and that Rafa "cost us the title" ever stop to think that they are living 30 years in the past. Yes, we’re a big club in terms of turnover (top 10 in the world) but we’re now in a position where we can get outbid by Spurs, Villa, and Arsenal - not to mention Manchester City, Chelsea and Man United. Last summer Rafa spent less in net terms than the managers of Sunderland and Stoke City; and not even half of that spent by Aston Villa.

 

I’d love Rafa’s critics to tell me how they expect us to compete over a full season? When United had £55m of striker talent on the bench last night; when Chelsea are launching a £45m bid for Frank Ribery? We are punching above our financial weight at the moment, and it’s going to get worse as the nouveaux riches clubs continue to flex their muscles. It’s all very well saying we won’t get into bidding wars and players have to want to come here – that may work with some english players, like Gareth Barry whom I’m sure would choose us above Man City or Spurs, but how is that going to work with foreign stars without loyalty to the club? Why should they come to us when other teams offer bigger wages? Why should their clubs accept our offers when teams like Chelsea or Man City can outbid us easily?

 

Yes, we can be smarter in the market (and I think Rafa should overhaul our scouting department, starting with Macia!); yes, we can develop our own talent like Barca. I’m not saying we should be defeatist. But the biggest danger is the sense of entitlement that so many of our fans have, harking back to the glory days. We consider ourselves to be a massive club. In some ways of course we are, but off the pitch we are not, and haven’t been for 20 years - and the takeover hasn’t arrested that decline (thanks DM). It would be a miracle for us to win the league at the moment, and yet Rafa very nearly carried that off this year. But for as long as many of the fans continue to treat the title as our birthright and act like spoilt brats, failing to acknowledge the real progress that we’ve seen this season, then we’re only going to fall further behind. Remember too that unrealistic expectations are what lie behind Newcastle's descent...

[goatboy59]

Doesn't hurt to get the excuses in early.

[hamstrung]

Woohoo!

 

Net Spend. Get in!

[Royal Family]

Doesn't hurt to get the excuses in early.

 

How about engaging with what i wrote rather than going for the cheap shots? I'm far from a blind supporter of Rafa and at Christmas was convinced he needed to go ... but tell me why you expect to win the league given the financial reality I've outlined?

[philyhamann]

None of those clubs can attract the players we can. How much did we spend last summer and did any of them have any real impact? If someone goes to Chelsea over us then its a player we don't want as they are in it purely for the money.

[Barrington Womble]

they have 20m to spend because their wage budget is about 16p and they're probably going to double/triple their turnover this year. we have a massive budget, a massive turnover and have outspent everyone on transfers but chelsea since rafa has been here. i don't see where the expecations are wrong. but as the last post says, just get the excuses in early.

[Royal Family]

Woohoo!

 

Net Spend. Get in!

 

I know, i know. It is relevant though when we have the same spending power as Burnley!

 

But it's just not about spending; this is about expectations and a sense of entitlement.

[Royal Family]

they have 20m to spend because their wage budget is about 16p and they're probably going to double/triple their turnover this year. we have a massive budget, a massive turnover and have outspent everyone on transfers but chelsea since rafa has been here. i don't see where the expecations are wrong. but as the last post says, just get the excuses in early.

 

Are these figures courtesy of Alex ferguson? Extraordinary claim!

[Barrington Womble]

I know, i know. It is relevant though when we have the same spending power as Burnley!

 

But it's just not about spending; this is about expectations and a sense of entitlement.

 

 

and overall budget. we can say deggen was free. or would could say he's cost us millions. depends on how you want to spin it.

[goatboy59]

How about engaging with what i wrote rather than going for the cheap shots?

No.

[Barrington Womble]

Are these figures courtesy of Alex ferguson? Extraordinary claim!

 

someone had a website linked on here last week and in all fairness it looked pretty genuine. the only question i would have said from what i read on it was the torres fee as they had it down as £26.5m - but then that is the fee announced by athletico madrid iirc even if LFC try to spin he cost less.

[rebel23]

Man City will probably spend in the summer more than Benitez has spent in 5 years...

 

Portsmouth have also been taken over by another Arab promising the earth

 

so he does make a good point, there are plenty of teams throwing money around and eventually it will show itself in the league and results. we have seen how Chelsea bought the league

[Barrington Womble]

Man City will probably spend in the summer more than Benitez has spent in 5 years...

 

Portsmouth have also been taken over by another Arab promising the earth

 

so he does make a good point, there are plenty of teams throwing money around and eventually it will show itself in the league and results. we have seen how Chelsea bought the league

 

chelsea were starting from a position of strength though by starting in the CL. Man City and Pompey (and Sunderland come to that who are supposed to have money) can't offer that, so will spend millions on over priced players just because everyone knows they have cash to spend. The end result is the end up no better than they were to begin with 9/10. Throught the history of football there's always been odd teams who come along and throw money about, yet they normally disappear quite quickly. Rafa has no grounds to complain about what he has had to spend. He has a wage and transfer budget in probably the top half dozen in the world. To start saying "it's just the same as Burnley's budget" is just plain stupid. We probably spend more on our academies at kirkby and melwood than burnely currently spend on their entire football club.

[goatboy59]

We have the same spending power as Burnley!

 

I suppose you want us to 'engage' with that as well? :D

[philyhamann]

Compared to Burnley, not only have we already got lots of expensive players on big wages, we have just finished 2nd with 86 points. So I think having 20m to spend along with getting rid of the shite he bought last season should give us a decent wedge to spend.

 

No excuses next season please.

[Stu Monty]

Benitez gets about £25m a season at most. Wrap that up however you want but it's a fact.

[dave u]

Take Burnley's three or four top player's salaries and add it together, and Degen is probably still on more.

[Liverpool lad]

I hope we manage to beat the drop this year

[philyhamann]

Benitez gets about £25m a season at most. Wrap that up however you want but it's a fact.

 

Then maybe he should stop fucking wasting it on shit we don't need.

[Stu Monty]

Take Burnley's three or four top player's salaries and add it together, and Degen is probably still on more.

 

True. We don't want to start bringing wage bills into expectations discussions though, it might get a little bit too real for some people.

[Stu Monty]

Then maybe he should stop fucking wasting it on shit we don't need.

 

Hopefully he will do in future and we'll put together a title challenge and finish above one of the teams with way more resource than us.

 

Oh.

[INTORRESTING]

we have spent plenty but are just a bit behind in terms of time in that our methods are not quite reaping their rewards yet, i think they will next season. Fergie has a stable club and has 17 years on rafa and i think they are huge factors. People just look at the spend since rafa joined which is a bit odd, united spend far more on individuals but it is not their problem we have bun run like shite for 20 years.

 

I honestly don't think we would sign the megastars even if we were flush so i don't really look at that side of the argument either. If players join anyone outside of chelsea, united and arsenal over us then we dont want them anyway.

 

We are only a few more 10-20 mil players away imo and new investment should have done that. We are hampered and we cant compete for certain players but i am not sure we need that much more money to get to where we want to be. We are at a disadvantage but that is why we chose rafa as he can do things on less money and make us money in europe. I am not saying it is fair and he has done well getting us to where we are and it is also good to know he can take us even further imo.

 

Some of his signings have been shite and some great but i am sure if given the time of wenger and fergie especially with the expected transition in the near future re both of those teams that he can become a great at this club

[el nino laff]

Bollocks i'm a Rafa fan but he spent £40mil on shite last summer! this is fact!

His transfer dealings for forward players have been awful Babel £11.5?? i see he's overhauling the youth setup i hope he sorts out his scouts too!

[Whelan]

If you give two people 100 thousand pounds each to build a great house.

Alex already has a house but it looks like a shithole, so they spend the 100 grand doing it up, getting the best interior designers in, getting the best materials etc they will end up with a great house.

 

you have a plot of land, and will have to build the house first, before you can even start looking at decorating it.

 

I think you would be a pissed of if Alex starting saying how much better his house is than your's!

 

And to rub it in even more, imagine if your own family started pointing to Alex's house and complaining that yours is not as nice, despite that fact you spent the same amount of money!

[john23liverpool]

I would like to know how anybody thinks they know we only have £15m - £20m to spend this season. Most reds I know said the same last Summer and Rafa spent £40m.

 

Not saying I think weve got more than £20m, just saying that nobody knows except the two yanks and Rafa. Certainly not people on this or any other internet forum.