So who should be our next manager?

[TD_LFC]

9 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

Alonso needs to win the league to become the real top option. Otherwise, the body of work is just too small and his time as manager too short.

 

I don't think that's the clubs view.

 

He could win the league and not be selected because the numbers don't support it just as easily as he could not win the league and get the job.

 

Same for any manager the result is secondary to what the numbers show if the appointment of Klopp was anything to go by.

[Lee909]

3 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

 

I don't think that's the clubs view.

 

 

 

It should t be either. 

He's up against a squad so much bigger and more talented than his. Look at yesterday he was missing 5 of his general starting 11. And won't have his main striker for 4 months. And lost 2 of his back 3 for a month with AFCON. Finishing within 5pts of Bayern would be one hell of a achievement for him. 

[3 Stacks]

6 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

 

I don't think that's the clubs view.

 

He could win the league and not be selected because the numbers don't support it just as easily as he could not win the league and get the job.

 

Same for any manager the result is secondary to what the numbers show if the appointment of Klopp was anything to go by.

The results were secondary to his bad final season at Dortmund. That was the narrative. Before that, there had been tangible, long term proof that his teams not only performed irrespective of results, but also, actually won.

 

There is not a big enough sample with Xabi to have close to that same certainty.

[TD_LFC]

6 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

The results were secondary to his bad final season at Dortmund. That was the narrative. Before that, there had been tangible, long term proof that his teams not only performed irrespective of results, but also, actually won.

 

There is not a big enough sample with Xabi to have close to that same certainty.

 

I'm talking about any manager, they will be looking for a pattern of sustainable performances underpinned by numbers that back that up, if that aligns with a trophy great, if it doesn't it won't be a huge issue.

 

Would they like a long and illustrious history of winning trophies as well, sure, but it's far more likely we end up with a manager with a relatively minor (or non existent) trophy collection who fits the model.

[3 Stacks]

3 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

 

I'm talking about any manager, they will be looking for a pattern of sustainable performances underpinned by numbers that back that up, if that aligns with a trophy great, if it doesn't it won't be a huge issue.

 

Would they like a long and illustrious history of winning trophies as well, sure, but it's far more likely we end up with a manager with a relatively minor (or non existent) trophy collection who fits the model.

Agreed which is why someone like De Zerbi is even in the discussion.

 

Ultimately, though, when we are talking about making someone the top candidate, like people are saying with Xabi, it's nice to have tangible proof of winning at a high level, because of his lack of track record. Or else, to me, he can't be that far ahead of others.

 

Or else, we're making him favourite based on things like he played here, people in the game say he's smart and intangible stuff like aura. Which I'm aware some people will put big stock in.

[TD_LFC]

1 minute ago, 3 Stacks said:

Agreed which is why someone like De Zerbi is even in the discussion.

 

Ultimately, though, when we are talking about making someone the top candidate, like people are saying with Xabi, it's nice to have tangible proof of winning at a high level, because of his lack of track record. Or else, to me, he can't be that far ahead of others.

 

Or else, we're making him favourite based on things like he played here, people in the game say he's smart and intangible stuff like aura. Which I'm aware some people will put big stock in.

 

As a supporter, sure, not necessarily as a data analyst working for a club which will be a significant part of the early work on assessing Klopp's replacement.

 

Which is where we're perhaps talking at cross purposes because I'm saying what the club will do whereas you're talking about what supporters are doing.

 

[Code]

Can someone talk me through Guardiola’s experience before getting the Barcelona job?

 

He got the job because it was fuckin obvious he would be a great manager long before he even retired as a footballer , the same goes for Alonso. 
 

 

[Moo]

One definite positive, if we get Alonso, is that he might be afforded more time in the role before the dissenting voices start questioning his position.

Even Klopp only got two years at best.

Alonso with his links to the club and being a fan favourite will at least keep a few people quietened down for a while.

 

 

[JohnnyH]

[Babb'sBurstNad]

Sort of hope Alonso turns out to be shit now just so Code is wrong.

[El Rojo]

27 minutes ago, Code said:

Can someone talk me through Guardiola’s experience before getting the Barcelona job?

 

He got the job because it was fuckin obvious he would be a great manager long before he even retired as a footballer , the same goes for Alonso. 
 

 

Many were convinced Gerrard would be an excellent manager.

 

The case being made for Alonso is as much emotional as it is based on any empirical evidence, as the sample size just isn’t there yet. The clamour for him from most of us wouldn’t be there if he’d played for Chelsea rather than us.

 

Obviously he’d be better than Gerrard, but nobody can say with certainly how much better. There’s a gulf between being hugely promising and being Jurgen Klopp.

[Code]

19 minutes ago, Babb'sBurstNad said:

Sort of hope Alonso turns out to be shit now just so Code is wrong.

Im never wrong, so dont worry about that. 

[chrisbonnie]

1 hour ago, 3 Stacks said:

Agreed which is why someone like De Zerbi is even in the discussion.

 

Ultimately, though, when we are talking about making someone the top candidate, like people are saying with Xabi, it's nice to have tangible proof of winning at a high level, because of his lack of track record. Or else, to me, he can't be that far ahead of others.

 

Or else, we're making him favourite based on things like he played here, people in the game say he's smart and intangible stuff like aura. Which I'm aware some people will put big stock in.

 

So who wood you suggest then, if you don't mind me asking? 

[Code]

13 minutes ago, El Rojo said:

Many were convinced Gerrard would be an excellent manager.

 

The case being made for Alonso is as much emotional as it is based on any empirical evidence, as the sample size just isn’t there yet. The clamour for him from most of us wouldn’t be there if he’d played for Chelsea rather than us.

 

Obviously he’d be better than Gerrard, but nobody can say with certainly how much better. There’s a gulf between being hugely promising and being Jurgen Klopp.

I have never been convinced about that, I do think he was a bit unlucky with injuries at Villa though. 

[El Rojo]

1 minute ago, Code said:

I have never been convinced about that, I do think he was a bit unlucky with injuries at Villa though. 

I had great hopes for him and he seemed to hit the ground running at Rangers.

 

He was shocking at Villa, though, particularly when you look at what Emery has achieved with similar.

[JohnnyH]

I saw the Athletic earlier doing a piece about how they’ve had all their algorithms since November working out who will be the best option going forward, and that makes me think more and more that Alonso is going to struggle to get to the top of any list given his limited history. It could be a very interesting few months. 

[JohnnyH]

10 minutes ago, Code said:

Im never wrong, so dont worry about that. 

From the man who with 6 games left last season was “guaranteeing” us we’d get top 4, and we’re in fact odds-on favourites for 2nd….

[Creator Supreme]

34 minutes ago, JohnnyH said:

Aaaaagggghhhhhhh, my eyes, my eyes

[Pete]

Klopp, Ulla Klopp. 

[El Rojo]

[Bobby Hundreds]

8 minutes ago, JohnnyH said:

I saw the Athletic earlier doing a piece about how they’ve had all their algorithms since November working out who will be the best option going forward, and that makes me think more and more that Alonso is going to struggle to get to the top of any list given his limited history. It could be a very interesting few months. 

Yeah wasn't the thing with players too we'd rather spend 10 times what we could get them for by waiting until theyve had at least 150 games or some shit.

 

I may of made that up or dreamt it.

[Barrington Womble]

1 hour ago, Code said:

Can someone talk me through Guardiola’s experience before getting the Barcelona job?

 

He got the job because it was fuckin obvious he would be a great manager long before he even retired as a footballer , the same goes for Alonso. 
 

 

 

Is that because he was a drugs cheat who got away with it and they thought he was the man to scale up the operation? 

 

7 minutes ago, JohnnyH said:

I saw the Athletic earlier doing a piece about how they’ve had all their algorithms since November working out who will be the best option going forward, and that makes me think more and more that Alonso is going to struggle to get to the top of any list given his limited history. It could be a very interesting few months. 

Well if they're still running the algos now, it would suggest they're looking at coaches who a small number of games could impact the outcome. If they're looking at someone with 500 games behind them, the odd win or lose is going to be neither here or there.

 

I would be amazed if the data hasn't already told the story. It will be all the other parts they'll be looking at now after the data created the shortlist. 

[TD_LFC]

There were plenty who thought/hoped Gerrard would become Liverpool manager at some point (especially when he was taken under Klopp's wing) can't imagine there were many advocating for it based on his managerial career.

[bizzle10]

1 hour ago, Code said:

Can someone talk me through Guardiola’s experience before getting the Barcelona job?

 

He got the job because it was fuckin obvious he would be a great manager long before he even retired as a footballer , the same goes for Alonso. 
 

 

Agree but he had Messi too 

[TD_LFC]

1 minute ago, Barrington Womble said:

I would be amazed if the data hasn't already told the story. It will be all the other parts they'll be looking at now after the data created the shortlist. 

 

Yeah now the news is out in the open they'll be on to canvassing players they've managed, former teammates, former clubs, former coaches and managers. All the background no dickheads stuff they usually do.

 

They'll keep updating and refining the data and may even exclude the odd name if the continual refinement of data knocks them out of the running but the initial list will be broadly set.