West Ham 3 Liverpool 1 - "Three thoughts" by Paul Natton

[s(k)aturation]

I think we're battling Tottenham and Everton for 5th/6th/7th. That is assuming that Southampton fuck off. We bought too many players, and if the excuse of bedding them all in is valid, not that it seems to apply to any other teams, then we've written off a season, because you can't sacrifice a quarter/third of the league campaign and expect to catch up.

 

I would absolutely love to be more positive, but I can't pretend. I think we're in a for a long, ultimately disappointing, season where we end up finishing 5th or 6th and everyone scratches their heads next summer thinking of a new plan. Hopefully one that doesn't involve signing 10 squad players.

 

If this is the case and we have to write off a season, it simply isn't good enough.

That would be abject failure in my book.

And I would expect it to be considered abject failure by the club.

[Paul]

Just to clarify I don't think the CBS have forgotten he to defend overnight, but this deep midfielder splitting them is a factor in this mess.

 

Hendo Lallana and another in the middle of the park. I'm tempted by Suso at this point until Allen and Can return.

 

Then chuck £30m at a rangy class act this winter, likely schneiderlin or perhaps kondogbia.

The problem isn't the "deep midfielder splitting them". It's that he's not doing that because he's being so tightly pressed. Opponents are then happy to leave the ball with our centre halves.

[TheDrowningMan]

If this is the case and we have to write off a season, it simply isn't good enough.

That would be abject failure in my book.

And I would expect it to be considered abject failure by the club.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure FSG would consider that a "time for a new manager" of a season, and it would be impossible to blame them given the amount of money that was spent over the summer. The stakes are always higher when you spend with the biggest.

[ratcatcher]

From 2nd to perhaps 12th in 6 games... it would be a genuine crisis at any other "Top 4" club.

So, if like me you were harbouring delusions of a return to this club being great, I think those of us with that delusion are entitled to call it a genuine crisis.

Unless, we've suddenly decided that we're just a mediocre side again that has simply done a bit of one-season-wonder overachieving.

Perhaps that's the reality.

We'll see.

 

Its not a genuine crisis. 1 defeat away to city was hardly unexpected whether people have ambitions for the club to be back where we consider we should be.

 

Villa havent been beaten at Anfield in 7 visits if I remember correct. Yes, I'd expect us to win that game but the last few seasons have shown they are a bit of a hoodo to us recently. whu away as was villa was a poor performance but those two defeats and performances doesnt make it a genuine crisis. In my opinion.

 

If we are in the bottom 3 after 10 league games, I'll change my point of view but until then, I think people are overreacting because of what we did last season. Fuck even on sunday supplement they were blaming our poor start to being in the CL and we've only played one fucking game.

 

Suarez was a massive loss but losing sturridge no thanks to fucking ingerlund hasnt helped either.

 

The defensive coaching at the club has been a fucking joke for years and shows no sign of improving. Lovren has had a couple of shaky games. sakho just fills me with dread every time I see his name on the teamsheet.. skrtel is just returning from injury. the centre of defence hasnt been stable.

 

No way do I think top four is disappearing over the horizon never mind almost gone. Seriously? After 5 games?

 

The manager has some work to do at Melwood, that is all. No crisis, no top four going or gone, just hard work and grind out a few results particularly away from home.

[Jairzinho]

If this is the case and we have to write off a season, it simply isn't good enough.

That would be abject failure in my book.

And I would expect it to be considered abject failure by the club.

 

And I think it would be. They did not spend all that cash to finish 6th.

[magicrat]

I thought City and Chelsea would most likely finish above us this season, and with their budget/squad there is no shame in that. After our summer's business, which I didn't think was great, I thought our slim chance of finishing above either of them turned into "nonewhatsofuckingever". Five games in and I've lost hope of us finishing above Arsenal. I also think United are more than likely going to finish above us. Their midfield is still a bit "meh", and there isn't much depth in defence, but Di Maria, van Persie, and Falcao will destroy all the shit teams. They chucked loads of money to fix their problems by essentially doing what lead to the problems they had, but it'll work again in the short term. 

 

I think we're battling Tottenham and Everton for 5th/6th/7th. That is assuming that Southampton fuck off. We bought too many players, and if the excuse of bedding them all in is valid, not that it seems to apply to any other teams, then we've written off a season, because you can't sacrifice a quarter/third of the league campaign and expect to catch up.

 

I would absolutely love to be more positive, but I can't pretend. I think we're in a for a long, ultimately disappointing, season where we end up finishing 5th or 6th and everyone scratches their heads next summer thinking of a new plan. Hopefully one that doesn't involve signing 10 squad players.

It's hard to see a much better outcome after two comprehensive defeats by teams we could reasonably expect to be languishing near the foot of the table next April .Our defense was truly shocking in the first half yesterday and its the manner of these last two performances that leave little room for optimism , We've shuffled the pack at the back to no avail and without Suarez banging them in at the other end we can't conceal the problems, I really don't think we have poor defenders but as a unit they are dreadful . Rodgers clearly doesn't have the answers so get someone in that does would seem to be the next gambit. All takes time which is why your bleak forecast is probably true, We absolutely must stay in the cup competitions.

A tame surrender to Boro on Tuesday would be completely unacceptable  

[Guest Super Sub]

Although it looks very unlikely that we have the ability to turn it round if we could take 6 points of Arsenal and a few other teams around us then come March when Arsenals season has capitulated then providing we can stop this nose dive we could still get top 4.

 

I will nail my colours to the mast and say if we beat the blue shite then we will get top 4.

[an tha]

Without wanting to jump on the 'we have lost Suarez we are fucked' bandwagon - I do think that even forgetting his 30 goals and 15 assists or whatever it was that we miss his energy and his ability to put us on the front foot from nothing.

 

How many times last season did we score or crate pressure due to him chasing a lost cause, forcing a mistake or just creating space for others, he may not have got the assist or the goal but it was his work rate, him winning a lost cause or forcing an error that began the move for the goal - we haven't got that at the mo and we are not creating pressure and are too easy to defend against.

[ZonkoVille77]

The problem isn't the "deep midfielder splitting them". It's that he's not doing that because he's being so tightly pressed. Opponents are then happy to leave the ball with our centre halves.

Spot on.

[Gym Beglin]

Ooooo, Gerrards so tightly pressed.....

 

Top class players find a way.

[Fi!]

The big problem is we could be performing like this for another month or so until Allen and Can comes back.

 

There is no player available for us to improve the midfield at the moment, unless you are willing to try on some youth player.

[jaris mullet]

It was either me or sun tzu that said ' if you play lucas you are fucked'

 

Just look again on motd at how he 'clears' the ball that leads to the 1st goal.watch how he 'defends'/tracks back.so so poor. you can even see it in just the motd highlights. he is THE worse player ive EVER seen get over 100 games plus for liverpool. i will dance a JIG when he goes.

Im all for supporting our players but not when they keep proving they have no heart and are not good enough.

 

FUCK OFF please lucas

[Guest Super Sub]

The thing is when you play Lucas is opposition players don't think they are being cautious with playing Lucas but watch out they may get you on the break. They think here's Lucas he offers nothing going forward let's put them under the cosh.

[Bjornebye]

It was either me or sun tzu that said ' if you play lucas you are fucked'

 

Just look again on motd at how he 'clears' the ball that leads to the 1st goal.watch how he 'defends'/tracks back.so so poor. you can even see it in just the motd highlights. he is THE worse player ive EVER seen get over 100 games plus for liverpool. i will dance a JIG when he goes.

Im all for supporting our players but not when they keep proving they have no heart and are not good enough.

 

FUCK OFF please lucas

 

Thats harsh. 

[Iceman]

My prediction for what it's worth is that we will be fixed when BR picks his best midfield instead of trying to build it around our ageing legend. Then we will see a return to the high press, fast break style that we need to be playing. Right now we have problems and they are plain to see. West Ham used Downing to target Gerard all day.

 

The defense has lost all confidence because they're not great but by the same margin they are not terrible, they just keep being exposed by our lack of defensive cover from midfield. It's a knock on effect that shows itself whenever we are under pressure from set pieces as well.  Lucas is not the answer. I would rather see a younger player be guided and learn than what we are currently seeing as it has no future. If Can was the future then we need a back up plan for when he's injured. Might as well do it in January and stop fucking about, we need a specialist for that position. 

 

I affects the whole game when the opposition knows you are strong there. They feel less inclined to push onto you and therefore they spend less time in positions where they can float in bewildering crosses that befuddle our poor keeper. 

[Section_31]

Our flaws this season are the same as they were last season and the season before last, the only problem is our strengths have deserted us. Shite defending and a soft centre in midfield has always been our downfall, as has our ability to vary tactics with anything other than attack, attack, attack. I think our attacking flair will return when we've got our new midfielders settled and Sturridge back, but for me, the way we play is fundamentally flawed and always has been under Rodgers, it was churlish to say so when we were pressing for the league, but we all saw those flaws.

[xerxes]

Our flaws this season are the same as they were last season and the season before last, the only problem is our strengths have deserted us. Shite defending and a soft centre in midfield has always been our downfall, as has our ability to vary tactics with anything other than attack, attack, attack. I think our attacking flair will return when we've got our new midfielders settled and Sturridge back, but for me, the way we play is fundamentally flawed and always has been under Rodgers, it was churlish to say so when we were pressing for the league, but we all saw those flaws.

I broadly agree with you.

 

Last season everything went for us, from refereeing decisions to our opponents imploding. This season normal business in returning.

 

I still rate Gerrard, but he is a declining force, and we are not adjusting to cope with that.

 

Buying the number of players that we have was also always going to be disruptive, who the hits and misses are is still unclear.

 

But perhaps the biggest loss has been Suarez. Not just his goals, but the psychological edge he gave us. His antics asked questions of opponents, his skill gave confidence to the team too. If someone cocked up, Luis would get us out of jail.

 

The World Cup was also a wake- up call, Henderson, Johnson, Sturridge , Gerrard and Sterling did not emerge as world beaters. It is the team who will need to improve, individual brilliance is in short supply, which is why Super Mario could prove such a pivotal player for us.

[s(k)aturation]

I broadly agree with you.

 

 

So it was a good post in broad.

[xerxes]

So it was a good post in broad.

A good post in full, no less!

[stringvest]

Ooooo, Gerrards so tightly pressed.....

 

Top class players find a way.

 

shut up you tedious fuckwit.  We get it.  

[Iceman]

Broadly speaking.

[Pureblood]

Gerrard looks like he has "the Slip" playing constantly on loop in his mind's eye.  Feel sorry for him, what a twat of a year he's had. He'll be glad to see the back of 2014.  

[Pureblood]

Sorry about all the double posts, my mouse is buggered. 

[Mathewbet1]

Good piece but on the side of over reaction. Its still very early in the season, yes we have been shite , but having both allen and can injured at the same time is unfortunate. I believe we have the quality in the squad to finish top 4 this season. What happens if we tonk the blueshite 5-0 are we the best team in the world again? Rogers has show his ability bounce back last season and he will do it again.

[Jairzinho]

 

The World Cup was also a wake- up call, Henderson, Johnson, Sturridge , Gerrard and Sterling did not emerge as world beaters. It is the team who will need to improve, individual brilliance is in short supply, which is why Super Mario could prove such a pivotal player for us.

 

No it wasn't.