Jamie Carragher and the tits who think he has too much power.

[Cardie]

But there is still a real undercurrent of nastiness towards Hodgson, something which overall I feel is worse. Nothing quite as extreme as death threats, but there's just a very bad feeling about him.

 

in what possible way is Roy's treatment worse?

 

Especially when the majority of the abuse has been aimed at the fact he's fucking shit at being Liverpool manager, an opinion backed up by his performance so far both on and off the pitch.

 

Previous two managers have come in for far worse abuse, hodgsons doesn't even come close.

[ritchie]

I could go on for pages and pages about how I think you're wrong on Carragher not being manager material. But I won't.

 

You're wrong.

 

I'd genuinely like to know why then. I'm doubtful that he's management material, i'd like to be proved wrong.

[ritchie]

in what possible way is Roy's treatment worse?

 

Especially when the majority of the abuse has been aimed at the fact he's fucking shit at being Liverpool manager, an opinion backed up by his performance so far both on and off the pitch.

 

Previous two managers have come in for far worse abuse, hodgsons doesn't even come close.

 

Rafa got absoloute dogs abuse last season on here. Houllier got slaughtered on this forum day in, day out during his last 18 months in charge.

 

It's revisionism at best to suggest Hodgson has took worse stick than those two got. As stated, though, it's just more prominent these days because of the facebook and twitter generation. But the abuse Houllier and Benitez took on fan forums - on here for one - was every bit as bad as anything Hodgson's had.

[JohnnyH]

I can see that people are starting to get bundled into "Pro Carragher" and "Anti Carragher" groupings. Why does it always have to go like that on this site? It's ridiculous. Can't people love Carra while at the same time acknowledging his faults without being labelled as "disrespectful" or "ungrateful"?

 

Yep. It'll be like the Rafa thing last season. If you agreed with some decision then you were immediately "blind 100% support of Rafa". I was accused of that so many times it really it actually got annoying; which I appreciate was the agenda of some.

 

And I can see exactly what you are saying here happening also. I've actually gone to write a quick quip about Carra on a few posts. One that I'd write about any player at any time as it would just be a daft little joke; but I've stopped myself as I know some will accuse me of been anti-Carra when that is anything but the truth.

 

I see it so often where a comment is made and it is compeltely left alone as quite a few clearly seem to think it is not worth passing comment on a poor Carra performance or decision because of the attack that follows from some. People are actually nervous to mention him in anything other then a heavenly light for fear of what they will be accused of. What is even funnier is that I'm willing to bet that Carra himself would find this kind of thing daft.

[TheResonator]

I think whether or not Carragher would be a good manager remains to be seen. I will ask this, though: if he has a great deal of tactical nous, why does he play long balls so often?

[ngogswilly]

Yep. It'll be like the Rafa thing last season. If you agreed with some decision then you were immediately "blind 100% support of Rafa". I was accused of that so many times it really it actually got annoying; which I appreciate was the agenda of some.

 

And I can see exactly what you are saying here happening also. I've actually gone to write a quick quip about Carra on a few posts. One that I'd write about any player at any time as it would just be a daft little joke; but I've stopped myself as I know some will accuse me of been anti-Carra when that is anything but the truth.

 

I see it so often where a comment is made and it is compeltely left alone as quite a few clearly seem to think it is not worth passing comment on a poor Carra performance or decision because of the attack that follows from some. People are actually nervous to mention him in anything other then a heavenly light for fear of what they will be accused of. What is even funnier is that I'm willing to bet that Carra himself would find this kind of thing daft.

 

Just summed up exactly how I feel there Johnny.

[goatboy59]

Nobody can spot who'll make a decent coach and who won't.

 

I think we can spot those who don't want it to happen.

[Guest davelfc]

I'd genuinely like to know why then. I'm doubtful that he's management material, i'd like to be proved wrong.

 

If you're still here in about 10 years I'll have my proof.

[Moo]

in what possible way is Roy's treatment worse?

 

Especially when the majority of the abuse has been aimed at the fact he's fucking shit at being Liverpool manager, an opinion backed up by his performance so far both on and off the pitch.

 

Previous two managers have come in for far worse abuse, hodgsons doesn't even come close.

 

I can only assume that to some people it seems worse because of how soon into the job Roy is getting his stick.

What those poeple don't seem to want to recognise is the reasons why he's getting stick so soon, i.e. his quite frankly terrible performance as a manager and some of the horrible shit he's spouted - the latter for me making any stick he gets understandable.

 

As for Carragher, sometimes I wish he'd keep his gob shut. But then sometimes I wish he'd let rip, you know like if he'd have mouthed off against the former owners - perhaps then he'd get more leeway about having his say on other matters.

[stringvest]

I think whether or not Carragher would be a good manager remains to be seen. I will ask this, though: if he has a great deal of tactical nous, why does he play long balls so often?

 

because he has no faith in those immediately in front of him to make themselves available for a pass or to retain the ball?

[JohnnyH]

I think whether or not Carragher would be a good manager remains to be seen. I will ask this, though: if he has a great deal of tactical nous, why does he play long balls so often?

 

I also have a great deal of tactical knowledge, and you should fuckin' see me welly the thing the length of the pitch when I'm playing at the back.

 

Carra knows his limitations and is a no nonsense defender. Yes, he tends to use the clear it first mentality a bit too much, but that doesn't make him tactically naive, just over careful on occasion.

 

I agree with you on the coach thing though. It actually annoys me when people call for Carra as a manager as no one can tell if he is going to good. I hope he manages at a level lower before getting his chance with us. It'd be gret if he turned out to be good enough.

[Best Believe It]

because he has no faith in those immediately in front of him to make themselves available for a pass or to retain the ball?

 

When we had Mascherano and Alonso in the team was he pinging the ball around?

 

He's not that sort of player. He's not a cultured, ball-playing centre-back. He's very much from the safety-first model of centre-back. Last minute challenges, throwing himself in front of the ball, punting it into row z. It doesn't mean he's shit, it just means that's how he plays.

[ritchie]

If you're still here in about 10 years I'll have my proof.

 

I'm just interested to see a list of attributes that'll make Jamie Carragher a top manager.

[stringvest]

Rafa got absoloute dogs abuse last season on here. Houllier got slaughtered on this forum day in, day out during his last 18 months in charge.

 

It's revisionism at best to suggest Hodgson has took worse stick than those two got. As stated, though, it's just more prominent these days because of the facebook and twitter generation. But the abuse Houllier and Benitez took on fan forums - on here for one - was every bit as bad as anything Hodgson's had.

 

I don't think it is revisionism. I think the volume and the level of venom of stick Hodgson is getting is orders of magnitude greater than that which Benitez and Houllier enjoyed. Part of this of course is down to the relentless stream of shite we have seen under Hodgson, but the same is true of the previous managers.

 

A lot of it isn't though. It's because people are either brokenhearted over Benitez going, or they can't comprehend that at the time Hodgson was brought in we were only ever going to bring in an interim manager - one who would not rock the boat while the club was being sold, and one who would be happy to work with a limited transfer budget and other resources. We all know that to date that hasn't gone well, but no-one needs the level of abuse.

[stringvest]

When we had Mascherano and Alonso in the team was he pinging the ball around?

 

He's not that sort of player. He's not a cultured, ball-playing centre-back. He's very much from the safety-first model of centre-back. Last minute challenges, throwing himself in front of the ball, punting it into row z. It doesn't mean he's shit, it just means that's how he plays.

 

I agree with you, but while there was plenty of hoofing during the Houllier and Benitez years, it's safe to say he felt more confident in laying the ball off to Alonso.

[Best Believe It]

I agree with you, but while there was plenty of hoofing during the Houllier and Benitez years, it's safe to say he felt more confident in laying the ball off to Alonso.

 

He may well have done, but I didn't see any change in his play whoever was in midfield. The only reason he's hoofing more this season, as far as I can tell, is that we're sitting deeper, inviting more pressure, and giving him less time to play the ball out of danger.

 

Plus Hodgson does like long-ball tactics.

[Cardie]

 

I don't think it is revisionism. I think the volume and the level of venom of stick Hodgson is getting is orders of magnitude greater than that which Benitez and Houllier enjoyed. Part of this of course is down to the relentless stream of shite we have seen under Hodgson, but the same is true of the previous managers.

 

A lot of it isn't though. It's because people are either brokenhearted over Benitez going, or they can't comprehend that at the time Hodgson was brought in we were only ever going to bring in an interim manager - one who would not rock the boat while the club was being sold, and one who would be happy to work with a limited transfer budget and other resources. We all know that to date that hasn't gone well, but no-one needs the level of abuse.

 

Bullshit.

 

If you think saying he's shit at his job or he's a cunt is orders of magnitude worse than 'I hope you die of aids' painted on walls then you're mental.

 

Either that or you were so glad that houllier and Benitez left you can't comprehend how hodgson could be worse and refuse to accept that's the case.

[SCOUSE TAPAS]

Agree with all that tbh. The personal abuse Rafa took last season by reds - on here as much as anywhere - was a disgrace.

 

I never slagged him off once,but I can see why alot did,it s called emotions and a love of Liverpool football club.

 

Rafa had lost the plot big time(still has judging by his decision to admire Bales destruction of his side instead of trying to stop it).

 

He had stopped doing his job with us and started fighting with everyone at the club.He began to believe in the hype(which us as fans helped to create)about himself.

 

He was at a point of no return with everything to do with the club from youth upwards having to go through him.

 

It was becoming Rafa fc, with a brand of football we still have with us now unfortunately.

 

No one is bigger than the club.

 

Dont believe the hype springs to mind,more so when it involves yourself.

[goatboy59]

How did graffiti and death threat (singular) suddenly become a collective action?

[stringvest]

Spot on there chops. I have three questions:

 

1. Who/What was moschops I?

 

2. Now this may wind a few people up, but I think it's a valid and interesting question for any of our supporters, but what the fuck caused the disintegration between Carra & Benitez? Never mind who did what or who spoke to who, or who ate the jaffa cakes, but if we accept there was a parting of the ways, what the fuck caused it, I know last season was a nightmare, but for fucks sake they achieved so much together. Look at Ayestaran, he got the boot for sneaking into Mourinho's hovel when the lights were out, but what caused the mighty schism between Carra and Benitez? maybe we'll never know, but it's interesting all the same. St John had a big fall out with Shanks, by all accounts, at the end of his time at liverpool, he felt he had more to give, Shanks didn't. Again, Im not shit stirring here, but simply interested, my theory is it may have been to do with Benitez's dealings with Robbie Keane, he and Carra seemed to be pretty matey, he was treated pretty shoddily - for whatever reasons the manager decided - and was bombed out, was this the final straw behind Carragher and Benitez's approach?

 

3. This one is particularly for Dr Dre & the SWA, how would you feel, should our vice captain do his coaching badges, do a stint as reserve coach, then get the opportunity to manage the shite. With his character and determination, especially if we had a young manager who was doing the business, this could be a definite possibility in the future. Now would you, beg him to stay (which he may disregard given certain circumstances), castigate him as a leper and a turncoat and thus someone who should never have been given so much power at Liverpool, and was never a true red, or wish him well bar the derbies, thank him for what he achieved, and good luck in the conference.

 

3. is of course hypothetical, and I maybe accused of setting up a lIverpool great for a fall, but our captain went on to become one of, arguably, the greatest managers of the 20th century at our arch rivals. The boy genius who did so much with a liverbird on his chest, also joined the shower of shite, so we can never say never. For me this is the reason why it is the club, only the club. Sure we have great players and managers who we grow attached to, but they are purely transient, even when Kenny went blackburn, sure they were the next team you looked for results wise, to see how he was going. Kenny returned, hopefully carra, can stay with the club, and help push it forward, but equally he may look to opportunities elsewhere, and that is his right, at the end of the day, he does this to pay the rent, we all do it because we're fucked up eejits, still following the dream of being able to achieve half of what he has.

 

Don't know about Q1, but in answer to Q2 I believe it was attritional - with Carragher and others at the club. In answer to Q3 - I would always wish Carragher luck. He has epitomised the good things about this club for a decade. He's done his time, and deserves our respect and good wishes.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

Don't you guys know, you can't talk about Carragher or Gerrard in anything other than a good light?

 

Criticism about things you visibly see on the pitch is fine, things you hear on the internet are not. It's all hearsay.

 

The point has been made about rumours by a few (Dirty Sanchez I think) about Rafa last season. They were all passed off here by many as true. It's also been highlighted that it could have only come from one or two people as reports that came out were from people who had close access to those people.

 

Now Carragher, and Gerrard, are not as clean and innocent as most people on here like to believe, however a lot of politics was happening at the club last season and it got further than it ever needed to go.

 

A lot of people involved last season did not cover themselves in any sort of glory and should learn from that and make sure it never happens again. I said on many an occassion the Liverpool Way was dead, and that is down to the previous owners, manager, players and us the fans. Nobody was right in any of it, they were all wrong.

 

And to be honest I don't think it will ever be the same again.

[Cardie]

How did graffiti and death threat (singular) suddenly become a collective action?

 

Because having to type out all the threats, times he was called a cancer etc would get pretty boring?

 

Let's not pretend this abuse of previous managers was isolated. From death threats to accusations of corruption and everything in between hodgson has seen very little of it.

[stringvest]

Bullshit.

 

If you think saying he's shit at his job or he's a cunt is orders of magnitude worse than 'I hope you die of aids' painted on walls then you're mental.

 

Either that or you were so glad that houllier and Benitez left you can't comprehend how hodgson could be worse and refuse to accept that's the case.

 

How many messages were painted on walls? Did not everyone come out and condemn the idiot that did that? Of course they did. Of course I was glad Houllier and Benitez left, but I can also comprehend how Hodgson might be worse. Sorry if that's not binary enough for you.

[Cardie]

 

How many messages were painted on walls? Did not everyone come out and condemn the idiot that did that? Of course they did. Of course I was glad Houllier and Benitez left, but I can also comprehend how Hodgson might be worse. Sorry if that's not binary enough for you.

 

So you credit yourself with the ability but everyone else isn't capable.

 

Still doesn't explain how The hodgson abuse (right or wrong) is worse than that aimed at other managers.

[stringvest]

He may well have done, but I didn't see any change in his play whoever was in midfield. The only reason he's hoofing more this season, as far as I can tell, is that we're sitting deeper, inviting more pressure, and giving him less time to play the ball out of danger.

 

Plus Hodgson does like long-ball tactics.

 

I agree we're playing deeper most of the time. Hodgson used to like Danny Murphy in his team though. Some people on here believe he is a ball playing midfielder, and is responsible for making Fulham tick. He's put plenty of other ball players in his team too, and wingers. Hodgson does like long ball tactics, but I think he likes short ball tactics too.