Making A Murderer

[Aventus]

Must be a massive headache for the girls family. 

 

A. Bringing all these painful memories back when they might just want to move on with their lives. 

 

B. If they think Avery did it then it'll be upsetting that he's getting all this publicity and people on his side. 

 

C. If they have doubts about Avery doing it, then they are watching a group of bent coppers being more interested in covering up and shifting blame around than actually trying to solve the murder. 

 

 

 

I'm enjoying all this though, feels like I'm watching history unfold. I'm too young to remember the OJ trial but I imagine this is what it felt like. 

[Barrington Womble]

20 hours ago, VladimirIlyich said:

I'm pretty positive neither of them did it as it was such a poor attempt at a cover up that very few places would have allowed it to happen. The second series and its dismantling over the evidence makes me 100% certain Steven Avery or Brendan Dassey had nothing at all to do with it. Other family members? Maybe.

I had no opinion after season 1 if they did it or not, I was just certain a guilty verdict was wrong. After season 2, it's pretty clear they are both innocent in my opinion. What's shocking is just how set up it is to keep people in prison.

[VladimirIlyich]

1 hour ago, Barry Wom said:

I had no opinion after season 1 if they did it or not, I was just certain a guilty verdict was wrong. After season 2, it's pretty clear they are both innocent in my opinion. What's shocking is just how set up it is to keep people in prison.

Agree. The answer to this has 36 million reasons.

To me the revelations from the retired coroner absolutely convinced me that these two were innocent.

[manwiththestick]

15 hours ago, Aventus said:

Must be a massive headache for the girls family. 

 

A. Bringing all these painful memories back when they might just want to move on with their lives. 

 

B. If they think Avery did it then it'll be upsetting that he's getting all this publicity and people on his side. 

 

C. If they have doubts about Avery doing it, then they are watching a group of bent coppers being more interested in covering up and shifting blame around than actually trying to solve the murder. 

 

 

 

I'm enjoying all this though, feels like I'm watching history unfold. I'm too young to remember the OJ trial but I imagine this is what it felt like. 

Did you watch The People vs OJ series? Obviously a dramatisation rather than documentary but still good nonetheless.

[Oh Buoy]

4 hours ago, VladimirIlyich said:

To me the revelations from the retired coroner absolutely convinced me that these two were innocent.

This for me too. I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't include the coroner or wish to intimidate her to the point of her exiting her job. You'd think as a police department, having expert opinion and analysis to support your theory would be the ultimate goal/process but it very much feels theory and selective or manipulated facts. 

 

The CD evidence entry was also further evidence of controlling the outcome of this decision. 

 

He's clearly in there because they can't show to be corrupt and deal with the massive compo claim that would come following this. It's easier for them for this to fizzle out of the public eye and be dealt with at a later date/until something happens with regards to his health/mental state. 

[Brownie]

On 10/22/2018 at 8:09 AM, VladimirIlyich said:

I think its a bit harsh to have so little sympathy for two people who are of limited intelligence and have been so obviously set up over a £36 million dollar lawsuit. I'd be ridiculously angry if I was the dead girl's parents as I'd be desperate to find the real killer(s) as there is a chance its somebody close to them.

Avery and Dassey are products of their environments but the behaviour of US law enforcement here is,once again,absolutely shocking.

I’m not talking about those two, i’m talking about the family.

 

That Brendans mum is an absolute whopper, just listen to her on that phone call.

 

They’re bad whoppers.

[VladimirIlyich]

12 minutes ago, Brownie said:

I’m not talking about those two, i’m talking about the family.

 

That Brendans mum is an absolute whopper, just listen to her on that phone call.

 

They’re bad whoppers.

I don't disagree with the fact that Brendan's Mum and Stepdad are massive whoppers. There's also a fair chance Brendan's family is highly involved in her murder,they have better motive and opportunity than Avery and Brendan. Also that revelation about the independent witness reporting the car days before it was found but that crooked Sheriff witholding information yet again. The people who should be behind bars here all hold badges.

[Brownie]

1 hour ago, VladimirIlyich said:

I don't disagree with the fact that Brendan's Mum and Stepdad are massive whoppers. There's also a fair chance Brendan's family is highly involved in her murder,they have better motive and opportunity than Avery and Brendan. Also that revelation about the independent witness reporting the car days before it was found but that crooked Sheriff witholding information yet again. The people who should be behind bars here all hold badges.

I totally agree. There’s a shitload more than reasonable doubt so there’s no way either of them should have been convicted, based on what we see from the documentary anyway.

 

I just found the scenes focusing on their families as a bit dull, the interesting stuff for me was the new testing and evidence driven by Zellner.

[VladimirIlyich]

4 minutes ago, Brownie said:

I totally agree. There’s a shitload more than reasonable doubt so there’s no way either of them should have been convicted, based on what we see from the documentary anyway.

 

I just found the scenes focusing on their families as a bit dull, the interesting stuff for me was the new testing and evidence driven by Zellner.

Yeah,the family stuff was padding but I did feel genuinely sorry for the Averys much more than the Dassey family.

[Barrington Womble]

17 hours ago, Seasons said:

This for me too. I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't include the coroner or wish to intimidate her to the point of her exiting her job. You'd think as a police department, having expert opinion and analysis to support your theory would be the ultimate goal/process but it very much feels theory and selective or manipulated facts. 

 

The CD evidence entry was also further evidence of controlling the outcome of this decision. 

 

He's clearly in there because they can't show to be corrupt and deal with the massive compo claim that would come following this. It's easier for them for this to fizzle out of the public eye and be dealt with at a later date/until something happens with regards to his health/mental state. 

I actually think it's fine that the coroner of manitowoc <sp> County wasn't involved. The County was supposed to have stepped aside. But that argument holds no water when all the major discoveries are made by manitowoc police and if I understood what the coroner was saying, it was manitowoc police who were treatening her. 

[lifetime fan]

On 10/22/2018 at 1:49 AM, Brownie said:

It made me yearn for some similar stuff so I started watching The Staircase [/b]and that has blown my mind. I think it’s even better than MaM to be honest; if you haven’t seen it, get on it.

 

Not watched it but the 5Live podcast series was excellent. 

[Brownie]

56 minutes ago, lifetime fan said:

 

Not watched it but the 5Live podcast series was excellent. 

I finished it yesterday and thought it was brilliant. The defence attorney was so good.

[VladimirIlyich]

33 minutes ago, Brownie said:

I finished it yesterday and thought it was brilliant. The defence attorney was so good.

The Staircase has genuine interest because its not a clear cut case for guilt or innocence either way.

[The Guest]

I’ve just finished the second series.  I really liked the first but I thought this was better.  Other than the first episode if it flowed more.  There were obviously the parts with the Avery family that people will find boring and understandably so but I think they were added to see the impact his incarceration has had on his family.

 

Zellner is unbelievable really.  When I first seen her appearing on twitter a few years ago I thought she just come across like an attention seeker making big claims about new evidence and solving the case just to increase her own profile.  I couldn’t have been more wrong.  People like her are a credit to her profession and the US as a whole.

 

She’s relentless and easily the highlights of the show are when she’s on screen just dropping bombs all over the place.  She’s basically solved the case for me.  When you consider the evidence contamination, the withheld evidence, the fact it was all a decade old she’s meticulously worked through it all with her staff and experts she’s selected and nailed the whole thing.

 

Despite the sickening feeling of watching an absolute travesty of justice like this it was a pleasure to watch Zellner.

 

Just one more thing.  You can absolutely guarantee that those 2 women judges on that 7 judge panel slaughtering the interview techniques will have been democrats and the rest will have been republicans.  Fucking scumbags.

[Captain Turdseye]

I finished the new series the other day. It shouldn’t have been called Making a Murderer. The new name for it should be ‘Making a Celebrity of this Woman Lawyer’

[Carvalho Diablo]

Zellner looks like Lemmy.

[Le Duan]

Ignorance, stupidity, incompetence and corruption in Hicksville USA - who would have thought it eh?

[Anubis]

17 hours ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I finished the new series the other day. It shouldn’t have been called Making a Murderer. The new name for it should be ‘Making a Celebrity of this Woman Lawyer’

Is the fact that she's a woman relevant, you sexist pig?

 

Sexist, pig. Sexist.

 

[No2]

Just finished season 2. 

 

From season 1 I thought Avery did it but no involvement from Brendan. After watching it my opinion hasn't changed. 

 

The lawyer is all about poor Steven, she doesn't give a shit about him or Teresa Halback ( who looks like Marcus Alonso). If he was in line for 36m then it's safe to say a wrongful conviction here must be worth between 100m-200m at least. Mrs 10% is looking at a mansion in  Beverly Hills with her cut. She says through out that her job is show it's possible someone else could have done it, all she has done is throw names out there. She is after a technicality that gets her paid and possibly releases a murderer. 

[liverpoolsno9]

1 hour ago, No2 said:

Just finished season 2. 

 

From season 1 I thought Avery did it but no involvement from Brendan. After watching it my opinion hasn't changed. 

 

The lawyer is all about poor Steven, she doesn't give a shit about him or Teresa Halback ( who looks like Marcus Alonso). If he was in line for 36m then it's safe to say a wrongful conviction here must be worth between 100m-200m at least. Mrs 10% is looking at a mansion in  Beverly Hills with her cut. She says through out that her job is show it's possible someone else could have done it, all she has done is throw names out there. She is after a technicality that gets her paid and possibly releases a murderer. 

And she’s done her job, she’s pretty much disproved that it didn’t happen as the State said it did. That in itself casts massive doubt to the conviction, amongst other things. Not really a ‘technicality’ though is it? It’s a massive big hole in the prosecution. They’ve just made it all up, hardly a technicality

[Bobby Hundreds]

Brendans brother Bobby is suspicious as fuck. PC held pictures of Teresa on it, it was full of violent torture porn, murder pictures, searches for DNA all of which was held back from court which is a Brady violation. There needs to be a retrial but that could potentially mean the state was wrong twice and put other convictions by that DA and police department in doubt so they are determined not to give one.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, No2 said:

Just finished season 2. 

 

From season 1 I thought Avery did it but no involvement from Brendan. After watching it my opinion hasn't changed. 

 

The lawyer is all about poor Steven, she doesn't give a shit about him or Teresa Halback ( who looks like Marcus Alonso). If he was in line for 36m then it's safe to say a wrongful conviction here must be worth between 100m-200m at least. Mrs 10% is looking at a mansion in  Beverly Hills with her cut. She says through out that her job is show it's possible someone else could have done it, all she has done is throw names out there. She is after a technicality that gets her paid and possibly releases a murderer. 

I'm surprised that your initial thoughts were that Steven Avery did it and neither season 1 or 2 have changed that in any way. It would appear that in this case the premise of the show has not really worked in it's ambition to throw doubt on the prosecution's evidence.

[Section_31]

Mrs is well into this. I took her to the Lowry last week for a Q&A with the lawyers while I sat in the bar. I've little sympathy for buck toothed Trumpville Elmer Fuddalikes, be they guilty or not. 

[Em City]

54 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

I've little sympathy for buck toothed Trumpville Elmer Fuddalikes, be they guilty or not. 

 

Bit of an odd position to take when you're constantly highlighting the role of marginalised people as a major factor of Brexit, don't you think?

[Barrington Womble]

I don't know how anyone can come to a conclusion of guilty from watching this show. This show brings nothing but doubt to the convictions. I am not saying he's innocent, as I have not seen all the evidence, but I know with absolute certainty there's no way anyone can know he's guilty from the evidence that has been displayed. And as for the comment that Zellner is there for the money - probably she is. And what? Who doesn't go to work for the money?