Lucas - the new scapegoat.

[05 Milan]

Those height-stats are from LFC.tv in case anyone was wondering.

[05 Milan]

 

Check out the bedroom-eyes on Jay. Sexshy bastard.

[TommyW]

we're top of the league, what do we need a scapegoat for?

[Tycoon]

I think the lad was one of our best players v Pompy, won loads of tackles, always showed for the ball and a great pass completion, say what you want about previous games but the other nite the boy done good!

[05 Milan]

One thing he has consistently done well since he came here, is win the ball. He's tough to get by, and his tendency to look for the quick pass once he has won the ball is positive for our counter-attacks.

 

He can still beef up a bit, but I think he has plenty more in his locker going forward than we've seen yet, the same goes for Mikel. But for both, that advanced position is blocked by superior and more experienced players.

[silverlining]

I started a thread last season called "What is the point of Lucas"

 

I am still unsure.

 

He's an insipid, pallid imitation of a Liverpool midfielder.

 

Horrible.

[stringvest]

I don't just buy it, I know it. Nothing to do with him being xenophobic or anything like that.

 

thank god for that. Otherwise it would have been scouse paranoia, and we know that doesn't exist.

[silverlining]

thank god for that. Otherwise it would have been scouse paranoia, and we know that doesn't exist.

 

Are you talking about me? Ey? Are yer?

[SpeedyG]

I'm not saying Spearing is better than Lucas, but the above is completely wrong as Lucas trains with the first team and Spearing trains with the reserves.

 

Occasionally he will be asked to train with the first team, but to say he he gets a chance to outshine Lucas in training every day is just factually incorrect.

 

Ablett said there were sessions they did together and games they play against each other as a matter of routine. Plenty of opportunity for Rafa to see the lads in action. That was the impression I got any how.

[SpeedyG]

Are you talking about me? Ey? Are yer?

 

I reckon he was probably talking to the guy he quoted. Shot in the dark maybe.

[silverlining]

I reckon he was probably talking to the guy he quoted. Shot in the dark maybe.

 

*gives up*

[05 Milan]

*gives up*

 

Was that directed at me?

[dave u]

Ablett said there were sessions they did together and games they play against each other as a matter of routine. Plenty of opportunity for Rafa to see the lads in action. That was the impression I got any how.

 

That's not what you said though, you said he gets the chance to show every day that he is as good as Lucas. He doesn't, it's actually quite rare for Spearing to train with the first team.

 

When he has trained with them he's done really well, and the players think a lot of him.

[Unrighteous]

How mnay goals have Xabi or Masch ? Lucas got 5 assists last season, more than Xabi and Masch combined, in just 12 starts. He's done nothing wrong so far, just not set the world alight and as a brazilian player of the year etc etc he's going to have some expectations on him. Some people even think he held back Guthrie, when in fact NOONE EVER mentioned Guthrie until he popped up on loan at Bolton and then moved to Newcastle. Rafas been good at moving players on who werent able to play 'his' way, so i guess we'll see in the summer. But I think he'll come through and is slowly getting more involved. Ludicrous the amount of slagging he gets.

 

Sounds about right... However, it's not like other hard working, useful players get slagged off here, right? :whistle:

[dave u]

Sounds about right... However, it's not like other hard working, useful players get slagged off here, right? :whistle:

 

True, you gave Crouchy some terrible stick when he was here :whistle:

[SpeedyG]

That's not what you said though, you said he gets the chance to show every day that he is as good as Lucas. He doesn't, it's actually quite rare for Spearing to train with the first team.

 

When he has trained with them he's done really well, and the players think a lot of him.

 

You're right my wording wasn't great, but the point that Rafa sees enough of him still stands. And I believe if in those sessions / matches he was better than Lucas, he would be picked ahead of him.

 

I don't doubt the players think a lot of him. I do too, he's just a player with a different attributes than Rafa wants for the role that Lucas plays. IMO.

[silverlining]

You're right my wording wasn't great, but the point that Rafa sees enough of him still stands. And I believe if in those sessions / matches he was better than Lucas, he would be picked ahead of him.

 

I don't doubt the players think a lot of him. I do too, he's just a player with a different attributes than Rafa wants for the role that Lucas plays. IMO.

 

I'd pick Spearing ahead of Lucas, and I've never seen him play

[Unrighteous]

True, you gave Crouchy some terrible stick when he was here :whistle:

 

I said hardworking and useful, you little scamp!

[Unrighteous]

I'd pick Spearing ahead of Lucas, and I've never seen him play

 

You win the prize for the stupidest thing said on TLW today. How do you feel to have wrapped up that prize so early in the morning? Plan to take the afternoon off and strut ala Travolta?

[hamstrung]

Someone was asking me how to neg... I'd dearly love to help this "someone", so pointers pls...:whistle:

 

I only seem to be able to add to someones reputation, How to neg would be 'a nice to know'...

 

You either have to donate to the site or sign up for a season ticket via your user CP.

[JMARKH]

There's a difference between being good enough as a 4th choice and competing with SG/Xabi. IMO Lucas is more than good enough for that role in Rafa's squad and I think over time he will be given more responsibility and I think he will thrive. I think Lucas can become the player you want, but in a Rafa squad it's going to take a couple of years before he earns the right to be given the chance.

 

Fair enough but I still believe that when he gets his chance in the first team he needs to show more than what he does, if he improves then maybe we can think about rotating more often to keep midfield fresh, but at the moment I always feel he evens the game out against inferior opposition. Against some of the lower league sides as well I have expected a lot more from him but he has just remained average, and despite his goal against Crewe he was average as well.

[SpeedyG]

Fair enough but I still believe that when he gets his chance in the first team he needs to show more than what he does, if he improves then maybe we can think about rotating more often to keep midfield fresh, but at the moment I always feel he evens the game out against inferior opposition. Against some of the lower league sides as well I have expected a lot more from him but he has just remained average, and despite his goal against Crewe he was average as well.

 

There were pre-season interviews with both him and Rafa on the Offal and they both made the same point that you did. Last season was about consolidating, this season Lucas is expected to get more opportunities to do something more than just carry water.

 

I think he has started to make that adjustment, he's making more and more late runs, but he is now at the point in his development where like you say, he needs to be changing games. I think we'll see if he is ever going to be more than 4th choice where he is given a more expansive role in games like the CC and maybe some dead rubbers in the CL.

 

I think he has enough about him to grow into that role, but like you say another season of "average" performances will be the undoing of him.

[House of Dirk]

You either have to donate to the site or sign up for a season ticket via your user CP.

 

Nice one, cheers.

[redrosetints]

Sounds about right... However, it's not like other hard working, useful players get slagged off here, right? :whistle:

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, no point in this forum if not and naturally some players are going to split opinion. But I hate overreactions to players who are solid, if unspectacular professionals, I hate overreactions that dont bear out the facts. For example, Vornin, a freebie fourth choice striker scored 5 league goals last season, in 13 starts, same as Crouch and more than Kuyt or Babel yet was regularly slated on here. In that same season Lucas got 5 assists from 12 starts, only Gerrard and Kuyt got more, whilst the likes of Crouch, Torres, Xabi or Mach got no more than 3. Xabi has just 3 in the last 2 and half seaons.

 

That said, if Lucas is good enough he will prove the doubters wrong and come through, as Kuyt has. It really is in his hands, I just think were too quick to label players, good or bad here.

[SpeedyG]

That's not what you said though, you said he gets the chance to show every day that he is as good as Lucas. He doesn't, it's actually quite rare for Spearing to train with the first team.

 

When he has trained with them he's done really well, and the players think a lot of him.

 

Just thought I'd share this link to photographs of the reserves and first team training together

 

PICTURE SPECIAL: REDS READY FOR SPURS

 

:whistle: