Pundits

[VladimirIlyich]

10 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Depends what aspect of the game you're talking about. Happy to listen to journalists talk about everything else about the game 'except' the playing side, because they know fuck all about it.

 

If Richardson was sat there going 'yeah. Salah should have put that away really but he dropped his shoulder and just didn't catch it right with the inside of his boot' you'd surely be like 'what the fuck?'. 

 

Imagine if coverage of the champions league final was given by a pundit who'd played no higher than, say, the second division.

 

"There'll be a lot going through their minds before kick off, I remember the feeling from the Dulux cup final against Tunbridge Wells FC"

 

How do you become a coach then? Do you have to have played the game at the highest lecel to understand it? I've been on coaching courses with ex players who were worse than recreational coaches. I disagree with your assessment and feel anybody,provided they understand the game,can be a good analyst or coach within the game. Having played just opens doors easier,even though those doors should be shut to a few of them. 

[gkmacca]

38 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Depends what aspect of the game you're talking about. Happy to listen to journalists talk about everything else about the game 'except' the playing side, because they know fuck all about it.

 

If Richardson was sat there going 'yeah. Salah should have put that away really but he dropped his shoulder and just didn't catch it right with the inside of his boot' you'd surely be like 'what the fuck?'. 

 

Imagine if coverage of the champions league final was given by a pundit who'd played no higher than, say, the second division.

 

"There'll be a lot going through their minds before kick off, I remember the feeling from the Dulux cup final against Tunbridge Wells FC"

 

I agree.

 

My preference is simply for the most interesting and insightful pundits possible. Which is why I rarely turn the TV on before kickoff. 

 

If they're good, use them. If they're not, don't. But TV doesn't work like that. The producers go for someone to get the tweets flowing, someone to bring some faux gravitas and someone to tick the right boxes. 

 

As far as the women are concerned, they're not helped at all by the desperation shown by the male production teams to support them - for example, an argument that would be roundly mocked if made by a male gets listened to reverentially when made by, say, the preening Alex Scott. Then there's unearned arrogance, such as when (yes, her again) Alex Scott, patronisingly 'explains' what a low press is to none other than Graeme Souness - now, if a male ex-player for, say, Oxford United did that, the sheer impudence of it would be noted rather than merely accepted. And then there's probably the worst aspect: the main presenter pushing the female pundit to go where she lacks the right experience to go, such as asking her 'what it's like' to play in a huge game like a CL final when, for all of her caps won before the women's game was hyped, she's never played in such a massive stadium with so many fans and so much coverage and so much pressure - it's like asking the same question of a male player who once played in a Paint Trophy final. The men's game, in a media sense, is still using women far more than the other way round.

 

Having said that, someone like Karen Carney strikes me as the best new(ish) pundit in years - she just talks about what she really knows, makes far better observations far more often than most male pundits and also comes up with some genuinely insightful anecdotes. 

 

But pundits in general seem more and more pointless these days. They were okay when you'd get, say, ten minutes of them before and after, but now (especially if the mancs have lost) you'll get more than an HOUR of them. It's like the kind of painfully forced and aimless chat you get if a train's been delayed and everyone is stuck waiting.

[Barrington Womble]

22 minutes ago, VladimirIlyich said:

How do you become a coach then? Do you have to have played the game at the highest lecel to understand it? I've been on coaching courses with ex players who were worse than recreational coaches. I disagree with your assessment and feel anybody,provided they understand the game,can be a good analyst or coach within the game. Having played just opens doors easier,even though those doors should be shut to a few of them. 

I think it depends what level you're working at. I think it's essential that someone talking about what's in front of us has some idea of the experience. It's the insight they bring. Fan podcasts, things like Sunday supplement or whatever it was called, they can be used to get differing opinions. The real issue here is the TV companies are as careless about hiring ex-top level pros as they are about hiring women today. They don't really care "he played for Liverpool, so he'll do. She's a random bird who played footy in front of 8 people, she'll do to show we believe women's football is equal". They care little about their contribution. 

[aRdja]

Football in truth isn’t very complex. Most of us can see what’s going on, but we’re just not talented or gifted enough to play the game. Most of ex pros have pretty basic education level if that, and they probably don’t think about the game in that a much more deeper level than most punters. I’d listen to the likes of Jonathan Liew, Barney Ronay and Rory Smith before most ex pros.

[gkmacca]

31 minutes ago, aRdja said:

Football in truth isn’t very complex. Most of us can see what’s going on, but we’re just not talented or gifted enough to play the game. Most of ex pros have pretty basic education level if that, and they probably don’t think about the game in that a much more deeper level than most punters. I’d listen to the likes of Jonathan Liew, Barney Ronay and Rory Smith before most ex pros.

I don't know. Good writers aren't necessarily good talkers. For better or worse there's a performance aspect to punditry. You need to be a bit of a show-off. And actually, if you look at the late night first edition match reports, most of these said writers do their least interesting work when the reaction is more or less immediate. They're much better when they've had time to reflect, which is what pundits don't have.

 

The one thing that would improve any group of pundits is having a really good journalist as host. The likes of Sky care least about that aspect and just seem to appoint someone who's wandered in from the nearest estate agents. But all pundits would improve if pressed by an 'outsider' with good journalisic instincts.

 

Des Lynam was excellent because he'd stop the ex-pros from being too insular. He'd know what viewers were curious about and make them address those themes and issues (often to their great surprise). 

 

Lineker, for all the self-hype, isn't much good. He seems, rather bizarrely, to believe he's an intellectual, whereas he's too much like his fellow ex-pros, ignoring stuff that viewers might be interested in and over-indulging the 'bantz'. 

 

And when you do get decent pundits, like Hansen or Souness, they end up turning into cliches because no one really pushes them. Keane, for example, would be good if challenged, but as it is he's been left to turn into this cartoon 'Mr Angry' figure whose opinions can be predicted so easily he may as well not be there. 

 

A good journalist as presenter, that would help.

[Vincent Vega]

Fara Williams on Match Of The Day 2. In the immutable words of Phil Anselmo “Is there no standard anymore?”.

[Reckoner]

These days Richard Keys looks like a snowman dressed up as Mrs Doubtfire. Here is a clip of him being a cock.

 

[Barrington Womble]

17 minutes ago, Reckoner said:

These days Richard Keys looks like a snowman dressed up as Mrs Doubtfire. Here is a clip of him being a cock.

 

You'd wonder what bein sports see in him and Gray . 

[manwiththestick]

He's a prick, always has been but it seems being out of the limelight has made him even worse.

[waddy78]

29 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

You'd wonder what bein sports see in him and Gray . 

Those middle east countries approve of male shovanists, 

[Elite]

Keys is a proper weird bloke. 

[manwiththestick]

58 minutes ago, Elite said:

Keys is a proper weird bloke. 

Bet you his hard drive is dodgy.

[gkmacca]

13 hours ago, manwiththestick said:

Bet you his hard drive is dodgy.

I bet it's flaccid.

[gkmacca]

15 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

You'd wonder what bein sports see in him and Gray . 

He epitomises a lot of what went wrong with the game once Sky took it over - hype, pomposity, entitlement, schoolmasterly faux-seriousness and an utter lack of genuine joy in what is, at heart, just a fuclking game. I remember when a manager, after a bad defeat, refused to come out for the ritualistic humiliating interview with Geoff Shreeves, and Keys was indignant that the slaves weren't doing their masters' bidding. He helped invert the coverage of the game so the important people were the ones sitting on their backsides talking about what was happening down on the pitch, like a bunch of gammons gazing at their koi carp. He's a profoundly nasty piece of work and always has been.

[Barrington Womble]

1 minute ago, gkmacca said:

He epitomises a lot of what went wrong with the game once Sky took it over - hype, pomposity, entitlement, schoolmasterly faux-seriousness and an utter lack of genuine joy in what is, at heart, just a fuclking game. I remember when a manager, after a bad defeat, refused to come out for the ritualistic humiliating interview with Geoff Shreeves, and Keys was indignant that the slaves weren't doing their masters' bidding. He helped invert the coverage of the game so the important people were the ones sitting on their backsides talking about what was happening down on the pitch, like a bunch of gammons gazing at their koi carp. He's a profoundly nasty piece of work and always has been.

And unreasonably hairy too. 

[lifetime fan]

Listening to the Guardian Football Weekly podcast - How to fix football with Gary Neville. 
 

What a lying, two faced, hypocritical, smug, up his own arse, fucking cunt he really is. 

[KMD7]

42 minutes ago, lifetime fan said:

Listening to the Guardian Football Weekly podcast - How to fix football with Gary Neville. 
 

What a lying, two faced, hypocritical, smug, up his own arse, fucking cunt he really is. 

I despise him.

[Bjornebye]

Prick 

 

 

 

 

[lifetime fan]

Speaking of cunts, Gabby Logan has pissed off the ape. 
 

I’d love to see him actually take this down the legal path. He’d be laughed out of court. 
 

 

 

Richard Keys considering legal action vs Gabby Logan over "wildly inaccurate allegations". 
 

Richard Keys has referred an extract from Gabby Logan's memoir to his lawyers "with a view to proceeding with libel action" over what he describes as "wildly inaccurate allegations".

 

The former Sky Sports presenter, 65, alleges Logan, 49, has defamed his reputation with claims he and long-time colleague Andy Gray joked about refusing to have sex with pregnant women. In her memoir, serialised by the Mail on Sunday, Logan wrote that Keys and Gray made the comments within her earshot on a flight to Istanbul for the 2005 Champions League final, while she was seven months pregnant with twins.

 

Asked by Keys what he thought of pregnant women, Logan recounts that Gray said: "I'm afraid I don't find them very attractive, Richard. In fact, I never slept with my wife when she was pregnant with our kids."

 

Logan then recalled Keys allegedly asking whether that meant Gray "didn't have sex", to which his the Scot purportedly replied: "No, I didn't say that, Richard."
 

BBC presenter Logan claims the duo "laughed their heads off at their little 'comedy' routine", which left her "embarrassed" and she regarded as "cruel, bearing in mind they both had children and wives of their own".

 

She also described Keys and Gray as "dinosaurs, waiting to become extinct". The former has responded to Logan's allegations on social media, confirming he is considering taking legal action against the four-time Sports Presenter of the Year.

 

On Saturday night, Keys wrote on Twitter: "With reference to an article published by The Mail on Sunday written by Ms Gabby Logan. Ms Logan has made a number of wildly inaccurate allegations in the process of defaming my reputation. I have referred the matter to lawyers with a view to proceeding with libel action."

 

In her memoir, Logan also discussed how Keys played a role in her getting a job with Sky Sports in 1996. While covering a Premier League fixture between Newcastle United and Tottenham Hotspur, she received a business card from a cameraman containing Keys' name and phone number, and was told he wanted her to contribute to "a show about women in sport".

 

However, upon calling Keys, he apologised for his "fib" as there was, in truth, no such show in the works. Instead, Logan was told that Sky Sports were keen to "recruit more women" and Keys hoped to introduce her to his bosses at the broadcaster.

[Mark M]

Keys having another pop back.

I have to admit I enjoy reading his blogs he's so deluded and up his own arse - there was one recently where he was praising himself on the work he's done for women in football.. he's got Trump levels of delusion.

 

https://richardajkeys.com/index.php/blog/342-something-completely-different

 

 

[lifetime fan]

Nor did I deliver the taunt that left her ‘dying inside’. I was surprised to read that description, bearing in mind how Gabby’s family have been affected by real tragedy of that nature.

 

 

What an absolute piece of fucking shite he is. 

[Jarvinja Ilnow]

4 hours ago, lifetime fan said:

Speaking of cunts, Gabby Logan has pissed off the ape. 
 

I’d love to see him actually take this down the legal path. He’d be laughed out of court. 
 

 

 

Richard Keys considering legal action vs Gabby Logan over "wildly inaccurate allegations". 
 

Richard Keys has referred an extract from Gabby Logan's memoir to his lawyers "with a view to proceeding with libel action" over what he describes as "wildly inaccurate allegations".

 

The former Sky Sports presenter, 65, alleges Logan, 49, has defamed his reputation with claims he and long-time colleague Andy Gray joked about refusing to have sex with pregnant women. In her memoir, serialised by the Mail on Sunday, Logan wrote that Keys and Gray made the comments within her earshot on a flight to Istanbul for the 2005 Champions League final, while she was seven months pregnant with twins.

 

Asked by Keys what he thought of pregnant women, Logan recounts that Gray said: "I'm afraid I don't find them very attractive, Richard. In fact, I never slept with my wife when she was pregnant with our kids."

 

Logan then recalled Keys allegedly asking whether that meant Gray "didn't have sex", to which his the Scot purportedly replied: "No, I didn't say that, Richard."
 

BBC presenter Logan claims the duo "laughed their heads off at their little 'comedy' routine", which left her "embarrassed" and she regarded as "cruel, bearing in mind they both had children and wives of their own".

 

She also described Keys and Gray as "dinosaurs, waiting to become extinct". The former has responded to Logan's allegations on social media, confirming he is considering taking legal action against the four-time Sports Presenter of the Year.

 

On Saturday night, Keys wrote on Twitter: "With reference to an article published by The Mail on Sunday written by Ms Gabby Logan. Ms Logan has made a number of wildly inaccurate allegations in the process of defaming my reputation. I have referred the matter to lawyers with a view to proceeding with libel action."

 

In her memoir, Logan also discussed how Keys played a role in her getting a job with Sky Sports in 1996. While covering a Premier League fixture between Newcastle United and Tottenham Hotspur, she received a business card from a cameraman containing Keys' name and phone number, and was told he wanted her to contribute to "a show about women in sport".

 

However, upon calling Keys, he apologised for his "fib" as there was, in truth, no such show in the works. Instead, Logan was told that Sky Sports were keen to "recruit more women" and Keys hoped to introduce her to his bosses at the broadcaster.

Legally, isn't it just going to be a "she said/ ape said" issue? No proof either way. Keys can't really rely on witnesses for his 'good character' either. 

[sir roger]

6 hours ago, lifetime fan said:

Listening to the Guardian Football Weekly podcast - How to fix football with Gary Neville. 

What a lying, two faced, hypocritical, smug, up his own arse, fucking cunt he really is. 

Unusual intro from the Guarniad that one.

[El Rojo]

5 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

Prick 

 

 

 

 

He’s an absolute weapon. 
 

Giving it the big one about the evils of the European Super League, yet not a single whisper from him on what happened football fans in Paris in May. Awful little scrote.

[DJLJ]

On 03/10/2022 at 13:07, lifetime fan said:

Listening to the Guardian Football Weekly podcast - How to fix football with Gary Neville. 
 

What a lying, two faced, hypocritical, smug, up his own arse, fucking cunt he really is. 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gary-neville-to-be-world-cup-pundit-for-bein-sport-despite-criticism-of-qatar-0d5rmb9b8

 

Fucking hypocrite