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New Super League to Rival CL - 11 Clubs Sign Up

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Anyone noticed the changes to the Champions League by the way?

 

(From the Telegraph)

 

Quote

On Monday, Uefa delegates had been due to rubber-stamp the plans from 2024 — but it is possible a late offer may be tabled to keep the big clubs happy. As it stands, European football’s elite club competition increases from 32 teams to 36, with the total matches played from 125 to 225 from 2024/25.

 

Of the four extra places, one would go to the league rated the fifth-strongest in Europe, with another going to the highest-ranked domestic champion from one of the smaller leagues. The remaining two go to the clubs with the highest Uefa coefficient (historic ranking), meaning the likes of Liverpool could finish as low as seventh in the Premier League and still qualify.

 

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1 minute ago, aws said:

The hypocrisy of people who have uncomplainingly watched the likes of City and Chelsea over the last few years now talking about keeping football competitive and earning success makes me fucking puke. 

Yeah it's absolutely mind boggling that there're plenty of people out there who think that it's this that'll make football uncompetitive - like what the fuck have they been watching these last few years!?

 

"What's the point for the rest of us?" Indeed, what is the point for the rest of us when City can slap Watford 6-0 in the final of the FA Cup with their near-reserves, on their way to winning 5 out of the last 10 domestic cups and three of the last four league titles? I honestly reckon most fans are comfortable with the concept of City as it's a convenient way of writing off the league winner as "yeah well you should win it anyway" without really disturbing much else, so there's obviously some uncompetitiveness that's tolerable.

 

I'm willing to bet that a lot of the resentment to a proposal that'll see teams which qualify for the CL 9 times out of 10 getting a guaranteed place in a reformatted CL is because there's always a couple which miss out and that means there's some "Thursday nights channel 5" schadenfreude-based bantz to miss out on.

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I think people need to move past the hypocrisy argument over this. Of course it is relevant - this is the natural conclusion of a culture of greed that was started by those who are leading the criticism. Yes, that is true. But, equally this isn't just about greed. 

 

This is also about our owners seeing us, and our culture as match going fans - our memories with parents and children, as a hindrance to them making money. It is our owners looking at us - and thinking 'yeah but if we lost those we'll gain 1 million Asian fans'. They'll take our culture and repackage it back to the Asian market. We won't be going to the game with our mates, won't be taking our kids to the game, or going with our parents. This is the first step to a franchise - and once you get that - you do get the possibility that they can simply move the franchise to someone else. The Shanghai reds sounds incredibly attractive to FSG I would bet. 

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1 minute ago, Jockey said:

This is also about our owners seeing us, and our culture as match going fans - our memories with parents and children, as a hindrance to them making money. It is our owners looking at us - and thinking 'yeah but if we lost those we'll gain 1 million Asian fans'. They'll take our culture and repackage it back to the Asian market. We won't be going to the game with our mates, won't be taking our kids to the game, or going with our parents. This is the first step to a franchise - and once you get that - you do get the possibility that they can simply move the franchise to someone else. The Shanghai reds sounds incredibly attractive to FSG I would bet. 

I cant see any other conclusion than this. It may be a while but it has an inevitability about it for me. We have spent the last 30 years giving these top clubs more and more power, in the way that the game was structured. This and the globalisation of the game through the advent of the internet.

 

Long term, it doesnt make sense to me to have 3 of the leagues teams in the North West of England, all within a few miles of each other.

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15 minutes ago, Manny said:

Yeah it's absolutely mind boggling that there're plenty of people out there who think that it's this that'll make football uncompetitive - like what the fuck have they been watching these last few years!?

 

"What's the point for the rest of us?" Indeed, what is the point for the rest of us when City can slap Watford 6-0 in the final of the FA Cup with their near-reserves, on their way to winning 5 out of the last 10 domestic cups and three of the last four league titles? I honestly reckon most fans are comfortable with the concept of City as it's a convenient way of writing off the league winner as "yeah well you should win it anyway" without really disturbing much else, so there's obviously some uncompetitiveness that's tolerable.

 

I'm willing to bet that a lot of the resentment to a proposal that'll see teams which qualify for the CL 9 times out of 10 getting a guaranteed place in a reformatted CL is because there's always a couple which miss out and that means there's some "Thursday nights channel 5" schadenfreude-based bantz to miss out on.

Agree.

10 minutes ago, Jockey said:

I think people need to move past the hypocrisy argument over this. Of course it is relevant - this is the natural conclusion of a culture of greed that was started by those who are leading the criticism. Yes, that is true. But, equally this isn't just about greed. 

 

This is also about our owners seeing us, and our culture as match going fans - our memories with parents and children, as a hindrance to them making money. It is our owners looking at us - and thinking 'yeah but if we lost those we'll gain 1 million Asian fans'. They'll take our culture and repackage it back to the Asian market. We won't be going to the game with our mates, won't be taking our kids to the game, or going with our parents. This is the first step to a franchise - and once you get that - you do get the possibility that they can simply move the franchise to someone else. The Shanghai reds sounds incredibly attractive to FSG I would bet. 

You seriously think Real madrid, Barcelona, Juve, Inter, Milan and the rest are intent on a 'franchise' and uprooting their club to Shanghai or somewhere else in the world or it it just us?

 

Honestly, what fucking garbage.

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4 minutes ago, John102 said:

I cant see any other conclusion than this. It may be a while but it has an inevitability about it for me. We have spent the last 30 years giving these top clubs more and more power, in the way that the game was structured. This and the globalisation of the game through the advent of the internet.

 

Long term, it doesnt make sense to me to have 3 of the leagues teams in the North West of England, all within a few miles of each other.

It has been a hindrance the make up of our league. We always look to Germany but they have pretty much two leagues - with a population of 80m - we have 5 leagues with a population of 60m (England). If Liverpool had one team, even if we had one team this side of the water and on the other - we'd be pulling in 60k regularly. 

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Just now, dockers_strike said:

Agree.

You seriously think Real madrid, Barcelona, Juve, Inter, Milan and the rest are intent on a 'franchise' and uprooting their club to Shanghai or somewhere else in the world or it it just us?

 

Honestly, what fucking garbage.

 

Nope. They won't need to and they don't have American owners. We do. I did specify our owners. They are following the exact same model that led to the LA Raiders/Oakland Raiders/Las Vegas Raiders - that is their model. If you don't think that is a possibility then I think you are wrong. 

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8 minutes ago, Jockey said:

 

Nope. They won't need to and they don't have American owners. We do. I did specify our owners. They are following the exact same model that led to the LA Raiders/Oakland Raiders/Las Vegas Raiders - that is their model. If you don't think that is a possibility then I think you are wrong. 

I support the Minneapolis Red Devil Liverbirds FC, not Liverpool FC. 

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8 minutes ago, Jockey said:

 

Nope. They won't need to and they don't have American owners. We do. I did specify our owners. They are following the exact same model that led to the LA Raiders/Oakland Raiders/Las Vegas Raiders - that is their model. If you don't think that is a possibility then I think you are wrong. 

So because 'we' and a few other clubs have US owners, we're going to go for a franchise and uproot our clubs while Real, Juve etc are going to stay put?

 

You really havent thought it through.

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Just to play devil's advocate slightly. 

 

Say this is going ahead no matter what, we'd have no choice but to get in board or fuck off. Those getting on board, what changes to what's proposed would we like to see to at least make this shitshow a tiny bit more palatable?

 

Some sort of European super league is inevitable, there's been talk about it for too long that won't go away, and there's too much money at stake. At this point the best we can do is maybe accept the super league is happening, but make our voices heard with regards to how we want it to be set up. 

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15 minutes ago, Jockey said:

 

Nope. They won't need to and they don't have American owners. We do. I did specify our owners. They are following the exact same model that led to the LA Raiders/Oakland Raiders/Las Vegas Raiders - that is their model. If you don't think that is a possibility then I think you are wrong. 

I agree, I could see it. In a couple of decades we'll be supporting the 'North-West Knights' (formerly Liverpool and Manchester clubs) in the NW European conference. Market forces are reductionist, the bigger and more successful consume the smaller and less successful. In 100 years there will only be one European club playing against globally located competitors. 

 

I'm thinking Rollerball, the 70's one not the remake.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Jockey said:

 

Nope. They won't need to and they don't have American owners. We do. I did specify our owners. They are following the exact same model that led to the LA Raiders/Oakland Raiders/Las Vegas Raiders - that is their model. If you don't think that is a possibility then I think you are wrong. 

Not sure it's the same thing moving a team from one city to another in the same country, compared to moving us to China. I don't think it makes sense. 

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Just now, Daisy said:

The longer Gary neville rages about this, the more I want it to happen. Fuck you Everton as well

They should invite Salford City in for a laugh. That would piss off Everton as well.

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8 minutes ago, Aventus said:

Just to play devil's advocate slightly. 

 

Say this is going ahead no matter what, we'd have no choice but to get in board or fuck off. Those getting on board, what changes to what's proposed would we like to see to at least make this shitshow a tiny bit more palatable?

 

Some sort of European super league is inevitable, there's been talk about it for too long that won't go away, and there's too much money at stake. At this point the best we can do is maybe accept the super league is happening, but make our voices heard with regards to how we want it to be set up. 


No turning back lads, Cortez the killer.

 

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1 minute ago, Aventus said:

Not sure it's the same thing moving a team from one city to another in the same country, compared to moving us to China. I don't think it makes sense. 

I think that these teams and owners will do whatever is the most commercially viable. They are already showing this now.

 

It seems clear that they are also more interested in new fans than these legacy fans.

 

Who knows who will move and where to, however, as i said above, i dont think it makes sense to have 3 teams all within a few miles of each other (Us, Utd and City), if there is a viable case for an American or Chinese franchise. There is already a move away from these new fans from supporting teams and supporting the best players. If this continues, they wont care if the name says Liverpool or Man Utd or whoever else. 

 

I also think that this whole episode will be a lesson to this new league (Should it go ahead). They wont want teams becoming too strong and branching off into a new organisation, with this gravy train now being the one derailed. I think they will want the power in the Super League brand, much like the UFC for example or NBA (Though for different reasons), rather than the individual teams and for this reason, i think the franchise thing will eventually happen, though maybe many decades down the line.

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2 hours ago, Stickman said:

 

This is exactly what some people were saying in the early 90's when I used to go to matches. Almost word for word! I appreciate what the lad is saying, but FSG for all their faults revolutionised us as a business. 

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Wouldn’t they just expand the league or create various super leagues and invite an already established American, Chinese, Brazilian et al sides to those leagues or the expanded leagues rather than move Liverpool to Mumbai or Manchester United to Los Angeles?

 

I completely agree that this would lead to further globalization of the sport, and that’s even their stated goal it seems (certainly with fans), but I think it’s hyperbolic to suggest they’re going to relocate well established clubs when it’d be easier to use existing clubs in other locations or even create entirely new clubs in other locations.

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1 hour ago, Trumo said:

Nearly 48 hours after the announcement and I'm still trying to work out exactly how I feel about this development. I know I don't like it, but I'm not frothing rabidly like a lot of the fuckwits that have already aired their opinions publicly.

 

The hypocrisy of it all is not a mere whiff but a full-on stench.

 

A lot of those that have already aired their opinions are people who owe their wealth and livelihood to the exact same thing happening in England nearly 30 years ago. The same thing happened in Europe with the creation of the Champions League, and then the expansion to allow non-Champions to enter thereby guaranteeing that Europe's biggest clubs would really have to make a mess of things to not even be involved. Journalists who've had a go at the idea would jump at the chance of being allowed to cover it. Shirt-burning weapons are a waste of oxygen anyway.

 

What confuses me is that I'd have thought this to be another shot at the bows of UEFA (and FIFA) by the bigger European clubs. UEFA basically threw FFP out of the window when exonerating Man City for flagrant breaches on a technicality. It would seem obvious that these clubs would want to take UEFA to task at some point. The problem is, Man City are one of the clubs that have signed up to this new league. Does that mean the clubs are OK with what City did? Considering PSG have not been invited does suggest that the big European clubs are not happy with sport-washing regimes. The German clubs have declined to join, supposedly because they are against the sporting merits of this new league awash with money. I suspect that in Bayern's case it is less about that, and more that they would need to completely overhaul their ownership structure, they'd be casting aside influential figures from industry, and they'd be much less of a financial behemoth in this new league than they are in Germany. Their voice wouldn't be as loud as before, and that thought unnerves them.

 

Was the timing of this meant to make UEFA get their arses in gear and announce how they would revise the European calendar in the years ahead? I'm not sure that's entirely the case because UEFA's plans had been discussed at length (the so-called 'Swiss model') long before they made their official announcement.

 

For all the talk of banning the clubs involved and their players, if all the top players are banned, then the sponsors of the affected competitions and the TV rights holders are not going to be happy to have invested so much money in an 'inferior' product. An action to ban may be lauded in many circles but it would be shooting themselves in the foot.

 

Both sides of this have left themselves at an impasse.

UEFA didn't exonerate City though, they gave them a two year ban. City took the matter to CAS and got it overturned.

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45 minutes ago, Denny Crane said:

This is from a Sky reporter so take with a pinch of salt but.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Glad he can say something apart from "THIS COULD BE JADON SANCHO'S LAST CHANCE TO JOIN MANCHESTER UNITED"

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11 minutes ago, Saintslfc13 said:

Wouldn’t they just expand the league or create various super leagues and invite an already established American, Chinese, Brazilian et al sides to those leagues or the expanded leagues rather than move Liverpool to Mumbai or Manchester United to Los Angeles?

 

I completely agree that this would lead to further globalization of the sport, and that’s even their stated goal it seems (certainly with fans), but I think it’s hyperbolic to suggest they’re going to relocate well established clubs when it’d be easier to use existing clubs in other locations or even create entirely new clubs in other locations.

Quite possible. I think this notion some have of the US owners 'franchising' us is a daft as shearer's 'chuck them out the league!' comment.

 

So in a newly united front to create a stand alone Euro League, the English club's owners, or just ours, are going to franchise the club and uproot it in China or some other major city around the world while the other members of the Euro league nod approvingly, is frankly absurd.

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