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Everton (H) - Mon 13th Feb 2023 (8:00pm)

Trumo

By Trumo,
in FF - Football Forum

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sir roger Grand Master

sir roger

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, No2 said:

They have no pace in the side, their strengths play into Nat's hands. They want to win headers and that's what he does best. Its not just the opposition either, the lads keeping him out of the team deserve to sit beside Hendo and Fab on the bench. 

 

If Phillips isn't the man for this game why is he still here? If its purely to be a 5th choice that never plays then set him free and have Rhys Williams, Fabinho or some kid in the u18s full that role.

 

Yes, Nat is probably ideal if they go with DCL alone up front, and probably good for us that Gordon has gone , as he caused us some issues in the last few derbies.

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Vincent Vega
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Trumo
Trumo

Fuck it, I'm taking back control of this shit.   We are looking like a rancid corpse at present. Bereft of energy, belief, incision and resilience. Some of our stalwarts of recent year

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Evelyn Tentions Grand Master

Evelyn Tentions

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, sir roger said:

 

Yes, Nat is probably ideal if they go with DCL alone up front, and probably good for us that Gordon has gone , as he caused us some issues in the last few derbies.

If nothing else, he's going to be trying to impress Jurgen and potential buyers in the summer. He's not likely to sleep walk through the game and he's not scared to tackle or give orders 

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lebron Grand Master

lebron

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Posted

There's a reason (or several) why we're putting Phillips up for sale every window when we're desperate for home-grown players. He's not good enough to play in the premier league (if he was he would be sold by now), and especially not for a club with an expansive style of play - with aspirations of fighting for trophies. He's solely here as a last resort to avoid a similar situation that we had two seasons ago.

 

While all of Virgil, Matip and Gomez have had poor seasons (Konate the best performing of our four), they have all proven that they can play in Klopp's preferred system. Konate and Virgil are probably the most ideal solutions as they have both the pace and heading ability (at least Virgil used to have), but both Matip and Gomez have proven their worth next to Virgil in title-winning and European campaigns.

 

There's simply no chance that we alter vastly from the system that has given us so much success in recent years. There may be a few tweaks here and there to make us more unpredictable, but I just can't see Klopp surrendering his ideas long term to just make us "hard to beat". There's a bigger chance that he walks imo (and I don't think that's likely either). 

 

I still don't think he gets enough credit for making us the team we've been for the last 7 years. He's taken players that many had given up on and had them producing way above their ceiling due to the way we've been set up (more than the actual players ability). Not often I agree with Carragher, but what he said the other day is true, Klopp is the absolute last man I'd get rid of at the club. I think our best (and only really) way forward is for him to be given time to find new players to work in his preferred system. A year from now that might be something like this:

 

--------------------Allison-----------------

Trent-----Konate-----Vvd---------Robertson

-----------------Bajcetic-----------------------

-------Bellingham---------Thiago------------

---Salah----------Firmino-----------Diaz----

 

Put Nunez in for Firmino if you like, if he can learn when and how to press for the next few months he might be a better option.

 

I just think it's up to the players to ignore the noises from media (and some of our fans) and keep absolute trust in Klopp and his ideas. He's the one who has got them to the lofty heights, so they should show some loyalty back. Might be tough for people like Henderson and Fabinho who seem completely toast, but we should ship them out if they have stopped believing.

Get the front 

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lebron Grand Master

lebron

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Couldn't disagree more btw on those saying you need to change if it hasn't been working. It's the execution by the players that is the problem, not the system itself. It's not like some genius has suddenly found an effective way of countering the system the last few years, it's just that nearly all our players are underperforming and/or are physically shot. The best coaches in the world have known how Klopp has set up his team since ca 2010. There's always been risks to his system, it's just that when the players aren't doing their jobs, those risks become a lot more obvious. I for one have loved these last few years, there's so much negative football around that I've been incredibly proud not only of our results, but the way we've achieved them. The shouts for Klopp to change (and/or even walk) are incredibly tasteless and do not reflect well on us as supporters. 

 

For those wanting to change style; look at City. They're clearly a worse side after altering the way they play. Had they kept Jesus and played him or Alvarez as their 9s instead of my fellow grock-like countryman, they would be a lot better off points-wise. Unfortunately I suspect we'll see similar with Nunez, but we shall see...

 

Anyway. Get behind Klopp and his way of playing, or we might risk losing our biggest asset. With the injury news, I'd probably go for this tomorrow, and press the hell out of our neighbours.

 

------------------------Allison-----------------------

Milner-------Matip----------Gomez-----Robertson

-------------------Bajcetic--------------------------

------Henderson-------------Keita-----------------

---Elliot-------------Gakpo---------------Nunez---

 

Have Salah warm the bench until he realises he needs to pull his weight in our pressing game.

 

 

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VladimirIlyich Grand Master

VladimirIlyich

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, lebron said:

There's a reason (or several) why we're putting Phillips up for sale every window when we're desperate for home-grown players. He's not good enough to play in the premier league (if he was he would be sold by now), and especially not for a club with an expansive style of play - with aspirations of fighting for trophies. He's solely here as a last resort to avoid a similar situation that we had two seasons ago.

 

While all of Virgil, Matip and Gomez have had poor seasons (Konate the best performing of our four), they have all proven that they can play in Klopp's preferred system. Konate and Virgil are probably the most ideal solutions as they have both the pace and heading ability (at least Virgil used to have), but both Matip and Gomez have proven their worth next to Virgil in title-winning and European campaigns.

 

There's simply no chance that we alter vastly from the system that has given us so much success in recent years. There may be a few tweaks here and there to make us more unpredictable, but I just can't see Klopp surrendering his ideas long term to just make us "hard to beat". There's a bigger chance that he walks imo (and I don't think that's likely either). 

 

I still don't think he gets enough credit for making us the team we've been for the last 7 years. He's taken players that many had given up on and had them producing way above their ceiling due to the way we've been set up (more than the actual players ability). Not often I agree with Carragher, but what he said the other day is true, Klopp is the absolute last man I'd get rid of at the club. I think our best (and only really) way forward is for him to be given time to find new players to work in his preferred system. A year from now that might be something like this:

 

--------------------Allison-----------------

Trent-----Konate-----Vvd---------Robertson

-----------------Bajcetic-----------------------

-------Bellingham---------Thiago------------

---Salah----------Firmino-----------Diaz----

 

Put Nunez in for Firmino if you like, if he can learn when and how to press for the next few months he might be a better option.

 

I just think it's up to the players to ignore the noises from media (and some of our fans) and keep absolute trust in Klopp and his ideas. He's the one who has got them to the lofty heights, so they should show some loyalty back. Might be tough for people like Henderson and Fabinho who seem completely toast, but we should ship them out if they have stopped believing.

Get the front 

Fair comment here. I find it difficult to believe that Klopp and Lijnders didnt see the midfield situation arise though. I am sure Klopp has badgered them for a midfielder or two over the last couple of seasons.

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VladimirIlyich Grand Master

VladimirIlyich

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Posted
1 minute ago, TheHowieLama said:

Thanks for pointing that out.

I think that is inevitable and would happen with anybody given how badly we've played lately. Nobody is defending Hendo's massive loss in form but its ridiculous the stick he's getting when playing the odd 20-30 minutes here and there when others are playing 90 and doing fuck all. A midfielder is not going to do much when you are two and three goals down already. He deserves criticism,absolutely,but the notion that he alone is responsible for our recent form is nonsensical.

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lebron Grand Master

lebron

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Posted
3 hours ago, Creator Supreme said:

Alright then lebron, let's stick with what's not been working for the next 18 league games, see you for the first championship game in late July!

 

Yeah, my point is exactly that, do the exact same thing...

 

...or it might be, as Jurgen has alluded to today, that some players might be starting getting the spring back in their steps. We need more energy and intensity, and that's going to be a requirement whether we play a low block or the pressing/gegenpressing game that these players have worked on for the last 7-8 seasons.

 

Do you really think we'll get better performances and results if we completely abandon what we've been working on if the same players play with the same level of execution that they've shown this season?

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Curly Grand Master

Curly

Posted
Posted

------------------------Allison-----------------------

Gomez-------Virg/Matip----------Nat-----Robertson

-------------------Bajcetic--------------------------

------Trent-------------Milly-----------------

---Elliot-------------Mo---------------Nunez---

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Jairzinho Grand Master

Jairzinho

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Curly said:

------------------------Allison-----------------------

Gomez-------Virg/Matip----------Nat-----Robertson

-------------------Bajcetic--------------------------

------Trent-------------Milly-----------------

---Elliot-------------Mo---------------Nunez---

 

Same 11 for me, but I'd stick them in a 4312.

 

Allison

Gomez VVD Phillips Robertson

TAA Bajetic Milner

Elliott

Salah Nuñez

 

 

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