Wanted: Suarez - video proof of diving

[Coro]

Major Tom in full of shit shocker.

[JohnnyH]

1-1.

 

Penalty shoot out?

 

I think it’ll look after itself over time……

[Major Tom]

I think it’ll look after itself over time……

 

Indeed.

 

It just did.

[Stu Monty]

Major Tom in full of shit shocker.

 

He did have.

 

Just because you aren't aware of it doesn't mean that Major Tom has to go doing your googling for you.

 

Ferguson is a cunt and has deliberately set out to get referees to give Suarez nothing and see him as a diver. That is a fact. You know what the best way to not allow that to work is? Not roll around like a snide whenever anyone touches you and not simulate fouls at the slightest contact.

 

If you go round thieving you'll get a reputation as a thief. Pointing at someone else who is thieving and getting away with it, and crying that other people don't think they're a cunt too, does not mean your reputation in unjustified.

[Coro]

He did have.

 

Just because you aren't aware of it doesn't mean that Major Tom has to go doing your googling for you.

 

 

He's making the assertion so let's see it substantiated.

 

Oh and get fucked with this irrational dislike of a player. It's boring to read.

[Whelan]

The argument over reputation should only be relevant with contentious decisions not going his way, stonewall decisions and nailed on free kicks are not being given and it is difficult to agree that it is a consequence of his reputation alone.

[Major Tom]

The argument over reputation should only be relevant with contentious decisions not going his way, stonewall decisions and nailed on free kicks are not being given and it is difficult to agree that it is a consequence of his reputation alone.

 

What is it a consequence of in your view then, Whelan?

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

He's making the assertion so let's see it substantiated.

 

Bloody hell, Coro! Were you living in a box for the last ten years? He clearly had a reputation for it, warranted or not. Just do a google search up to the day he signed for us, it takes about five seconds.

 

You'll find sites saying he won the 'fantasy cheaters' award for most dives, Dutch sport journalists from the Guardian calling him a diver and saying he cons the ref so much only a dismembered leg would get him a penalty, and news even reached America that he was 'known for being a frequent diver'. Plus a load of other things. You can even read a load of people comment about how much of a diver he is in a Tim Vickery article.

[Whelan]

What is it a consequence of in your view then, Whelan?

 

Firstly, the World cup and then Evra and his refusal to apologise for how he plays.

 

He played 20 odd minutes at Carrow Road last season without being booed, the minute he scored however - they remembered that he was a cheat.

 

Whether you like it or not, the media does play a role in how a player is perceived to the public and with foreign players it is far easier to focus upon the negative than it is with the British players. British players tend to have relationships with either local media, or national media which foreign players don't have.

 

Same with Managers.

[Whelan]

You would assume that his reputation for diving in Holland would have stopped him getting penalties from the get go, but no, took a few months and a few well placed comments to do that.

[Coro]

Bloody hell!!! Someone makes an assertion others want to see proof. I don't want pissy blogs or the views of half bakes I want to see clear substantial evidence that Suarez arrived in this country with this reputation.

 

I don't think he did. I don't think it was central to what was said about him.

 

So, bloody hell!!!

[Major Tom]

Firstly, the World cup and then Evra and his refusal to apologise for how he plays.

 

He played 20 odd minutes at Carrow Road last season without being booed, the minute he scored however - they remembered that he was a cheat.

 

Whether you like it or not, the media does play a role in how a player is perceived to the public and with foreign players it is far easier to focus upon the negative than it is with the British players. British players tend to have relationships with either local media, or national media which foreign players don't have.

 

Same with Managers.

 

Agreed, Whelan.

[Major Tom]

You would assume that his reputation for diving in Holland would have stopped him getting penalties from the get go, but no, took a few months and a few well placed comments to do that.

 

And a few well placed histrionics...

[Major Tom]

I want to see clear substantial evidence that Suarez arrived in this country with this reputation.

 

Go and find it, then.

[Coro]

Go and find it, then.

 

Bit like you in that Chris Foy thread, I want the answers from you.

 

You made the assertion, now back it up.

[Whelan]

And a few well placed histrionics...

 

I won't argue against his behaviour - just that his behaviour is no different, but that his treatment is different to that of other players.

 

And to me, it is therefore not about his reputation but about him. He is an easy target not just because of what he has done, but because of where he comes from, who he plays for and who he is.

 

Equally Stoke have a reputation for being physical, would the English media and commentators accept their players are sent off, or punished soley on the back of that reputation? A good example is the good laugh we all have at Paul Scholes attempts at tackling. The commentators sardonic laugh as he nearly breaks a leg. For some reason he doesn't have the reputation of being a dirty cunt despite his behaviour proving such.

[Major Tom]

You made the assertion, now back it up.

 

I made the assertion that he had the reputation in Holland. Which he did. If it was justified is another matter, but he had it.

 

I imagine the articles that Hank linked confirm that.

[Major Tom]

I won't argue against his behaviour - just that his behaviour is no different, but that his treatment is different to that of other players.

 

And to me, it is therefore not about his reputation but about him. He is an easy target not just because of what he has done, but because of where he comes from, who he plays for and who he is.

 

Equally Stoke have a reputation for being physical, would the English media and commentators accept their players are sent off, or punished soley on the back of that reputation?

 

I do agree in general, but if he cuts it out, he will lose the reputation. We can look to the media, to Ferguson, to anyone you like, but it's Luis' hands. And I think he will cut it out. He's seeing it is now starting to cost him.

 

But I do agree over his treatment, mind.

[Coro]

 

I imagine the articles that Hank linked confirm that.

 

No, they don't. Show me an article from Tim Vickery talking about Suarez's terrible reputation for diving, not comments from other teams supporters.

 

I don't trust your knowledge of football. You're making this assertion that Suarez had a terrible reputation for diving in Holland. Like he was out of the ordinary compared to other players over there. This reputation surely would have followed him on his arrival here and the issue of his play acting would have been central to what was said about him. That didn't seem to be the case though. Not to my mind anyway but I'm sure something substantial could alter my view on this.

[ngogswilly]

In fairness I think when Suarez came here he did have a bit of pantomine-esque villian tag to his name.

 

But nowhere near what it became after the Evra stuff and Fergiscum branding him a diver.

 

I think most of it was to do with what happened at the world cup, but even that was small fries in comparison to the general hatred there is for him now.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Bloody hell!!! Someone makes an assertion others want to see proof. I don't want pissy blogs or the views of half bakes I want to see clear substantial evidence that Suarez arrived in this country with this reputation.

 

I don't think he did. I don't think it was central to what was said about him.

 

So' date=' bloody hell!!![/quote']

 

I've linked you to an article, by a sports written from Holland, for the Guardian, who clearly said it. Before he signed for us.

 

If you can't accept that, plus many other people saying the same thing, you're a bit of a tit.

[DaveT]

What's going to be really interesting is to see what happens next time Suarez goes down in the box. After all the snide 'he goes down easily' comments recently, there was pretty much total consensus in the media that he was denied a clear penalty at Norwich. Maybe the tide has turned? We'll see....maybe as early as Sunday....

[Lapskaus]

To answer those who think it's ludicrous to say he is not a diver and that if fans of other teams had a similar thread we'd have a thread laughing about it.

 

If that other team was Man U and the player was Ashley Young we would have a thread about it and laugh and WE WOULD HAVE CLIPS OF HIM DIVING.

 

If it was Rooneay CLIPS OF HIUM DIVING

If it was Gerrard CLIPS OF HIM DIVING

If it was Drogba CLIPS OF HIM DIVING

 

...get it?

 

I hope they have a thread about him on some manc forum so they can show me a clip of him diving, Im dying to see it.

 

And STU, if I was so concerned about protecting Suarez no matter what and I have blind faith, why would I even start this thread? I posted it so people could show me clips of him diving. My theory was that he doesnt dive, and so far that theory holds.

 

He's guilty of complaining and appealing abt handballs too often, and he is guilty of making a meal out of a foul sometimes(rolling on the ground etc), but he is not a diver- simple as.

[Lapskaus]

I also see now that I have a picture of him as my avatar, which undermines my objectivity, but I can assure you I'm not 10, I don't have a Suarez poster on the wall and I'm not his biggest fan - I'm just troubled by injustice

[ngogswilly]

To answer those who think it's ludicrous to say he is not a diver and that if fans of other teams had a similar thread we'd have a thread laughing about it.

 

If that other team was Man U and the player was Ashley Young we would have a thread about it and laugh and WE WOULD HAVE CLIPS OF HIM DIVING.

 

If it was Rooneay CLIPS OF HIUM DIVING

If it was Gerrard CLIPS OF HIM DIVING

If it was Drogba CLIPS OF HIM DIVING

 

...get it?

 

I hope they have a thread about him on some manc forum so they can show me a clip of him diving, Im dying to see it.

 

And STU, if I was so concerned about protecting Suarez no matter what and I have blind faith, why would I even start this thread? I posted it so people could show me clips of him diving. My theory was that he doesnt dive, and so far that theory holds.

 

He's guilty of complaining and appealing abt handballs too often, and he is guilty of making a meal out of a foul sometimes(rolling on the ground etc), but he is not a diver- simple as.

 

Well you're going on your interpretation of a dive. i.e. Falling without contact

 

Whereas others see diving differently, as in, even if theres contact and you roll around like you've been shot, its as good as being a diver/simulator whatever.

 

I happen to see it basically as, diving is falling without contact, I doubt you'll find many instances of Suarez doing this.

 

What you will find though is a good few instances of him going down when theres a bit of contact and as others have pointed out, him making a meal of it.

 

The debate has really gone down a few different roads now.

 

But ultimately for me, I think he just gets a raw deal in comparison to others. Whether what everyone does is correct or not is a different debate for me, I just wan't consistency in how our players are treated in comparison to others.