Air France 447 Rio-Paris missing over Atlantic

[JohnnyH]

I see there’s talk now that the aircraft may have crashed into the sea nearer to the airport from where the last signal was received, suggesting that they may have turned back before they crashed. This is going to be one hell of an interesting case.

[Dan Vito Corleone]

There's also reports reaching me that the last of the automated signals sent at 2:14am indicate that the plane suffered from issues with cabin pressure.

[wiiksie]

There's also reports reaching me that the last of the automated signals sent at 2:14am indicate that the plane suffered from issues with cabin pressure.

Are you manning your own news desk Dan??

[Dan Vito Corleone]

I have got that from my mate who works for a national newspaper. Having said that, some research shows that Wiki says the same thing...

[JohnnyH]

There's also reports reaching me that the last of the automated signals sent at 2:14am indicate that the plane suffered from issues with cabin pressure.

 

That would explain the lack of a call to ATC. Would certainly explain a lot.

[Ezekiel 25:17]

Why don't they put an auto inflatable life jacket on the black box ??

[JohnnyH]

Why don't they put an auto inflatable life jacket on the black box ??

 

If it lands on the ground it could bounce and have someones eye out.

[Ezekiel 25:17]

There seems to be massive search going on for this woman, but the whole thing just stinks of racialism to me, what about the other 200 odd passengers ay, yeah find the black woman, that will give you all a good headline won't it, the world is fucked up I don't mind tellin' yeah:

 

[Ezekiel 25:17]

If it lands on the ground it could bounce and have someones eye out.

 

The actual answer is becasue that fat cunt Winslet would probably try and get on it and sink the thing the self absorbed cunt.

[kelly jones]

3 members of staff from my local hospital were on that plane..

[Ezekiel 25:17]

Surprise surprise:

 

Air France received bomb threat days before 447 crash

 

Air France received a bomb threat for a previous flight from South America to Paris just days before Air France flight 447 crashed into the Atlantic Ocean.

 

Air France flight 447 disappeared over the Atlantic on Monday en route from Rio de Janeiro to Paris. All 228 people on board are presumed to have been killed.

 

This report comes from ABC News:

 

Also today, ABC News has confirmed that Air France received a bomb threat over the phone concerning a flight from Buenos Aires, Argentina, to Paris days before Air France flight 447 disappeared over the Atlantic Ocean Sunday night.

 

Authorities at Buenos Aires' Ezeiza Airport delayed the May 27 flight before takeoff and conducted a 90-minute search of the threatened aircraft. Passengers were not evacuated during the search, which yielded no explosive material. After the inspection, authorities allowed the plane to take off for Paris.

 

Four days later, flight 447 departed from Rio de Janeiro. There was no known threat against the missing flight.

 

It's difficult to know how often airlines receive bomb threats, said Emily McGee, spokeswoman for the Flight Safety Foundation.

 

"I think that they happen periodically," she said. "Here' were not putting a whole lot of stock in it (the bomb threat) in the discussions internally."

 

As far as theories of what happened to flight 447, investigators had immediately dismissed terrorism on Monday but have since backtracked.

 

"First thing Monday morning, they were saying it was definitely not terrorism," McGee said. "They seem to be pulling back from that. It would strike me that they are keeping all the options on the table."

 

Also on the table: Blaming weather and blaming the computer.

 

InformationWeek editor at large Paul McDougall explores computer failure: "In the the Air France disaster, there's a particularly urgent need for government authorities to eye the aircraft's on-board computer system as a possible culprit."

 

He explains the purpose of the Air Data Inertial Reference Unit, or ADIRU, which sends data about the plane to the autopilot.

 

"Never has 'garbage in-garbage out' carried such dire consequences," McDougall writes. "And the fact is, wonky ADIRUs have been identified as the culprits in several recent near-catastrophes. Last year, for instance, authorities blamed the ADIRU after a Qantas Airbus 330 started porpoising wildly while at cruising altitude. There were 51 passenger injuries, ranging from broken bones to spinal damage."

 

Aviation Safety Network is compiling details about the crash, as it does for all plane accidents. This part is technical, but it explains the computer systems failures on board the aircraft:

 

Over a time span of four minutes, starting at 02:10 UTC, a series of ACARS messages were sent -automatically- from the plane. The first message indicated the disconnection of the autopilot followed and the airplane went into 'alternate law' flight control mode. This happens when multiple failures of redundant systems occur.

 

From 02:11 to 02:13, multiple faults regarding ADIRU (Air Data and Inertial Reference Unit) and ISIS (Integrated Standby Intsruments System) were reported. Then on 02:13 the system reported failures of PRIM 1, the primary flight control computers that receive inputs from the ADIRU and SEC 1 (secondary flight control computers). The last message at 02:14 was a 'Cabin vertical speed' advisory.

 

On the weather front, Bloomberg News is reporting that "updrafts and lightning" may have helped "knock the airliner from the sky."

 

And finally, Miles O'Brien writes about the long, slow search to find the airplane's black box, and what researchers will do to find it.

[Anubis]

Isn't the point of terrorism to actually claim responsibility, and therefore make yourself feared? As far as I'm aware, nobody is laying claim to this, are they?

[sh#t waffle]

Isn't the point of terrorism to actually claim responsibility, and therefore make yourself feared? As far as I'm aware, nobody is laying claim to this, are they?

 

The terrorists were on the plane and forgot to tell anyone.

[Anubis]

The terrorists were on the plane and forgot to tell anyone.

Someone always misses something off the list.....

[sh#t waffle]

Yeah, they remembered just as the plane was starting to move, but they were told to switch their mobiles off.

[tokyojoe]

Surprise surprise:

 

Air France received bomb threat days before 447 crash

 

Air France received a bomb threat for a previous flight from South America to Paris just days before Air France flight 447 crashed into the Atlantic Ocean.

 

Air France flight 447 disappeared over the Atlantic on Monday en route from Rio de Janeiro to Paris. All 228 people on board are presumed to have been killed.

 

This report comes from ABC News:

 

Also today, ABC News has confirmed that Air France received a bomb threat over the phone concerning a flight from Buenos Aires, Argentina, to Paris days before Air France flight 447 disappeared over the Atlantic Ocean Sunday night.

 

Authorities at Buenos Aires' Ezeiza Airport delayed the May 27 flight before takeoff and conducted a 90-minute search of the threatened aircraft. Passengers were not evacuated during the search, which yielded no explosive material. After the inspection, authorities allowed the plane to take off for Paris.

 

Four days later, flight 447 departed from Rio de Janeiro. There was no known threat against the missing flight.

 

It's difficult to know how often airlines receive bomb threats, said Emily McGee, spokeswoman for the Flight Safety Foundation.

 

"I think that they happen periodically," she said. "Here' were not putting a whole lot of stock in it (the bomb threat) in the discussions internally."

 

As far as theories of what happened to flight 447, investigators had immediately dismissed terrorism on Monday but have since backtracked.

 

"First thing Monday morning, they were saying it was definitely not terrorism," McGee said. "They seem to be pulling back from that. It would strike me that they are keeping all the options on the table."

 

Also on the table: Blaming weather and blaming the computer.

 

InformationWeek editor at large Paul McDougall explores computer failure: "In the the Air France disaster, there's a particularly urgent need for government authorities to eye the aircraft's on-board computer system as a possible culprit."

 

He explains the purpose of the Air Data Inertial Reference Unit, or ADIRU, which sends data about the plane to the autopilot.

 

"Never has 'garbage in-garbage out' carried such dire consequences," McDougall writes. "And the fact is, wonky ADIRUs have been identified as the culprits in several recent near-catastrophes. Last year, for instance, authorities blamed the ADIRU after a Qantas Airbus 330 started porpoising wildly while at cruising altitude. There were 51 passenger injuries, ranging from broken bones to spinal damage."

 

Aviation Safety Network is compiling details about the crash, as it does for all plane accidents. This part is technical, but it explains the computer systems failures on board the aircraft:

 

Over a time span of four minutes, starting at 02:10 UTC, a series of ACARS messages were sent -automatically- from the plane. The first message indicated the disconnection of the autopilot followed and the airplane went into 'alternate law' flight control mode. This happens when multiple failures of redundant systems occur.

 

From 02:11 to 02:13, multiple faults regarding ADIRU (Air Data and Inertial Reference Unit) and ISIS (Integrated Standby Intsruments System) were reported. Then on 02:13 the system reported failures of PRIM 1, the primary flight control computers that receive inputs from the ADIRU and SEC 1 (secondary flight control computers). The last message at 02:14 was a 'Cabin vertical speed' advisory.

 

On the weather front, Bloomberg News is reporting that "updrafts and lightning" may have helped "knock the airliner from the sky."

 

And finally, Miles O'Brien writes about the long, slow search to find the airplane's black box, and what researchers will do to find it.

 

Iwas waiting for this one to come out. The fact that there may be serious design faults in Airbus's will be ignored. A lot of current production model Airbus's have crashed, often young airplanes. Mainly A320 family.

[Nerik]

Totally disagree. We live in an age where a storm shouldn't bring down a commercial jet. Let alone probably the second most advanced flying.

 

No plane, even when tested flies into a thunderstorm the size of the ones found in the ITCZ. We live in an age where nature still reigns supreme despite all our advances.

[RobbieOR]

There was either a bomb or a explosion in the fuel tanks. If the plane just nose dived to the sea would it not just sink or would it still explode?

[tokyojoe]

No plane, even when tested flies into a thunderstorm the size of the ones found in the ITCZ. We live in an age where nature still reigns supreme despite all our advances.

 

I've flown though that part of the world on various Boeings, and bounced up and down like a fucking yo yo. Scared the shit out of me but I'm still here.

 

As Agt Provocateur says, a modern jet can (should) cope. If the forecasts were that bad, it shouldn't have taken off.

[Nerik]

Irrespective of this, severe turbulence normally sees a plane drop 2000-4000 foot rapidly and the usual probelms turbulence brings. It should not bring a plane down 35,000 foot straight into the sea.

QUOTE]

 

Normally? Severe turbulence has no normal way of happening. Planes rarely fall 2,000-4,000ft rapidly in turbulence. Also a drop of 2-4000ft is not the worst thing that can happen. Being bumped up, then down, then up, down again is what will cause severe stress on the airframe. It will trip the autopilot, it will make the aircraft lose certain protections, it can disorient the pilots. If that is then coupled with a lightning strike that blanks the instruments even temporarily......

 

If the aircraft ends up stalling, a wing breaks off etc. then it is a loooong way down. Never happened so far but there is always a first. Everything aligned to make something happen. May not have happened this time around too and even if it did there are still other things that have to be explained and studied. For example I've read that this same aircraft was once involved in a ground collision with an A320. If an in-flight break up is confirmed rest assured that that area of the plane will be under scrutiny.

 

Also such severe weather is usually avoided so there would have had to be some reason as to why they flew into it/so close to it etc.

[Nerik]

I've flown though that part of the world on various Boeings, and bounced up and down like a fucking yo yo. Scared the shit out of me but I'm still here.

 

As Agt Provocateur says, a modern jet can (should) cope. If the forecasts were that bad, it shouldn't have taken off.

 

Forecasts are always accurate are they? Also did you bounce up and down inside thunderstorm cells or whilst dodging them? The area is very turbulent due to the trade winds and turbulence is often experienced there. However no commercial jet will fly through a cell knowingly, especially one of that size.

[tokyojoe]

Irrespective of this, severe turbulence normally sees a plane drop 2000-4000 foot rapidly and the usual probelms turbulence brings. It should not bring a plane down 35,000 foot straight into the sea.

QUOTE]

 

Normally? Severe turbulence has no normal way of happening. Planes rarely fall 2,000-4,000ft rapidly in turbulence. Also a drop of 2-4000ft is not the worst thing that can happen. Being bumped up, then down, then up, down again is what will cause severe stress on the airframe. It will trip the autopilot, it will make the aircraft lose certain protections, it can disorient the pilots. If that is then coupled with a lightning strike that blanks the instruments even temporarily......

 

If the aircraft ends up stalling, a wing breaks off etc. then it is a loooong way down. Never happened so far but there is always a first. Everything aligned to make something happen. May not have happened this time around too and even if it did there are still other things that have to be explained and studied. For example I've read that this same aircraft was once involved in a ground collision with an A320. If an in-flight break up is confirmed rest assured that that area of the plane will be under scrutiny.

 

Also such severe weather is usually avoided so there would have had to be some reason as to why they flew into it/so close to it etc.

 

Hmmm. Haven't heard that one mate.

[Nerik]

If you visit PPRUNE you will read that claim. Do not know if it has been verified but the people claiming it seemed well in the know. Even if true it could not have been of any importance in the incident.

[philyhamann]

And finally, Miles O'Brien writes about the long, slow search to find the airplane's black box, and what researchers will do to find it.

 

the DS9 guy?

[Ezekiel 25:17]

I've flown though that part of the world on various Boeings, and bounced up and down like a fucking yo yo. Scared the shit out of me but I'm still here.

 

As Agt Provocateur says, a modern jet can (should) cope. If the forecasts were that bad, it shouldn't have taken off.

 

Tokyo joe on his first experiences of the Gay Mile high club.