Suicide

[Oh Buoy]

The stigma around mental health is starting to go away and hopefully this has a direct positive impact on suicide rates.

 

I'd like to agree with you on this but we're a long way away from being open about these things. 

[Carradona]

I used the word 'starting' for a reason. We have a long, long way to go but I'm seeing signs of change.

 

The company I work for have dedicated the whole month of May to raise awareness for Mental Health and have had external speakers in to talk about it.

[Creator Supreme]

It's alright I'm sure all of these extra grammar and faith school places will sort the education system out.

[Anubis]

There is a tremendous amount of pressure being placed on primary school children with SAT exams and tests. I've seen evidence of it I'm my eldest niece who, despite top grades, was worried about them. Her parents sat her down and told her that the results didn't matter and she shouldn't worry if she didn't get high pass marks because it wasn't a judgement on her. Luckily she understood this and it calmed her, but I've read some horror stories about what teachers have said to kids about SATs and the pressure they've placed on them. I really don't think anyone in government is considering the feed in to future mental health.

[Creator Supreme]

My 7 year old is just about to do sats but happily she is unconcerned by it.

[Oh Buoy]

There is a tremendous amount of pressure being placed on primary school children with SAT exams and tests. I've seen evidence of it I'm my eldest niece who, despite top grades, was worried about them. Her parents sat her down and told her that the results didn't matter and she shouldn't worry if she didn't get high pass marks because it wasn't a judgement on her. Luckily she understood this and it calmed her, but I've read some horror stories about what teachers have said to kids about SATs and the pressure they've placed on them. I really don't think anyone in government is considering the feed in to future mental health.

 

I work with 16+ but I know there are usually IAPT services based within schools (although often we seem to get teachers dropping in and breaking down which isn't nice). I can completely agree with you on the stress element around exams but also there's another part of the puzzle which is they don't often know how to communicate to their parents that they need support. Some clients have said "my mum just tries to take over the situation or tells me they aren't too difficult and not to worry" - just something for thought I guess and something I always factor into to any therapy (social/family relationships). 

[Oh Buoy]

I used the word 'starting' for a reason. We have a long, long way to go but I'm seeing signs of change.

 

The company I work for have dedicated the whole month of May to raise awareness for Mental Health and have had external speakers in to talk about it.

 

I think the hardest one to tackle is loneliness and social isolation. 

 

The services like Age UK etc are really limited and drop in sessions start at ~£17. I don't know any client is going to pay that for an hour for someone to sit in their house and speak to them about things - it's just not appropriate most of the time. 

 

So, whilst I'll agree we're starting to see more people access/refer in to services - the resources and investment are way, way behind in terms of what's required. It's almost a '1 step forward, 2 back' approach. 

[Section_31]

The reason successive governments don't pay this the attention it's due is because they've all know they're at least partly responsible by pursuing an economic model that's directly contributed to it. The idea of someone like Theresa May talking about mental health but being a fully paid up member of the zero hours fanclub for example, is laughable.

 

Community and family breakdown, constant advertising which - At its core - is all about constantly telling you there are pieces of you missing or that are wanting and need to be replaced or enhanced with purchases. There's also the - completely by design- constant threat of being made redundant or having what very little you have taken away, all feeding into not only basic feelings of insecurity, but that as a man you can't provide.

 

This is the most lonely and disparate collection of humans probably in modern human history, with very little if any sense of belonging, community, or grounding/confidence in what they feel the future may hold.

 

There used to be bargains you could strike with society, pay attention at school, stay on the right side of the law, develop a work ethic and my place in society and at least some subsistence level of survival is guaranteed, that's all gone. Everything is constantly in flux and in doubt. No doubt by design. Was chatting to an HR manager once and she said that after a big shakeup in the company they used to deliberately release internal coms designed to make those left more worried, then slowly tone it down until they felt relieved and relaxed, all to make them more maliable and satisfied with less. I've no doubt this is done on a macro scale by the government too.

[Creator Supreme]

I can't do anything today as it's the much better halfs birthday. Not even I'm cruel enough to top myself today.

[s(k)aturation]

The reason successive governments don't pay this the attention it's due is because they've all know they're at least partly responsible by pursuing an economic model that's directly contributed to it.

 

Community and family breakdown, constant advertising which - At its core - is all about constantly telling you there are pieces of you missing or that are wanting and need to be replaced or enhanced with purchases. There's also the - completely by design- constant threat of being made redundant or having what very little you have taken away, all feeding into not only basic feelings of insecurity, but that as a man you can't provide.

 

This is the most lonely and disparate collection of humans probably in modern human history, with very little if any sense of belonging, community, or grounding/confidence in what they feel the future may hold.

 

There used to be bargains you could strike with society, pay attention at school, stay on the right side of the law, develop a work ethic and my place in society and at least some substance level of survival is guaranteed, that's all gone.

 

 

This is very true.  And very sad.

 

Men, for now, are fucked.

 

But there is light at the end of the tunnel, perhaps.  Pretty soon, women will be working for women as the rule rather than the exception.  And it will be pure, unmitigated carnage.

 

Then, men will make a comeback, hopefully before it's too late for us and the world.

 

As for advertising, it's no more insidious than it's ever been.  Remember, the Rolling Stone's coined the phrase "He can't be a man cos he doesn't smoke the same cigarettes as me" in the 1960s.

 

Anyone who sets their clock by advertising has personal responsibility issues perhaps.  However, I do understand that ads might prey on the mentally challenged, but again, that's totally always been the case, not just now.

 

Fingers crossed we don't completely fuck up the next 20 years.

[Oh Buoy]

The reason successive governments don't pay this the attention it's due is because they've all know they're at least partly responsible by pursuing an economic model that's directly contributed to it.

 

Community and family breakdown, constant advertising which - At its core - is all about constantly telling you there are pieces of you missing or that are wanting and need to be replaced or enhanced with purchases. There's also the - completely by design- constant threat of being made redundant or having what very little you have taken away, all feeding into not only basic feelings of insecurity, but that as a man you can't provide.

 

This is the most lonely and disparate collection of humans probably in modern human history, with very little if any sense of belonging, community, or grounding/confidence in what they feel the future may hold.

 

There used to be bargains you could strike with society, pay attention at school, stay on the right side of the law, develop a work ethic and my place in society and at least some substance level of survival is guaranteed, that's all gone.

 

From those I've worked with, common themes I hit constantly are: 

• Work-related issues (insecurity or financial worries/management/lack of progression or purpose/stress)
• Family-related issues (relationship breakdown/disconnection from family/not having time for the family or being sole provider)
• Exams/Education stressors (unable to manage in new environments (e.g. lack of friends), unable to cope with demands of deadlines etc) 
• Loneliness/social disconnection (no sense of purpose, no direction, no support/friends)
• Bereavement/loss
• Trauma (being abused/assaulted/car incidents etc) 

A lot of this could be improved by providing a basic quality of life, that includes basic financial security, social and professional opportunities and education to improve community and family values. It's not difficult when you see the common stressor people struggle to deal with on a daily basis and the saddening part is, should those be put in place, we'd see a richer and more prosperous economy and society. 

 

I can't do anything today as it's the much better halfs birthday. Not even I'm cruel enough to top myself today.

 

Mate, if you need support, please give one of the helplines a call. 

 

• Saneline  0300 304 7000 (6pm to 11pm every day)
• NHS Direct 111
• Samaritans  08457 90 90 90 (national helpline) or 116 123 (Free phone national helpline – this number will not show on phone bill

[Creator Supreme]

Thanks mate I appreciate it, but I'm done. The only thing that's still holding me back is my overriding fear of death, I just need to get past that but it's going to take a while as the fear is huge.

[Oh Buoy]

Thanks mate I appreciate it, but I'm done. The only thing that's still holding me back is my overriding fear of death, I just need to get past that but it's going to take a while as the fear is huge.

 

Send me a message and we'll have a chat. 

[Elite]

Thanks mate I appreciate it, but I'm done. The only thing that's still holding me back is my overriding fear of death, I just need to get past that but it's going to take a while as the fear is huge.

Think of your wife and kids mate, you doing something stupid will ruin their lives. You'll get through whatever you are going through eventually, just keep going and distract yourself with a hobby, running, art, anything.

 

Edit: Chat with Buoy, he sounds like he's knows his stuff.

[Strontium]

The reason successive governments don't pay this the attention it's due is because they've all know they're at least partly responsible by pursuing an economic model that's directly contributed to it. The idea of someone like Theresa May talking about mental health but being a fully paid up member of the zero hours fanclub for example, is laughable.

 

Community and family breakdown, constant advertising which - At its core - is all about constantly telling you there are pieces of you missing or that are wanting and need to be replaced or enhanced with purchases. There's also the - completely by design- constant threat of being made redundant or having what very little you have taken away, all feeding into not only basic feelings of insecurity, but that as a man you can't provide.

 

This is the most lonely and disparate collection of humans probably in modern human history, with very little if any sense of belonging, community, or grounding/confidence in what they feel the future may hold.

 

There used to be bargains you could strike with society, pay attention at school, stay on the right side of the law, develop a work ethic and my place in society and at least some subsistence level of survival is guaranteed, that's all gone. Everything is constantly in flux and in doubt. No doubt by design. Was chatting to an HR manager once and she said that after a big shakeup in the company they used to deliberately release internal coms designed to make those left more worried, then slowly tone it down until they felt relieved and relaxed, all to make them more maliable and satisfied with less. I've no doubt this is done on a macro scale by the government too.

Come on. I read some nonsense, but this takes the biscuit. People in this country have never had less to worry about.

 

Folk in the developing world have real worries, like will they earn enough to have a meal today, or will they be eaten by a lion while carting water back from the well 6 miles away.

 

Meanwhile your average Brit's biggest worry is hoping they don't look like they have a double chin in their latest Instagram selfie.

[Strontium]

A compelling rebuttal, in full.

[s(k)aturation]

A compelling rebuttal, in full.

 

 

In fairness, mate, yours was a fairly facile and cynical post responded to by a facile, cynical post.

 

Yes, it was was argumentum ad hominem, but one could argue you invited it.

 

This is a thread related to the issue of people taking their own lives.  It's a fair bet to assume that the discussions will be more serious than not.

 

Double chins, selfies?  Nah.

[Jim Lahey]

Come on. I read some nonsense, but this takes the biscuit. People in this country have never had less to worry about.

 

Folk in the developing world have real worries, like will they earn enough to have a meal today, or will they be eaten by a lion while carting water back from the well 6 miles away.

 

Meanwhile your average Brit's biggest worry is hoping they don't look like they have a double chin in their latest Instagram selfie.

Bollocks, so no matter what goes on in this country, everyone should just be happy because someone is worse off elsewhere? I think your average Brit has plenty of worries and isn't remotely arsed about instagram

[Strontium]

In fairness, mate, yours was a fairly facile and cynical post responded to by a facile, cynical post.

But look at what I was responding to in the first place.

 

I hate suicide, but pretending it's got some rational basis is ludicrous. Most of the time it's a wholly irrational act, and any attempt to somehow justify it by claiming that we're really shat on in this country is poisonous.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Stay strong CS mate.

[Oh Buoy]

Granted various situations, environments and social factors bring different challenges and problems. 

 

But to invalidate a mental health concern over incomparable variables shows narrow-mindedness and an inept understanding of suicide. 

 

Having more opportunities in the UK does not mean your problems are in any way, less valid or should be treated any differently. It is still a person unable to overcome a challenge with the most dangerous outcome. 

[littletedwest]

Your next line has to be partridge

[s(k)aturation]

But look at what I was responding to in the first place.

 

I hate suicide, but pretending it's got some rational basis is ludicrous. Most of the time it's a wholly irrational act, and any attempt to somehow justify it by claiming that we're really shat on in this country is poisonous.

 

 

Mate, I would argue that suicide can be one of the most rational decisions one might ever make in one's life.

 

The decision to stop living can, in some instances, take years, decades of talking oneself into it, rationally.

 

If you were emotional and heartfelt about it, for instance, you would never do it to your children, you wife, your parents etc...

 

I'm no psychologist of course, and neither are you,

 

I think suicide can be very very rational.

 

eg. I can't provide for my children, I'm a shit father, I let people down, I don't like myself and neither do others because of this this this and this.

 

All potentially, in the mind of the suicider, very fucking rationale sadly.

 

You're barking up the wrong tree here, Stronts, in my book.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Emotive thread. Strong views. At the end of the day one of our own reached out, he needs help.

 

Crisis Team CS mate.

[Section_31]

Come on. I read some nonsense, but this takes the biscuit. People in this country have never had less to worry about.

 

Folk in the developing world have real worries, like will they earn enough to have a meal today, or will they be eaten by a lion while carting water back from the well 6 miles away.

 

Meanwhile your average Brit's biggest worry is hoping they don't look like they have a double chin in their latest Instagram selfie.

To be fair your response was entirely predictable on that score, I could have written it for you. You're not stupid you're just the great contrarian when it comes to political threads and posts.