You're doing ok and everything dude, but...

[Chris]

SHUT THE FUCK UP.

 

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N156063070528-1023.htm

 

He couldn't have expected anymore than finishing third in the League and the Champions League Final? You're at the wrong club mate.

[coop]

He picked up in the 2nd half of the season but he crossing was still mainly aimless and hopefully wont be first choice RW come the start of the season.

[G Richards]

Pennant has turned it around and won himself an extension to his Liverpool career. I still think we'll end up with better in the first team ahead of him, but it is to his credit that he has put in some performances to at least earn himself a role in the improving squad.

 

One thing I don't like about modern players (and part of this might be an age thing, though I'm only 36!) is that they are quick to trumpet their achievements. Pennant has put in some decent displays lately but he should be quietly knuckling down and getting on with it and improving himself further, not bleating about what he thinks he does or doesn't deserve.

 

Pennant should consider how outstadning Carra has been for a good few years and tally up how many England performances that has resulted in. This will help Jermaine get some perspective.

 

Don't worry about England, worry about Liverpool.

[Charles Penrose]

I dislike the little shit.

[Paul]

I dislike the little shit.

 

I dislike the shit little shit.

[Neil G]

Pennant should consider how outstadning Carra has been for a good few years and tally up how many England performances that has resulted in. This will help Jermaine get some perspective.

 

Don't worry about England, worry about Liverpool.

 

Is right. Carra needs to have a serious word with him and tell him to stop shooting his mouth off and get his head down.

 

Anyway he's not good enough to get in the England side ahead of Wright-Phillips or Lennon, and that's before Beckham comes into the equation.

[Anny Road]

Thought he was shit when we signed him and have seen very little to make me change my mind.

He is not of international calibre.

 

And he is a nob

[dave u]

If he kept his mouth shut I could warm to him, as I think he can play.

[Paul]

If he kept his mouth shut I could warm to him, as I think he can play.

 

Any attacking player who doesn't weigh in with the goals isn't good enough for me. He'll never be a goal scorer and so I'd ditch him. A squad player if he's lucky (and he should think himself so, too).

[dave u]

A valid criticism Paul. He does need to score goals, and if he doesn't chip in next season then I would sell him. I think he's done enough to deserve another crack at it though.

[WaltonRed]

You also have to be fair to him and say aiming for one up front he's going to be hit and miss with his assists.

[sh#t waffle]

Any attacking player who doesn't weigh in with the goals isn't good enough for me. He'll never be a goal scorer and so I'd ditch him. A squad player if he's lucky (and he should think himself so, too).

I think that's overly black and white. giggs and Scholes didn't actually score prolifically this season, and even Robben and Cole don't score that regularly. It is a problem with Pennant, he does need to work on his goal scoring, but I don't think he's shit. He's a thoroughly dislikeable little oik, but I think he's more than deserved a chance next season based on his performances in the second half of the season. And I really don't think I'm being a blinkered, pro everything supporter for thinking that way.

[Carradona]

I think that's overly black and white. giggs and Scholes didn't actually score prolifically this season, and even Robben and Cole don't score that regularly. It is a problem with Pennant, he does need to work on his goal scoring, but I don't think he's shit. He's a thoroughly dislikeable little oik, but I think he's more than deserved a chance next season based on his performances in the second half of the season. And I really don't think I'm being a blinkered, pro everything supporter for thinking that way.

 

I agree with all of that.

[RoboRiise]

I've never truly warmed to him and whilst his recently improved performances have made me shift my stance somewhat, I've merely gone from wanting him away this summer to being happy for him to stay, providing it's as cover for our new RW. I'm certainly happy that he's found his bollocks over the last few months and is now willing to take players on when he has the ball, but he still needs to do some work on his decision making for me.

 

Anyway, I never really like to see players moaning to the media, regardless of the topic (unless it's Eto'o, Milito, Alves and Tevez moaning that they still haven't signed for us, obviously...) but I didn't interpret his comments as showing a lack of ambition - after getting bombed out of both domestic cups in January, third in the Prem and the CL final was the best we could have realistically expected, given the likelyhood of catching Chelsea and United at the time (I hoped for more obviously, but I'd be lying if I said I expected it this season) and I'm not having it that he meant he was happy to get to the CL final and not arsed that we didn't win it. He does have a point about the England squad this time too.

 

Even the harshest critic would have to admit that he had a good game in Athens, coming on the back of improved performances in the Premier League. Regardless of opinion about his long-term future with us, with Lennon out through injury and Gerrard unlikely to feature on the right for England, he should be looking forward to starting against Brazil at the new Wembley. Instead, Goldenballs gets the nod. The sole intention in recalling him (as far as I can tell) is to provide a distraction for the media in the build up to the game, a cash cow for the FA in marketing the first full international at the new Wembley and possibly a ready-made scapegoat/sacrificial lamb for McLaren should the unthinkable happen in the next Euro 08 qualifier.

 

We're supposed to believe that Beckham's recent resurgence in form, his majestic displays for Real Madrid that have propelled the club to the brink of the title, the imperious quality that he's shown in recent games have meant that he's recalled himself because he simply could not be left out. What a load of shit that is; as Joe Lovejoy points out in an excellent article in the Sunday Times, Beckham has only started four of Real Madrid's last 12 games, although in fairness he did apparently play a blinder against Deportivo at the weekend.

 

I say apparently because I didn't see the game, but that's hardly a problem because McLaren's not seen him play ahead of calling him up either. That's astonishing really, what the fuck else does he have to do? Is his schedule as an international manager so packed that he can't find a few hours to fly over to Spain for a game? I always had the impression that other than some routine work at FA HQ and the inevitable media opportunities, sponsors events and so on, an international manager's job when not actually working with a squad was to watch football. What's he done, got a few videos in? Has he been on YouTube do you reckon? I'd love someone to ask him that one at the next press conference.

 

Then there's the fact that as recently as six months ago Beckham was widely regarded as being completely finished at international level. I expected him to lose the captaincy when McLaren took over, rightly too - the new manager had to choose his own man, but McLaren surprised me with the balls he showed by dropping him completely and by having him nowhere near the squad since. In the meantime Beckham seemed to have accepted that his top flight career was on the wane by agreeing his final big transfer, a multi-million pound deal to become the footballing equivalent of a Vegas lounge act. He said that he had received offers from two "big Italian clubs" and "several Premier League clubs", although not "big" Premier League clubs, you'll notice. So, say Torino (snigger) and perhaps Parma or Samp for the Italians. For the Premier League, Bolton, Newcastle, Everton and Pompey (and I bet at least three of those are right). No wonder the white heat of the MLS suddenly held so much appeal, is it?

 

Best of all though and further proof (as if it was needed) that as an international manager, McLaren is about as much use as a chocolate teapot comes with his justification for welcoming Beckham back into the fold.

 

"All I'm thinking about is the next two games and we're not looking beyond that. The priority is the next 10 days. Obviously his form has been excellent at Real Madrid and he can help us win in Estonia. Beyond that, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it."

 

If McLaren honestly feels that he needs to go back on his clear rejection of Beckham as an international player in order to ensure victory against the footballing might of Estonia and more pertinently, if he feels that the difference between what Beckham will offer on the right and what Pennant would will be what makes the difference, he's a dead man walking as far as I'm concerned.

 

Pennant clearly wants to play for England and as long as he wants to play for LFC more, I have no issue with that. I'm convinced that FA employee Steve McLaren's decision to recall walking marketing opportunity David Beckham for this squad has a hell of a lot more to do with the first full England game at the new Wembley against Brazil than it does with the Euro 08 qualifier to follow and that's a shame when it means that a player like Pennant, who I think had definitely done enough to have expected a call-up especially with Lennon out of the picture, misses out.

[Carradona]

That second last paragraph RoboRiise sums it up.

 

I hope so much that England get beat. Will be brilliant to see what happens next.

[Paul]

I think that's overly black and white. giggs and Scholes didn't actually score prolifically this season, and even Robben and Cole don't score that regularly. It is a problem with Pennant, he does need to work on his goal scoring, but I don't think he's shit. He's a thoroughly dislikeable little oik, but I think he's more than deserved a chance next season based on his performances in the second half of the season. And I really don't think I'm being a blinkered, pro everything supporter for thinking that way.

 

I read last week that Pennant has 7 career goals. How is that going to improve any time soon? He's not Liverpool quality. I'd accept him as a squad player, but nothing more.

[George Costanza]

Paul's on a rampage :biggrin:

[MLB]

If he kept his mouth shut I could warm to him, as I think he can play.

 

 

Pretty much how I feel. He really needs to stop doing these interviews.

[Captain]

I will be absolutely stunned if Pennant turns out to be good enough, despite his recent improvement. Would not be surprised to see him sold this summer.

[sh#t waffle]

I read last week that Pennant has 7 career goals. How is that going to improve any time soon? He's not Liverpool quality. I'd accept him as a squad player, but nothing more.

 

Sure, but that was only half my point. If he can improve slightly, but carry on next season from where he left off at the end of this season in terms of threat when he has the ball and workrate off it, I believe with better strikers to aim for that he has the potential and the ability to play an important part. Kewell and Gerrard (and whichever superstars we bring in) can provide the goals (as Ronaldo does for United while Scholes and Giggs don't) for us, and Pennant can still be a worthy player for us as long as the rest of the team is scoring goals.

[Neil G]

I read last week that Pennant has 7 career goals. How is that going to improve any time soon? He's not Liverpool quality. I'd accept him as a squad player, but nothing more.

 

The thing is Paul, I can hardly remember anyone on here suggesting that he should be anything more than that. Even the vast majority of his supporters, including me, have been saying for most if not all of the season that his role should be as backup, either to Gerrard or to a top quality RW like Alves.

 

I honestly don't think there's that big a disagreement on this forum about Pennant's ability compared to what we need in that position.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

A good thread this, some cracking posts on it, notably Robo's, a great read as always and everybody has made valid points. He has earned himself a second season at this stage, that is all....and hopefully as a back up to the improved model that will be brought in this summer. Unfortunately for Pennant, he seems to be a confidence player and that confidence is gleaned from a run in the team and the knowledge that he has the trust of the manager which a run would indicate. If he is to be used as a back-up next season, his form will be as patchy and scatter gun as his appearances and his crosses when he does play.....its almost a self-defeating scenario as far as Pennant is concerned.

 

Im hoping that Alves comes, beds in quickly, does the required job and that will be Pennant back to Birmingham for about half of what we paid for him, either in January or next summer. Id like the lad to succeed, I really would, nobody actively wants a Liverpool player to be shite and get bombed out of the club, but each time he plays and you see his nasty little gish, you cant help thinking that hes a distasteful little squit who is playing beyond his level and is destined to be no more than a back up at any club bigger than Birmingham....If the new arrival achieves his potential then its a result on all levels...he has succeeded to the extent that Pennant is hardly needed and we get rid as Pennant is surplus to requirements. Im positive that Rafa sees him as no more than a back-up and a stop gap signing.

 

Pennant has recently had a taste of the big time by playing a CL final so he will be hungry for more so you would think that his motivation levels will be sufficient to be ready to step in and prove himself when needed at the start of next season which will allow an aclimatisation period for the new signing, and that he will be fresh enough anytime next season when called upon....like I said, a result across the board, and then when Alves owns the position, we sell Pennant next summer....the arrival of better players next season will also assist Pennant when he does play.

[RedinSweden]

Any attacking player who doesn't weigh in with the goals isn't good enough for me. He'll never be a goal scorer and so I'd ditch him. A squad player if he's lucky (and he should think himself so, too).

 

I can agree with this, but I would give him another season.

[MLB]

I think Pennant can definitely be part of a successful squad for us next season, and could make quite a useful contribution in the league.

 

He really does need to stop doing interviews about England, though.

[Kev Saunderson]

I think that's overly black and white. giggs and Scholes didn't actually score prolifically this season, and even Robben and Cole don't score that regularly. It is a problem with Pennant, he does need to work on his goal scoring, but I don't think he's shit. He's a thoroughly dislikeable little oik, but I think he's more than deserved a chance next season based on his performances in the second half of the season. And I really don't think I'm being a blinkered, pro everything supporter for thinking that way.

 

The thing with those players you mentioned above not scoring goals isn't really a problem to them clubs as they have 25+ goalscorers in other areas of the team. If we had that at Liverpool the Pennant thread would not even be an issue and maybe we would be calling him a great provider.