Luis and that incident

[ratcatcher]

Not posting this to re start a thread on what he said \ didnt say but in case some might want to read his version

 

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/oct/26/luis-suarez-am-i-a-racist-no-absolutely-not-i-was-horrified

 

Luis Suárez: ‘Am I a racist? No, absolutely not. I was horrified’

In the second exclusive extract from his new book, Luis Suárez maintains that his use of the word ‘negro’ in his row with Patrice Evra was misunderstood by people who do not speak Spanish
• Read the exclusive first extract from his book
• Interview: Suárez – me and my big mouth

• The Guardian, Sunday 26 October 2014 22.57 GMT

Liverpool's Luis Suárez clashes with Manchester United's Patrice Evra during the match at Anfield on 15 October 2011. Photograph: Lindsey Parnaby/EPA

Did I use the Spanish word “negro” in an argument that took place, in Spanish, with Patrice Evra on 15 October 2011 in a game between Liverpool and Manchester United?

Yes.

Is the word “negro” the same in Spanish as it is in English?

No, absolutely not.

Am I a racist?

No, absolutely not.

I was horrified when I first realised that is what I was being accused of. And I’m still sad and angry to think that this is a stain on my character that will probably be there for ever.

I knew that Liverpool vs. Manchester United was the biggest game in English football for all the years of rivalry, and maybe even more so since Manchester United surpassed Liverpool in the number of league titles won.

It wasn’t my first game against them. We had played the season before and there had been no problems; the usual run-ins and clashes but nothing that I remember.

 

I first became aware there was a problem when Damian Comolli approached me after the game and asked me if anything had happened between me and Evra. At first I struggled to remember anything specific.

There had been an argument, but then I had probably had quite a few arguments during the game. Comolli said to me: “Well, they are complaining about racism.” I was very surprised.

 

I recalled that the referee had called us over at one point. Evra had come looking for me at a corner asking me why I had kicked him. It is always a bit hypocritical when a defender who spends the whole game kicking you complains of being kicked.

 

He initiated the argument and he chose to do so in Spanish. In the following exchanges between me and him I used the Spanish word “negro” once.

What some people will never want to accept is that the argument took place in Spanish. I did not use the word “negro” the way it can be used in English.

 

As I am now fully aware (and I did not even know this at the time), in English there is a word that is spelled the same way but is pronounced differently and it is highly offensive: negro, pronounced nee-gro. Negro (pronounced neh-gro) in Spanish means “black”, nothing more. It is not in itself an insult. Now, people will say: “Okay, but you said ‘black’ – you shouldn’t have.” But Evra had started the argument in Spanish and the Spanish language is full of these ways of addressing someone: “Guapo” (handsome), “Gordo” (fatty), “Flaco” (skinny), “Rubio” (blond), and so on. Just names based on physical characteristics, nothing more. Negro can refer to anyone with dark hair as well as dark skin and I’ve been used to the word being used in Spanish in this way all my life. My wife sometimes calls me “Negro” or (the diminutive version) “Negrito”. My grandmother used to call my grandfather “Negrito” and she would occasionally call me that too. I’m not trying to pretend it was meant in a friendly way to Evra because clearly we were arguing. But nor was it ever meant as a racist slur.

 

The second important point is that I said to Evra: “Por qué, negro?”. “Por qué” means: “Why?” It was me asking him why he was complaining, first about the foul and then about me touching him. I told Comolli this, but by the time my version had been passed down the line to the referee it ended up not as “Por qué, negro?”, but as “Porque eres negro”, which changes the meaning drastically; “porque” doesn’t mean “why?”, it means “because” – the phrase became “because you are black”. I never said, nor would ever dream of saying, “because you are black”. And I certainly never said, and never would say, that I would not talk to Evra, or anyone, because they are black.

 

But nobody had time for these subtleties when I was being condemned for racism. Especially not after the tone had been set by Evra’s original accusation that I had called him not “negro” but “nigger”, which he later admitted was wrong. He changed the accusation later but the stigma of me being someone who would use such an abusive term stuck.

 

According to Evra I had used the N-word – which at first he said was “nigger” and then changed to “negro” – five times. But he was the only one that heard it and even he was not sure what he had heard. I had said it once, in the context I have explained above, without intending any racist meaning at all. But on the basis of his accusation I was found guilty.

 

I told Comolli what had happened. He then told Kenny Dalglish and they both told the referee and it was that version that went to the hearing.

Why did I not go to the referee’s room myself? Because nobody told me to and because I did not speak good English. I’m not saying this is Comolli’s fault.

 

Absolutely not. He is the one who had to transmit exactly what I had said to the referee and there are intricacies and nuance in the language where you have “Por qué” and “Porque”, and you have the word “negro” as it is used in the Spanish language and how it can be used in English.

 

Regardless of how “por qué” became “porque” there were about twenty-five cameras focused on the action, and three lip-readers asked to study the footage, and nothing shows me saying what I was accused of repeatedly saying. And no one else heard me say the word despite the fact that according to Evra I had said it five times to him in about ten seconds. Later he told French television channel Canal Plus it had been “ten times”.

Evra doesn’t speak Spanish very well. He started the argument in Spanish but it was very basic Spanish – as if I was to say in English: “Why you hit me?” It was hard for me to understand what he was saying to me. I remember he called me “Sur Americano” – “South American” – but I didn’t understand much more than that.

 

If you don’t speak Spanish, then don’t accuse me of insulting you in that language, let alone insulting you ten times. I can’t understand why he didn’t confront me in the tunnel. If it had been so offensive wouldn’t he have grabbed me and said: “What did you say to me out there?” And I would have said to him: “If you really think I said that, then you have not understood me properly.”

 

In the next few days, as I started to realise how serious the situation was, I decided I would not say another word. I could have said a lot of things. Maybe I should have said a lot of things. The club told me to stay silent and I was also conscious of the fact that it would be better to say nothing rather than say things when I was angry. I had not been in England long. My English was still very poor. Language at the time was a far bigger problem for me than it would be now.

 

Maybe someone should have told me: “Luis, we have every camera angle and none of the footage shows you saying ‘negro’; just deny it.” But I was honest. Some people didn’t want to understand that I said “negro” in Spanish during an argument in Spanish and in a way that I just didn’t understand to be racist and absolutely did not intend to be racist. Maybe I would have avoided all problems if I had just denied ever using the word. Instead I told them what I had said, not least because I did not understand it would be a problem.

 

What hurts is when people say: “Luis Suárez? – good player, bit crazy sometimes … and a racist.” Or worse: “Luis Suárez: racist.” Nothing else, just that: racist. The word hurts, the accusation is painful. I think that is why I reacted the way I did at Fulham when I showed the finger to some abusive supporters and picked up another ban. All I could hear was that word.

 

Put “Luis Suárez” into an internet search engine and up comes the word “racist”. It’s a stain that is there for ever. And it is one that I feel I do not deserve.

 

Afterwards, no opposing defender, black or white, used what had happened against me. There were no provocations along those lines. Black players still came to swap shirts at the end of games. That made me really happy but I was conscious of not wanting to be seen as the guy who goes out of his way to prove he is not a racist. Sometimes I felt I couldn’t win. If I swapped shirts with a black player it was because I was a racist trying to hide my racism; and if I didn’t swap shirts with a black player it was also because I was a racist.

 

Once the formal letter from the FA had reached the club, I don’t really think we knew the best way to go about dealing with it. The lawyers took control of the case. They told me throughout the hearing: “Don’t worry, you answered the questions well and things are being said that go in your favour.” They said that it would be two or three games if any, as if the number of games rather than clearing my name was the most important thing. Looking at it now with a cooler head, I don’t think we handled it well. We were not able to put across that this word was used in Spanish and that it has nothing to do with the “negro” word as it is pronounced and used in English; that fact never really got grasped by anyone at the hearing. All that people saw was: “Suárez said ‘negro’.”

 

The days of the hearing were awful. I got up at 6.30 every morning to be at the hotel where it was held by 7.30. A taxi would come to pick me up and I would go on my own every morning and I would return at eight or nine o’clock at night having spent the whole day in one of the meeting rooms at the hotel waiting to be called. And in the end, amid all the talking, I was only actually asked to give evidence once in the four days. I would speak to my wife on the phone and she would ask: “What are you doing now?” “Nothing, still just sitting here.”

 

I didn’t understand what I was supposed to be doing there. What was my function locked up in that room? The lawyers explained to me that there was no proof of any sort that I had done anything wrong, but that I was being accused of having changed my story, that I was now saying I had said one thing but that, via Comolli, I had told the referee I had said something else. Basically, they said my story did not seem credible because of that. They took more notice of what Damien and Kenny had relayed I said, than what I was now telling them I had said. I would be shown evidence from other players and witnesses and was supposed to verify it but it all needed translating and we all know how big the final report was. I still have it somewhere but I’ve never read it. I have it in Spanish and it’s about 115 pages long. If I read it now I will only get upset all over again.

 

I was banned for eight games and, much worse, got labelled a racist for life. You can call me “big-mouth”, “biter”, “diver”. There is proof. But to call me a racist – that hurts a lot. It’s a serious accusation. It hurts because of how it affects me, it hurts because my wife had to suffer too through the hearing, watching me getting accused of being someone she knows I’m not, and it hurts because in the future the stain will still be there when my children grow up. It’s a slur on my name that no one can take away.

 

I never asked for Evra’s forgiveness because I felt I had done him no wrong. If there was ever a chance of reconciliation, what happened pre‑match when I next played against Manchester United in February 2012 put paid to it. I had every intention of shaking Evra’s hand in the team line-up before the match. I had spoken to my wife about it before the game and said that I would. As I was walking down the line, Evra was shaking everybody’s hand, but he lowered his hand when I reached him. He shook Jordan Henderson’s hand before me, and his hand moved downwards, away from mine. The images are there for everyone to see. My hand stayed outstretched at the same level but once he’d lowered his, I thought: “Okay, he’s not going shake my hand,” and I continued along the line.

 

Once I had passed him he started with the show of grabbing my arm and protesting that I hadn’t shaken his hand. And he looked towards Sir Alex Ferguson to see if Daddy was watching. If it was a trap, I fell into it.

The headlines were written: “Unrepentant Suárez refuses to shake hands.”

 

Kenny was too worried about the game to worry about whether we had shaken hands or not anyway. He defended me throughout. He said to me: “Every time I go into a press conference I have to take a shield to bat off all the Luis questions: ‘Luis this; Luis that.’” He reached the point where he had to say: “Are we here to talk about football or Luis?” It was difficult for him. But he knows how grateful I am for all that he did for me.

 

The hearing left me with a stain on my character and I don’t ever plan to speak to Evra again in my life. He came out of it as the innocent victim and I came out of it with my character tarnished for ever.

People at the time said: “They [Liverpool] are defending him because he is a good player and they can’t afford not to.” No. They defended me because they knew me.

They knew what kind of person I was inside the dressing room. They knew how I was with my family. They knew what I’m like off the pitch.

They know me. They know I’m not a racist.

 

[ngogswilly]

The hand shaking thing was the biggest evidence of collective "see what you want to see" in history. Evra without doubt lowered his hand. Anyone who denies that is a liar straight up. Now I always maintained Suarez was a tube for not deliberately forcing the issue and making evra look bad by forcing the handshake. But evra has and always will be a snake and he stitched Luis up big time that day

[thompsonsnose]

That's defo worth a read and worth posting.

Evra is a snake.

End of.

But we all knew that.

Like most of the French national team know that.

[SOFTLAD]

This is and will always be unfinished business we ve had one of the greatest players ever wear our jersey and because of whatever actions / excuses, his time here became a personal and political nightmare for the club, we will be unable to move on and it looks like it will always stigmatise Suarez as well, in the end his departure was deceivingly contrived, that does cloud anything he says since.

[index1000]

This is and will always be unfinished business we ve had one of the greatest players ever wear our jersey and because of whatever actions / excuses, his time here became a personal and political nightmare for the club, we will be unable to move on and it looks like it will always stigmatise Suarez as well, in the end his departure was deceivingly contrived, that does cloud anything he says since.

No offence but every single thing you said in that post is complete bollocks.

[SOFTLAD]

Your either the prick in the middle or the bollock to the left or the bollock to the right thats politics

[JohnnyH]

The depressing thing is wait until you see how the British press spin those perfectly reasoned comments. "Unrepentant racist Luis Suarez just will not apologise" will no doubt feature on the Mirror.

 

Yet England's Lion never gets anything said. Despite being banned (for only 4 games of course) due to unquestionable video evidence of him calling a player a "black cunt". No xenophobic hypocrisy in the English media - no siree bob.

[ngogswilly]

The depressing thing is wait until you see how the British press spin those perfectly reasoned comments. "Unrepentant racist Luis Suarez just will not apologise" will no doubt feature on the Mirror.

 

Yet England's Lion never gets anything said. Despite being banned (for only 4 games of course) due to unquestionable video evidence of him calling a player a "black cunt". No xenophobic hypocrisy in the English media - no siree bob.

 

That's always been the big one too hasn't it. 

 

I think the fact that this has never really been addressed by any prominent english journalist speaks volumes. 

 

It basically tells you all you need to know about them, pathetic cowards. 

[A_S]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/football/luis-suarez-reveals-why-he-bites-people/story-fndkzvnd-1227102600161

 

More interesting comments. 

[Major Tom]

Yet England's Lion never gets anything said. Despite being banned (for only 4 games of course) due to unquestionable video evidence of him calling a player a "black cunt". No xenophobic hypocrisy in the English media - no siree bob.

 

Like pretty much every other country's national press, then. Everyone prefers - and defends - their own. Look at the Uruguayan national press and Suarez.

 

But, fuck I Luis. What an absolute champion that guy is. A lunatic on the pitch but what a fucking champion.

[xerxes]

A star on the pitch, and a dissembler off it.

 

The Evra incident was a car crash for all involved.

 

As for the book, after the events of the summer I am not surprised he is trying to recover some lost PR ground. I look forwards to reading the LFC bits with interest. Anyone know who wrote the book for him?

[Frankenhooker]

Suarez obviously has his problems, but I believed he was innocent of racism at the time, I still feel the same now.

 

I don't care how the press respond to his comments, or his book in general, he's out of harms way now and anything they write will only be masking their own xenophobia.

 

The biting however, can't be defended. Plenty of players play on the edge but don't resort to biting, although he has a point about contrasting punishments.

 

No doubt he's a decent lad off the pitch, I wish him well.

 

[Major Tom]

A star on the pitch, and a dissembler off it.

 

The Evra incident was a car crash for all involved.

 

 

Can you expand on that, mate? He appears a fantastic bloke off the pitch.

[moof]

The way he deacribes it is almost exactly what the majority on here were saying at the time, and the only version that really makes sense.

 

Stil fucking pisses me off how badly we and him were stiched up.

[xerxes]

Can you expand on that, mate? He appears a fantastic bloke off the pitch.

I was thinking of his ill-advised explanation of the World Cup biting incident, and his interviews whenever he was away on international duty.

 

A fabulous forward, one of the best we have ever had, mind.

[Bjornebye]

Evra is a little cunt

[Jay86]

Evra is a little cunt

You missed out the word horrible.

 

He's a horrible little cunt.

 

He's a fucking weasel of the highest order. Fergie mark II.

[KevieG]

How much more boring is the league without him.

 

What kind of media hounds out by far and away the best player in its own league.

[Major Tom]

How much more boring is the league without him.

 

What kind of media hounds out by far and away the best player in its own league.

 

The media didn't hound him out at all.

[xerxes]

What kind of media hounds out by far and away the best player in its own league.

Barca lifted their skirts and asked for a love bite, no hounds required.

[KevieG]

The media didn't hound him out at all.

 

I'm not saying he probably wouldn't have eventually wanted to go to Madrid or Barca but he was vilified for practically his whole time here.

 

Anyway, you were in the Evra camp so we'll probably disagree.

[Major Tom]

I'm not saying he probably wouldn't have eventually wanted to go to Madrid or Barca but he was vilified for practically his whole time here.

 

Anyway, you were in the Evra camp so we'll probably disagree.

 

Yeah, it was the media's fault. Suarez clearly wanted to stay but the Daily Mail forced him out. You're deluded there, Kevie.

 

Evra camp? Me? Nup. Wrong person, my friend.

[Trumo]

I still think Evra spoke to the Canal+ reporter before he told his manager and referee what his supposed problem was. He'd been in a pissy mood since before the match kicked off and was still in that mood as the players left the pitch, and it was while in that mood he told the reporter the highly embellished version of events (while he later retracted without it ever being brought up either in the report or it the media) to portray Suarez as a racist. This dubious account is what was presented to the referee before anyone from the Liverpool camp was made aware of any problem. 

 

It astonishes me that nobody has gone into more detail about Evra's conversation with the reporter, outside of what the reporter quoted Evra telling him. We know they spoke after the game but it's been taken on assumption that it was AFTER Evra and Man Utd had made their complaint to the referee. 

 

My thinking has always been: Why would Man Utd allow Evra to mouth off to a journalist about such a serious matter using quotes that he would later retract at the hearing? Their well-oiled PR machine would take control of the situation and certainly make sure that anything Evra would say to the media tallies with the official complaint to the referee. As I said at the beginning, it didn't tally because he went mouthing off to Canal+ first and then realised he'd have to make an official complaint or be accused of bullshitting (again).

[Spy Bee]

It was a stitch up then and it's a stitch up now.

[VladimirIlyich]

Anybody who understands the use of the word negro in Spanish knows its nothing like the way its used in English. And taking the word of both a liar with previous(Chelsea groundsman) and poor Spanish speaker is pathetic.

 

Evra is a coño.