Loris Karius

[Soleilrouge]

Our goalkeeping situation pre-karius was less precarious even though it was a pre-karius and precarious goalkeeping situation

[VladimirIlyich]

The problems yesterday are pretty typical of our luck with Goalkeeping lately. The first goal is one that a lot of goalkeepers are doing now yet we are one of the first to get caught out doing it. Why are goalkeepers having so much faith in their walls when new rules are making sure the wall is back 10 yards and its much easier to get it up and over,or through it in our case,due to the white spray enforcing it. This has to be down to coaches as I believe that keeper should always be more or less in the middle,slightly favouring the non wall side by about a yard or so. This poor coaching and data analysis. The second goal I cant blame Karius for as that bounce really helped the striker and Karius flattening him and getting sent off at that early stage was not worth it. Glad to see Klopp noticed how shit Lovren has recently slipped back into and replaced him with Klavan. I felt yesterday's problems were a hangover from Bournemouth and more to do with mentality and sluggishness than anything else. We have made a difficult xmas period even more difficult.

[Josef Svejk]

Limp wrists on the first. Yellow belly on the second.

 

That's aside from technical / coaching issues.

[Lee909]

So lets see whats happened since 2009

 

Reina went to shit

Mignolet looks worse than at Sunderland

Know a promising young German keeper looks to have gone to shit

 

Whats the one common link between all of them?

 

A ex Tranmere journeyman keeper taking over the coaching role at Melwood

[skend04]

Doesn't help that Carra and the two Nevilles are tearing into him. Ok he knows he fucked up and has fucked up again. He has a right to speak out - criticism turning into bullying. What'a their plan - to beat him down with criticism so he'll never speak out against them again in defence of himself.

A small comment as a riposte to Gary and Phil gets all prickly about it. I wonder who is taking the criticism a bit more personally out of the 3.

[The Golden Eel]

So lets see whats happened since 2009

 

Reina went to shit

Mignolet looks worse than at Sunderland

Know a promising young German keeper looks to have gone to shit

 

Whats the one common link between all of them?

 

A ex Tranmere journeyman keeper taking over the coaching role at Melwood

 

I don't think there is necessarily a common link.  I think it's possible, but it's not certain.  Reina lost his appetite for playing for the club and has been shit ever since.  What's to say Mignolet wasn't good enough in the first place?  And the same with Karius?  I find it hard to believe that Karius would be some world beater right now if we had a proper coach.  In fact, I don't buy that at all. 

[Lee909]

Im not saying he would be a world beater but every keeper he has been involved with has gone backwards under him. Fuck evern Brad Jones looks a better player in Holland than he did here. Im not saying any of them would have been great if Xavi Valero would have still been here but i doubt they would have got worse. He is like the reverse King Midas,everything he touches turns to shit

[Jairzinho]

I don't think there is necessarily a common link.  I think it's possible, but it's not certain.  Reina lost his appetite for playing for the club and has been shit ever since.  What's to say Mignolet wasn't good enough in the first place?  And the same with Karius?  I find it hard to believe that Karius would be some world beater right now if we had a proper coach.  In fact, I don't buy that at all. 

 

Reina is a better keeper now than he was in his last season for us.

[The Golden Eel]

Reina is a better keeper now than he was in his last season for us.

 

Well OK, but it's hardly overwhelming evidence.  There's probably something in it to some extent but I just think we've signed shit keepers since Reina left.

[Jairzinho]

Well OK, but it's hardly overwhelming evidence.  There's probably something in it to some extent but I just think we've signed shit keepers since Reina left.

 

I'm almost certain we've done both. Shit signings, compounded by having a shit goalkeeping coach.

 

On the former we just seem to completely overlook their mentality. Keepers at big clubs need to be confident, have presence, and ideally be a bit of a cunt.

[VladimirIlyich]

I love how loyal are fans are.

I certainly would like to see another gk coach get a go with him and Mignolet. Also remember that Klopp had Weidenfeller for years at Dortmund and he was far from spectacular. I am still willing to trust Klopp's judgement and will give him plenty more time before writing him off.

[Hades]

Neville and Carragher are both pricks.

[aRdja]

Carra is having another pop...

 

http://www.espnfc.co.uk/liverpool/story/3017712/liverpool-legend-jamie-carragher-tells-loris--karius-shut-up-and-do-your-job

[TheHowieLama]

Carra is having another pop...

 

http://www.espnfc.co.uk/liverpool/story/3017712/liverpool-legend-jamie-carragher-tells-loris--karius-shut-up-and-do-your-job

 

He is 100% right. Imagine what he would be telling him if he was in the dressing room - that is what this squad is missing.

[aRdja]

He is 100% right. Imagine what he would be telling him if he was in the dressing room - that is what this squad is missing.

And a good goalkeeper.

[Unrighteous]

So lets see whats happened since 2009

 

Reina went to shit

Mignolet looks worse than at Sunderland

Know a promising young German keeper looks to have gone to shit

 

Whats the one common link between all of them?

 

A ex Tranmere journeyman keeper taking over the coaching role at Melwood

 

Exactly.  Need GK coach is absolutely required, and it has been since Reina got ruined.

[Lee909]

Valero is wasting away in China go and get him back

[TheHowieLama]

All I can say is Achterberg better be putting in 30 hours a day this week.

[Paco]

Jim Beglin ✔@jimbeglin

Blaming the goalkeeping coach for match day mistakes? I'd stick to blaming the keepers. #LFC

[AngryOfTuebrook]

The worrying thing is he looks more and more just like a pretty average keeper, just like the ones you’ll find plenty of in the Championship and League 1 and 2.

 

We can’t know of course but there’s every chance we’d have 6 points instead of 1 from our last two games with a good keeper, maybe even with the Mig.

 

If my name was Mignolet I’d ask for a transfer asap, as being second to the one who’s taking his place now is an insult.

If your name was Mignolet you'd know how it feels to be dropped for Brad Jones and Adam Bogdan.

 

Seriously, anyone who thinks Mignolet is the answer is asking the wrong question.

[G Richards]

The media love a good bandwagon. Not so long ago it was Rafa's zonal marking system. We had to listen to inane comments like, "I've never seen the space score a goal!" The stats showed that Rafa knew what he was doing, but the bandwagon rolled on.

 

Fast forward to our (relative) defensive problems this season. I haven't seen much analysis from the media about the difference Matip makes, or the paucity of shots the team were conceding, or how, when it is going well, we defend as a unit from the front. No, you get a couple of crazy games and it's all, "Liverpool can't defend." Again, the media love a good bandwagon.

 

Now it's Karius' turn. He's rich, young, good looking and confident, so clearly he needs a kick in the plums from Barry Chuckle. Unfortunately Carra has joined in a bit too much for my liking. Last week Karius defended Carra's comments by saying he's a fan and is entitled to be upset about the result. It took the sting out of it a bit, while he also adroitly slapped Neville down with one of the best one-liners I've seen. "He was a top player, then he was a manager for a short bit, and now he's back to being an expert again."

 

Karius has not been solid enough, so criticism should be expected, but at the moment it's not even handed. The West Ham goalkeeper made a dreadful mistake in spilling the cross right to Origi, but I'm not sure he's getting much stick for it.

 

Karius should see all of this as a badge of honour. He is at a big club and he's in the spotlight, so being criticized is part and parcel of that. If he played park football only a handful of people would know if he made a mistake. What he now needs to do is get his head down, work hard, and improve. He had a pop at Neville, which we all loved. Now improve your game lad, and we'll love that even more!

 

One final word on Carra. As a pundit he can say what he likes, and he does a great job. In this instance it's tricky, because he's criticising his own. Liverpool fans love Carra, and rightly so, but it's not hard to see how a small gap could open up between our manager and a former player. It will be interesting to see if Jurgen accepts any more MNF invitations in the near future. I'm betting he won't. He will defend his goalkeeper to all outsiders and will also circle the wagons a bit on this one. Carra will be viewed as a media person outside of that circle. I'm not saying there will be any ugliness or a longstanding Ferguson-style spat, but I wouldn't be surprised if things are a bit different between Klopp and Carra as we move forward.

[magicrat]

Carra is having another pop...

 

http://www.espnfc.co.uk/liverpool/story/3017712/liverpool-legend-jamie-carragher-tells-loris--karius-shut-up-and-do-your-job

 

And he's spot on. If anything he has pulled a few punches.

 

Still a lot of people defending Karius and blaming Achteberg 

Getting behind the team doesn't always mean accepting something that is obviously wrong even when Klopp is behind it.  Smacks of stubbornness now if he persists with this lad

The five points dropped in the last two games we will probably look back upon in April as crucial .We don't have the luxury of letting Karius learn his trade in the first team

[Denny Crane]

Posted this in another thread but spamming this thread. Achterberg shouldn't be walking alone.

 

Achterberg could be the Johan Cruyff of goalkeeping coaches. But sadly peoples minds are closed.

 

Most people acknowledge the input from the youth team setup for players development from say 16-23 as a number of contributing factors. It would be hypocritical not to acknowledge that under Achterberg the likes of Gulasci and Hansern and Danny Ward have developed.

 

Most people seem to acknowledge that gk coaching is less to do with the manager. They are totally different to outfield players in their training from the bits I understand.

 

Not sure how you bring up Rodgers, Firmino and Lallana but I would certainly give credit to Southampton and Hoffenheim where they were between 16-23, wouldn't you?.

 

Now flip it on its head and imagine how shit Karius and Mignolet would be without Achterberg.

 

I think people are looking for excuses understandably why are our goalkeepers are shit. But maybe they aren't that good and you can't polish a turd.

[moof]

I'd hope that he's strong enough mentally to not give the slightest fuck what Neville or Carragher say about him.

It's not just that, though, is it? Neville is talking shit, whatever. Carra is a club legend, his worlds hold far greater significance than some manc rat. You think him tearing into Karius doesn't resonate with the squad and people in the stadium on match day? He's active on social media so he's bombarded with this shit 24 hrs a day. A young guy, in a position of enormous pressure. I'm not surprised he's all over the place. Football, and Liverpool in particular is one massive fucking echo chamber. People sense a weakness and that's it, and when his own fans are giving him way ott shit what chance does he have? If he's not feeling the heat then he's not human.

 

Just because he's earning money doesn't mean he's immune to harsh criticism.

 

The narrative is set, sadly. People aren't going to let up, they will keep picking at him until his confidence completely unravels. For, what... two mistakes? I'm not having that he singlehandedly cost us the points in these last two games, either. Football doesn't work like that.

[Denny Crane]

Oh Brad Jones winning keeper of the year is probably evidence we all know nothing about goalkeepers.

 

Most of us thought he should have been melted down for glue.

 

Secondly 90% of people on here slagged Reina off said he was a busted flush but he is playing at a high level. The fsg gangsters conned you.

 

Lets be honest the judgement about keepers on here is of a very low level we are a bunch of spoofers and charlatans when it comes to goalkeeping.