A response to Chris Bascombe's hatchet job

[RoboRiise]

Regardless of your opinion of it's content, you've got to admit that's a magnificently brutal bit of writing.

[goatboy59]

No dart in the bullseye?

 

If you say so.

[Moschops II]

Regardless of your opinion of it's content, you've got to admit that's a magnificently brutal bit of writing.

 

Purely as prose, it's far more fluent and less cliche-ridden than anything I've ever read by Bascombe himself.

 

Still, he surely wouldn't claim to be much of an actual writer... would he?

[Dan Vito Corleone]

Nowhere near the lipstick.

[diego]

He had them pegged from the off and history is on his side"

 

Now, I don't mind naivety, but this ridiculous beatification of Saint Rafa has to stop. Had them pegged from the off? Maybe. Then why did he agree to sign a new 5 year deal with them a full two years after they took over? Why in September 2009 when the Kuwaiti deal was being discussed in the press did Rafa praise Hicks (admittedly not Gillett, but he did back Hicks) at a press conference and say that a change of ownership could be "destablising" and "dangerous" for the club at that moment in time?

 

I'm sure he didn't find them ideal owners, but it seems to me that he tended to blame, and fight turf battles with, Parry and Purslow rather than with Hicks. He had a good working relationship with Texan Tom, so let's stop painting Rafa as a martyr who stood alone against the nasty owners, fighting for the fans, shall we?

 

And for the record, I honestly believe he made it impossible to carry on with the job this summer by issuing demands that he knew couldn't be met, all the time whilst negotiating with Juve and then with Inter: something had to give, but Rafa didn't want to be the one to walk away (either to save face with the fans, whom I am sure he genuinely appreciates, or because of the desire for compensation).

 

 

So you're saying that not only was Rafa a politician, but a damn good one, who came out on top and left the losers to squabble among themselves? Not much to disagree with there. Thanks for the insight.

Edited June 7, 2010 by diego

[Stu Monty]

If Chris goes on pissing people off like this he might get into trouble with his gaffers.

 

Rupert won't be happy if the plan to hire a "good red" to get loads of gullible twats from Merseyside to but his paper again looks like it isn't working.

[theghost]

Two things - Bascombe is a shit cunt of a journalist.

 

Anyone who trusts this board to get anything right needs their heads examining. Was it the right time for Rafa to go? Yes. But do I trust the board to make the right decision on something like that? No. I don't even trust them when they tell me that the sun rose today.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Yes it's my opinion, but I'm not going to qualify everything I post on here as such. It would be silly.

 

I wouldn't ask you to, just not class it as unquestionable. That would be equally silly!

[goatboy59]

If Chris goes on pissing people off like this he might get into trouble with his gaffers.

 

Rupert won't be happy if the plan to hire a "good red" to get loads of gullible twats from Merseyside to but his paper again looks like it isn't working.

 

"Again"?

 

I'd always thought the paper had few problems on Merseyside, the biggest selling Sunday paper by a distance isn't it?

 

In the extensive media section of Scraton & Coleman's book 'No Last Rights' it isn't mentioned once.

[Redexile]

Erm! No, that was when we got wind of the Yank duplicity!

He had them pegged from the off and history is on his side.

 

So let me get this right. He had them pegged from the off and yet knowing all this he signed a new 5 year contract? This is a man many of us admit could walk into any other job but he chose to sign a new year 5 year deal when he knew the Yanks were going to short chnage him at every opportunity? That doesn't make sense at all.

[Coro]

So let me get this right. He had them pegged from the off and yet knowing all this he signed a new 5 year contract? This is a man many of us admit could walk into any other job but he chose to sign a new year 5 year deal when he knew the Yanks were going to short chnage him at every opportunity? That doesn't make sense at all.

 

Looks like they broke any promises they made.

[Redexile]

Looks like they broke any promises they made.

 

Oh I know that we all know they did but the original poster stated that Rafa had them pegged from the off- clearly he didn't.

[goatboy59]

Pegged maybe, but indifferent while he was getting what he wanted. This summer he clearly wasn't, last summer too, but he was never going to walk with so much money at stake.

 

Wasn't there a little footsie between Rafa and Hicks in the Spring of 2008? I recall one weekend where the yanks were flying in and had a meeting arranged for Rafa. Didn't Hicks get in a day early and meet him on his own?

 

And he also told the press that he spoke to Hicks and got 'supportive' e mails from him but never spoke to Gillett. It was a bit too cosy at the time, though some suggested he had to "play the game" Godfather style; keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

 

Did the end finally arrive when even Hicks wasn't onside any more?

 

I think Royal Family's post was closer to the mark than anyone else's, but good luck trying to stifle that Saint Rafa thing.

[Coro]

 

I think Royal Family's post was closer to the mark than anyone else's, but good luck trying to stifle that Saint Rafa thing.

 

You agree he had a good working relationship with Hicks and his real problems were with Parry and Purslow?

 

H&G were actively looking to replace Benitez back in 2007 because the manager was obviously not happy with what he was seeing behind the scenes and he made that abundantly clear to all and sundry.

 

Benitez from there on in was surely looking for assurances and Hicks was playing the good guy trying to appease fans because he realised the anger of the clubs support.

[Whelan]

So let me get this right. He had them pegged from the off and yet knowing all this he signed a new 5 year contract? This is a man many of us admit could walk into any other job but he chose to sign a new year 5 year deal when he knew the Yanks were going to short chnage him at every opportunity? That doesn't make sense at all.

 

2007 after the champions league whilst people like me and you, were singing USA! USA! He called them out.

 

Did it occur to you that the wording of the contract was to negate their influence? Or does that not fit in with the 'Big bad selfish Rafa, looking after number one!'

 

So basically if you sign a contract you don't know what they are like, which eoesn't really say much for Kenny does it.

 

I think Rafa should have just done what Fergie has done, fucked the fans off, and thrown his lot in with the owners, he wouldn't have taken any more stick!

[RedBrian84]

Ah, another thread descending into Rafa-chaos.

 

Bascombe sold his soul and his words mean fuck all to me and to most of the people on here, or who have any kind of clue about our football club. As an attack piece the response is excellent, it lays into somebody who once had a viewpoint that carried some weight, and then he kicked off and threw his fucking toys out of the pram.

 

It's still nowhere near as good as Reade's piece the other day though. Bascombe can simply fuck off in my own view.

[Redexile]

2007 after the champions league whilst people like me and you, were singing USA! USA! He called them out.

 

Did it occur to you that the wording of the contract was to negate their influence? Or does that not fit in with the 'Big bad selfish Rafa, looking after number one!'

 

So basically if you sign a contract you don't know what they are like, which eoesn't really say much for Kenny does it.

 

 

Why bring Kenny into this? You said he had them pegged from the beginning I would dispute that given that he signed a contract with them at a time when it is widely accepted that they were upping the pillaging of the club. Nowhere have I ever stated Raf was big , bad or selfish. It was his choice to sign the contract. Your theory on the wording of the contract is just that "theory".

[goatboy59]

You agree he had a good working relationship with Hicks and his real problems were with Parry and Purslow?

 

H&G were actively looking to replace Benitez back in 2007 because the manager was obviously not happy with what he was seeing behind the scenes and he made that abundantly clear to all and sundry.

 

Benitez from there on in was surely looking for assurances and Hicks was playing the good guy trying to appease fans because he realised the anger of the clubs support.

 

Rafa got 45m for Torres Benayoun Lucas and Babel after Athens, and knew Mascherano was in the process of being prised out of his contract nightmare, and yet he was STILL plaguing them for more money. He knew fuck all about Klinsmann.

 

He didn't "call them out" or anything like it; he didn't get his own way and spat his dummy out. After his behaviour in Athens, is it any wonder his bosses gave some thought to replacing him?

 

If he knew all this about their duplicity and the financial danger to the club, he seemed remarkably calm about buying 100m worth of new players in 15 months. He seemed to make one excuse after another for the baffling sale of Robbie Keane when there was little or no backup if Torres was fucked (thankfully for the rest of 08/09 he wasn't), a sale that was suspiciously followed by a lucrative, excessively long personal contract. He has made one excuse after another for Aquilani and for himself in buying him, but let his little gophers leak it out that AA wasn't really down to him like he let his slant out on virtually every player that was a failure.

 

Rafa was in it for himself, and lo and behold he's about to land on his feet again.

 

Sacked, my arse.

[05 Milan]

Rafa got 45m for Torres Benayoun Lucas and Babel after Athens, and knew Mascherano was in the process of being prised out of his contract nightmare, and yet he was STILL plaguing them for more money. He knew fuck all about Klinsmann.

 

He didn't "call them out" or anything like it; he didn't get his own way and spat his dummy out. After his behaviour in Athens, is it any wonder his bosses gave some thought to replacing him?

 

If he knew all this about their duplicity and the financial danger to the club, he seemed remarkably calm about buying 100m worth of new players in 15 months. He seemed to make one excuse after another for the baffling sale of Robbie Keane when there was little or no backup if Torres was fucked (thankfully for the rest of 08/09 he wasn't), a sale that was suspiciously followed by a lucrative, excessively long personal contract. He has made one excuse after another for Aquilani and for himself in buying him, but let his little gophers leak it out that AA wasn't really down to him like he let his slant out on virtually every player that was a failure.

 

Rafa was in it for himself, and lo and behold he's about to land on his feet again.

 

Sacked, my arse.

 

What was the net figure?:thumbsup:

 

Other than that, can't really disagree with any of it.

[Coro]

Rafa got 45m for Torres Benayoun Lucas and Babel after Athens, and knew Mascherano was in the process of being prised out of his contract nightmare, and yet he was STILL plaguing them for more money. He knew fuck all about Klinsmann.

 

He didn't "call them out" or anything like it; he didn't get his own way and spat his dummy out. After his behaviour in Athens, is it any wonder his bosses gave some thought to replacing him?

 

If he knew all this about their duplicity and the financial danger to the club, he seemed remarkably calm about buying 100m worth of new players in 15 months. He seemed to make one excuse after another for the baffling sale of Robbie Keane when there was little or no backup if Torres was fucked (thankfully for the rest of 08/09 he wasn't), a sale that was suspiciously followed by a lucrative, excessively long personal contract. He has made one excuse after another for Aquilani and for himself in buying him, but let his little gophers leak it out that AA wasn't really down to him like he let his slant out on virtually every player that was a failure.

 

Rafa was in it for himself, and lo and behold he's about to land on his feet again.

 

Sacked, my arse.

 

No hang on, we spent that money after his little rant in the press conference following the final in Athens. You're wrong, he spat his dummy and then we signed the likes of Torres n co. He had a far better vantage point to see what was going on than any of us and his taking issue with the board has been fully justified yet he lost sight of what he's really good at in the process. That's the stick we should be beating him with now. Fucking right he was plaguing them for more money, they came here talking a big game but were offering little in reality or are trying to tell us otherwise? Of course he was in it for himself but that in turn would benefit the team and then the fans and the club as a whole.

 

It seems your advocating the owners decision to go talking to Klinsmann. Do you think they went talking to Jurgen for the good of us or themselves? Benitez obviously could see things weren't right and 'the coaching and training my team' didn't come out of nowhere did it?

 

On the one hand there's people defending his every move, on the other there's people trying to vilify him for anything and everything, it's ridiculous.

[Antynwa]

I remember when Bascombe came out with an article in the Echo claiming we weren't going to get Torres, and we where going to get Forlan because the owners where twats.

 

Just saying like

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

I remember when Bascombe came out with an article in the Echo claiming we weren't going to get Torres, and we where going to get Forlan because the owners where twats.

 

Just saying like

 

Bascombe, spot on again. I reckon we would have done well if we got Torres. Guess we'll never know.

 

 

Hold on a gosh darn second, Mister!

[Antynwa]

Bascombe, spot on again. I reckon we would have done well if we got Torres. Guess we'll never know.

 

 

Hold on a gosh darn second, Mister!

 

Come on!

 

I remember when Bascombe did that article, on other websites it was called bullshit. What's not to say that he didn't get his info on Benitez? You could say Chris new about the owners being tools way before us.

 

I can only echo the thoughts of others in this thread, I think Brian Reade is the only red to really hit the nail firmly on the head.

[Coro]

Bascombe - 'time to cut the owners some slack'

 

What changed then?

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Come on!

 

What? Pointing out that Bascombe got everything in his original article wrong is out of order? So what if it so happened that the Owners grew into being pricks (and all he actually said was that the owners wouldn't sanction the puchase of Torres... wrong), it's nothing more than coincidence.

 

Even a lying cock is right twice a day.

 

I remember when Bascombe did that article, on other websites it was called bullshit.

 

Probably because it was.

 

What's not to say that he didn't get his info on Benitez?

 

What's to say he did? Only one thing is clear, we got Torres not Forlan.

 

You could say Chris new about the owners being tools way before us.

 

You could say anything you like. Doesn't make it any more true. Do I need to dredge up his articles in support of the owners?

 

I can only echo the thoughts of others in this thread, I think Brian Reade is the only red to really hit the nail firmly on the head.

 

Same.