Coronavirus

[Strontium]

18 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Nope nothing. Zero. None. No evidence.

 

More lies. 

 

I already posted the link to the NHS website showing exactly what they count as a covid death.

 

12 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Of course though and fall in the numbers over the coming weeks is down to the mask enforcement. 

 

What about the fall over the last 3 months when people weren't wearing masks?

[Mudface]

Just now, Spy Bee said:

But there needs to be balance between Covid and everything else. Erring on the side of caution for Covid is having knock on effects to mental health, to cancer referrals/treatments, to people not attending the doctors and getting a diagnosis.

 

I would suggest that similar patterns in many countries/regions, strongly suggest that there is a saturation oint which can be reached and then the virus struggles to continue to spread. London, New York, Balermo, Sweden etc.

The only place that might apply is Sweden, all the rest have had significant lockdown periods.

[Mudface]

Just now, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

I already posted the link to the NHS website showing exactly what they count as a covid death.

 

 

What about the fall over the last 3 months when people weren't wearing masks?

You mean when the country was in lockdown?

[Bjornebye]

4 minutes ago, Spy Bee said:

Because I don't agree with you?

 

You can't even put together a decent fucking sentence on the subject; you're just a heckler.

Nope, because you chat fucking shite. 

[Strontium]

1 minute ago, Mudface said:

You mean when the country was in lockdown?

 

I'm still waiting for the VE Day spike. And all the others.

[Spy Bee]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

Nope, because you chat fucking shite. 

Just absolutely proved my point.

[Bjornebye]

3 minutes ago, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

I already posted the link to the NHS website showing exactly what they count as a covid death.

 

 

What about the fall over the last 3 months when people weren't wearing masks?

You haven't provided evidence to your claim. That is a FACT. 

 

Many decent people were wearing masks. Remember your Japan example? You ran away when evidence was put in-front of you. If you had some humility from time to time people wouldn't bother arguing with you. Problem is, you cant ever admit when you are wrong and always think you are right and superior when you are far from it. 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

I'm still waiting for the VE Day spike. And all the others.

We had one you fucking tory 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Spy Bee said:

Just absolutely proved my point.

That's not even a proper sentence you dippy twat. 

[Strontium]

8 minutes ago, Spy Bee said:

I would suggest that similar patterns in many countries/regions, strongly suggest that there is a saturation oint which can be reached and then the virus struggles to continue to spread. London, New York, Balermo, Sweden etc.

 

Correct. And short of locking your country down until a vaccine is found, there's nothing you can do to stop the virus spreading eventually, as all these clever countries who patted themselves on the back are finding out now.

 

The absolute height of human hubris to think the virus could be stopped. The height of human stupidity to focus all our energies on trying to stop it, while driving our economy into the worst economic depression in history. 

[Spy Bee]

3 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

That's not even a proper sentence, you dippy twat. 

If you want to be a pedant, at least get your grammar right.

[Bjornebye]

Just now, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

Correct. And short of locking your country down until a vaccine is found, there's nothing you can do to stop the virus spreading eventually, as all these clever countries who patted themselves on the back are finding out now.

 

The absolute height of human hubris to think the virus could be stopped. The height of human stupidity to focus all our energies on trying to stop it, while driving our economy into the worst economic depression in history. 

So you think that the reactions from South Korea and Japan compared to the UK was pointless? The difference in literally tens of thousands of deaths? 

[Bjornebye]

1 minute ago, Spy Bee said:

If you want to be a pedant, at least get your grammar right.

Shut up or I'll ring your mum. 

[Strontium]

18 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

We had one you fucking tory 

 

Evidence?

[Neil G]

So we’ve gone from “it’s nothing to worry about” to “it’s unstoppable”?

[Bjornebye]

17 minutes ago, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

Evidence?

You made the initial claim. According to your rules its you who should provide the evidence. 

[Mudface]

28 minutes ago, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

Correct. And short of locking your country down until a vaccine is found, there's nothing you can do to stop the virus spreading eventually, as all these clever countries who patted themselves on the back are finding out now.

 

The absolute height of human hubris to think the virus could be stopped. The height of human stupidity to focus all our energies on trying to stop it, while driving our economy into the worst economic depression in history. 

Some nice strawmen you've built. Again.

 

The point of the lockdowns were to try and prevent the uncontrollable spread of the disease, because the alternative was not only unconscionable in terms of the number of deaths but also would be worse for the economy than not locking down. Once the number of cases was sufficiently low to allow for contact tracing to be effective, the country could then come out of lockdown with further mitigating factors introduced, like er... masks, to help dampen down transmission.

 

There would then have to be a balancing act between keeping the virus as low as possible- buying time for decent treatments or a vaccine to be developed. 

[Sugar Ape]

33 minutes ago, Spy Bee said:

But there needs to be balance between Covid and everything else. Erring on the side of caution for Covid is having knock on effects to mental health, to cancer referrals/treatments, to people not attending the doctors and getting a diagnosis.

 

I would suggest that similar patterns in many countries/regions, strongly suggest that there is a saturation oint which can be reached and then the virus struggles to continue to spread. London, New York, Balermo, Sweden etc.

I keep on seeing people saying this and it’s missing the point a lot in my opinion. There isn’t a binary choice between locking down and then we miss cancer referrals and the like OR we open everything up and don’t err on the side of caution and we can treat all these people, improve their mental health etc...

 

If we assume for a minute that cases will rise as we open up more (and you might not think they will but I think it’s clear the majority of people advising the government on this do), lets say they get anywhere near the stage we were at in April, do you think that we will then have more or less resources to look at cancer referrals and treat people in the hospital? Will hospitals be more or less safe in this scenario?

 

The more cases and deaths there are the more people are scared to go to health care settings, the more people have their mental health affected, the more people are worried about going to their GP and the more unsafe hospitals will be. 
 

One of the reasons we bring in lockdown measures and other restrictions is precisely so people can get treated for cancer or heart disease and attend hospitals as safely as possible. 
 

Erring on the side of caution is the right thing to do when it comes to an infectious, novel virus. Suggesting we don’t err on the side of caution seems a little nuts to me.

[Mudface]

10 minutes ago, Neil G said:

So we’ve gone from “it’s nothing to worry about” to “it’s unstoppable”?

Apparently it's unstoppable until it's infected maybe 15% of the population, then it'll mysteriously disappear.

[Mudface]

48 minutes ago, Stront19m Dog™ said:

 

Correct. And short of locking your country down until a vaccine is found, there's nothing you can do to stop the virus spreading eventually, as all these clever countries who patted themselves on the back are finding out now.

 

The absolute height of human hubris to think the virus could be stopped. The height of human stupidity to focus all our energies on trying to stop it, while driving our economy into the worst economic depression in history. 

Forgot to add to the earlier post- the height of human hubris and stupidity are the Johnson and Trump administration reactions to this, which have given the worst of all worlds.

[Spy Bee]

13 minutes ago, Mudface said:

Apparently it's unstoppable until it's infected maybe 15% of the population, then it'll mysteriously disappear.

That purposefully obtuse. Why even go down that avenue? We have loads of reports of T Cell Responses providing a level of immunity. We have reports of immunity by antibody, and reports that antibody tests won't show all antibody immunity. Why pretend that this has never been discussed? Why just ignore it in order to try and land a cheap shot?

 

15 minutes ago, Sugar Ape said:

I keep on seeing people saying this and it’s missing the point a lot in my opinion. There isn’t a binary choice between locking down and then we miss cancer referrals and the like OR we open everything up and don’t err on the side of caution and we can treat all these people, improve their mental health etc...

 

If we assume for a minute that cases will rise as we open up more (and you might not think they will but I think it’s clear the majority of people advising the government on this do), lets say they get anywhere near the stage we were at in April, do you think that we will then have more or less resources to look at cancer referrals and treat people in the hospital? Will hospitals be more or less safe in this scenario?

 

Why? We have opened up gradually and quite sensibly, and deaths have fallen, ICU patient numbers have fallen, hospital admissions have fallen, positive tests have fallen, before plateauing - although it could easily be argued that this is due to targeted testing and more non-serious cases being discovered.  

 

Nobody is claiming it is binary, in fact, it's pretty clear that it's a sliding scale and that people making this argument are saying it should not be protection against Covid at the expense of everything else.

[Spy Bee]

3 minutes ago, Mudface said:

Forgot to add to the earlier post- the height of human hubris and stupidity are the Johnson and Trump administration reactions to this, which have given the worst of all worlds.

And here is the problem. People have completely aligned their political position to their stance on Covid. I fucking hate the Tories and everything they stand for, but I am not letting that have an impact on where I believe we currently are with Covid. 

[Bjornebye]

3 minutes ago, Spy Bee said:

And here is the problem. People have completely aligned their political position to their stance on Covid. I fucking hate the Tories and everything they stand for, but I am not letting that have an impact on where I believe we currently are with Covid. 

A quick comparison with pretty much every other country will indicate just how bad the pair of them have done. 

[Spy Bee]

2 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

A quick comparison with pretty much every other country will indicate just how bad the pair of them have done. 

It's not over yet. Now is not the time to judge.

[Strontium]

34 minutes ago, Neil G said:

So we’ve gone from “it’s nothing to worry about” to “it’s unstoppable”?

 

Even by the standards of the Covid Chicken Lickens that's mighty nonsense.

 

The common cold is unstoppable. It's also nothing to worry about. The two aren't mutually exclusive.

 

The virus is nothing to worry about for the overwhelming majority of people. Even the WHO are now admitting the death rate is only 0.6% (and the implied fatality rates I've seen suggest it's even lower than that). Even if everyone in the UK got infected - a statistical impossibility - that's only 200,000 deaths. Do I really need to bump all the old predictions of 500,000 DEAD UNLESS WE LOCK DOWN NOW!!!!11

 

24 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

You made the initial claim. According to your rules its you who should provide the evidence. 

 

I said I was still waiting for the VE Day spike. You're the one claiming there was one.

 

I've been waiting for this second spike for months. I can wait a few hours for your evidence. Cheers.