Did Robbie Keane get a fair crack of the whip?

[redrosetints]

So many people have blatantly not answered the question with posts about whether he was good enough or not. That is plainly beside the point - he did not score enough goals in his six months here to be considered a success. The question is nothing to do with other players either; it's about whether or not you feel Rafa used him in a way that was most likely to get the best out of him. If anyone answering yes genuinely believes that then I'd like to hear what they'd have to say if they were on the recieving end of an equivalent decision where they work.

 

But thats

 

"it's about whether or not you feel Rafa used him in a way that was most likely to get the best out of him."

 

surely a sub question of the thread title rather than the same ?

 

In terms of being played to his strengths, he played as a link man, target man and he played up front on his own a few times, he didn't look convincing in any position. We changed our formation to 442 on a few occasions, most notably against Everton recently and he was anonymous.

 

But that asks another question, which is do you change formation to accommodate a new player, or sign a player who fits our formation ? Which brings us back round to why was he signed in the first place ? And that's a whole other discussion which we've had going on for ages !

 

He didn't fit in July, he didn't fit now and he wont fit in the summer, so best to cut our losses.

[Heinze]

has this been posted?

 

[Brownie]

has this been posted?

 

 

Haha that's excellent.

[sniperLFC10]

i think that robbie should of been picked after the west brom game where he had scored 2, this would of started his scoring run off.There isn't a need to keep swapping strikers about as we have seen in past seasons with rafa changing players you need a core 7-8 players week in week out, as this season shows.

[silverlining]

Not even close.

 

Fernando Morientes got a year and a half - I don't think you could say his performances were that much better than Robbie's.

 

 

No you couldn't.

 

You could say they were much worse, though.

[JMARKH]

i think that robbie should of been picked after the west brom game where he had scored 2, this would of started his scoring run off.There isn't a need to keep swapping strikers about as we have seen in past seasons with rafa changing players you need a core 7-8 players week in week out, as this season shows.

 

Arsenal and Bolton as well, Rafa said he never played to his level yet he never got a chance as soon as there was any danger in Rafas mind that Keane was looking good he deliberately snubbed him. Rafa wanted him to fail.

[kopheart]

No he didnt but in saying that if he cost £8 mill he would have prob got a fairer one - meaning not sold after 6 months...

 

Robbie didnt set his 20m tag - Parry's clumsiness in negotiating transfers is where the primary responsibility sits. Think Domino effect

 

Did he show enough even for 8m in the 6 months he had? I winced many times when I thought he would be passed the ball - air shot king. Although credit where credits due the goals he scored evidenced his quality but overall contribution when on the pitch was poor. I struggle to understand how RK went from being technically OK to technically shite when he left the Lane. He'll probably be as good as hes ever been back at the Lane. The only reason that stands up is that although Rk has gone to many clubs, there have been none as big as LIVERPOOL. Quite simply the pressure of playing for LFC coupled with being a boyhood fan was way too much for him....... in the 1st 6 months

 

Should he have been given more time by Rafa? Simply YES, any knowledge of RK before he was bought would have highlight the fact RK hits top form after xmas, where the bulk of his goals have come in previous seasons. I dont believe Rafa needed to sell, just stick him on the bench until he comes good.....and he couldn't have gt any worse.

 

Would we have rued a decision to keep him and miss out on a return? Should have took the chance especailly as we are this close to the title. The situation is exasperated by the fact we paid so much for a player that old with little chance of a substancial return if he was sold on after his 30th.

 

Also struggle to get my head round the fact we will make a loss, be aplayer down and with no apparent savvy by Parry /Rafa to insist on a quick deal in order to secure a replacement. Think if Torres falls injured again - who we got Ngog, Kuyt? Or hold firm to a player swap /loan....

 

On face value RK seems to have wanted the move, if so I dont believe the drive for the transfer vcame from Rafa on his own. RK, dodgy Harry al played their part. Parry as usual wouldnt have been able to sqeeze out another 1-2 m from Spurs given the fact that Defoe is out for 10 weeks due to pitiful lack of business acumen.

 

Does Raf know what hes doing? To all you Rafa doubters, I say he's not 100% right all the time but he must be a brilliant manager as he's basically improved a similar set of players over the last 2 years to premiership title contenders. Only Riera has added value (RK ultimately didnt in the time he was hear) to the first team!!

 

He is obviously not the most gifted when it comes to personal man management...but thats where the boot room should fill in and cover..isn't it?

 

 

RK should have sat tight and fought for his place, refused the deal - the fact that he didn't justifies Rafas decision. The only players playing for LFC should be the ones who really want to when push comes to shove.

 

THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE RK FIASCO IS SHARED in this order

 

RK - didn't perform, agreed to return to Lane

PARRY - amateuristic transfer approach, paid too much, sold for too little,

RAFA - sanctioned move at wrong time, not enough time given

[t1971]

[Stu Monty]

Quality advert.

[redrosetints]

Jockys take on it

 

 

Exclusive: Keane Had Enough Chances Liverpool - Hansen

 

13 hours, 10 minutes ago

 

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Alan Hansen was a colossus on the pitch for Liverpool and Scotland, becoming a true Anfield legend and collecting a host of medals in a glittering playing career. And since hanging up his boots he's become a giant of football punditry too, renowned for his forthright views and analyses which are eagerly anticipated by millions of viewers of BBC TV's Match of the Day every week.

 

Hansen watched the latest Merseyside derby, in which Everton prevailed 1-0 against Liverpool to knock the Reds out of the FA Cup, and praised the decision-making of Toffees' boss David Moyes and the tenacity of his team. Hansen isn't convinced Robbie Keane would have turned things in the Reds' favour - or that the dismissal of Leiva Lucas greatly affected the outcome.

 

Gosling Cooks Liverpool's Goose

 

"The Merseyside derby was not one of the best games to watch in terms of entertainment, but the FA Cup is all about getting a result and that’s exactly what Everton got. All credit must go to David Moyes for this win as the Blues are having a fantastic season. Liverpool have been receiving all the accolades and plaudits for leading the League for most of the season but Everton have gone about their business quietly but are on a terrific run despite a relatively small squad," said Hansen.

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"Moyes' decision to throw on youngsters Dan Gosling and Jack Rodwell with Liverpool down to 10 men following the dismissal of Lucas proved a very brave one. The lad Gosling then goes on to score the winner so it worked out perfectly. I must admit the way things were going this one looked a certainty for penalties as it was such a tight match even with Liverpool a man light. There was really nothing between the teams over the 90 minutes and extra time, but that’s football.

 

Keane Was A Flop

 

"Rafa Benitez is receiving a lot of stick at the moment particularly with the sale of Robbie Keane to Tottenham. The press have been quick to suggest Robbie could have made a big impact on the game last night and he wasn’t given a fair crack of the whip, but the simple truth of the matter is that the lad came to Liverpool and didn’t play well.

 

"People will argue that Robbie didn’t have the chance to impress and was played out of position but he had numerous chances to score goals in a Liverpool shirt and he didn’t take them. If you look at his record, Robbie did start a lot of matches. OK, some may have been up front on his own which isn’t his best position, but he had lots of opportunities to score and for some reason or another, he failed to convert them. A record of just five League goals for a £20 million striker is not good, so you have to say his move was a failure.

 

"OK, so six months is not a long time to settle into a new club but that’s modern day football for you. I have no doubts he’ll go back to Tottenham and do well as he’s a hero down there and a very good player, it just didn’t work out for him at Liverpool. Was Rafa wrong to sell him without getting a replacement in? Well to be fair the lad hardly played in the last five or so games and was not even in the squad so there was no real point in keeping him though now a hell of a lot rests on the shoulders of Fernando Torres and his fitness.

 

Hamstrung Torres

 

"Once again Torres didn’t have the best of games but that’s all down to the injuries he’s suffered with this season. Last season when the Spaniard was one-on-one with a defender he flew past them but his game is based on his pace and hamstring injuries take their toll on that. If he’d had an ankle or knee injury it wouldn’t be such a problem but the hamstring really affects a player so it will take him time to get back to his best though he looked far sharper against Chelsea. Liverpool have Dirk Kuyt and Ryan Babel who can play up front, but winning the title is all about strength in depth - which is something [Manchester] United have in abundance.

 

"Will the confidence gained from the win over Chelsea be affected by last night’s defeat? I don’t think so personally, the cup is a whole different thing to the league and Liverpool will bounce back strongly with a good chance of three points at Portsmouth at the weekend.

 

Losing Lucas

 

"Much has been made of [Leiva] Lucas’ sending-off last night changing the game, but although I think the lad had the intention of winning the ball when he stuck his leg out, Lescott was charging forward and though the contact was minimal, by the letter of the law he had to go. In all honesty it didn’t really make much difference to the outcome of the match as extra-time looked a certainty with neither side creating much. I don’t go along with the theory that Everton were too aggressive, either, as watching from the stand I felt that the actual game was quite subdued and not as frantic and fast as a normal Merseyside derby.

 

"Liverpool need to come back strongly and will definitely miss Steven Gerrard but all credit must go to Everton and David Moyes as they deserve a good cup run for their recent performances."

[ToxtethTerror]

Keane speaks....

 

Rafa was a baffler: Keane hits back at Liverpool boss Benitez

By Simon Cass Last updated at 9:50 PM on 06th February 2009

 

Robbie Keane last night blamed Rafa Benitez for turning his Liverpool dream into a nightmare, insisting he was left 'baffled' by the Spaniard's decision to ignore his talent.

 

Keane, 28, was sold back to Tottenham on the final day of the transfer window after 190 days at the club he supported as a boy.

 

Breaking off from preparations for tomorrow's north London derby, Keane revealed he had not even been given an explanation by Benitez as to why he turned his back on him so quickly.

 

He said: 'I believe that maybe with a different manager, it possibly could have worked out. I never regret anything I have done. It's not a mistake. I went there, it didn't work out for me. For whatever reason, I didn't fit into the way Rafa plays football.

 

'I was doing everything possible to do well for the team. That was the most important thing. I never had a fall-out with the manager, I was never late for training and I came and trained every day. I worked my socks off, it's as simple as that. You're probably as baffled as I am.'

 

Having played 19 Barclays Premier League games for Liverpool, Keane would be eligible for a medal should his former team win the title. But Keane conceded a medal would be an empty gesture, adding that he would probably give his away.

 

Asked whether a medal would mean anything, Keane replied: 'Not really. Not at all. My brother is a Liverpool fan so I'd probably give it to him, although he's a Tottenham fan now.

 

'If I was there (at Liverpool) and I was out of the squad, it probably wouldn't mean as much to me because, as a player, you want to be a part of it. When you are in and out of the squad and left out of the squad, sometimes you don't feel a part of it.'

 

Benitez's decision to omit him from the Liverpool squads for the first FA Cup meeting with Everton and the vital Premier League game against Chelsea provided the greatest disappointment for the Ireland striker, while frequently being named on the substitutes bench or being hauled off when handed a start did little to improve his mood.

 

'I've never been left out of a squad in my career,' said Keane. 'I think I've proven over the years that I'm quite capable of doing a job and scoring goals. No disrespect to anybody at Liverpool and the players that were ahead of me but if you look at my record compared to most of them, I think it's probably a little bit better.

 

'I believed that I should have been in the squad, and I believe in my ability, that I should be playing more games than I did. The fact is I didn't.'

 

Portsmouth striker Peter Crouch agreed with Keane's view that Benitez did not feel the need to explain his selection policy to his players.

 

Crouch said: 'I feel sorry for Robbie Keane. He didn't get a fair crack of the whip under Benitez. Rafa doesn't give a lot away and he's been a very successful manager, but there were times when I used to try and second guess him to work out whether I would be playing.

'I was usually wrong, so in the end I just gave up. The big one for me was the Champions League Final against Milan when he played one up front - Dirk Kuyt - and left me on the bench. I was desperate to get on because you never know if you will ever play in a European final again.'

 

Keane has now swapped league title hopes and Champions League aspirations for a relegation battle at Spurs.

 

He has been handed the captain's armband by Harry Redknapp and will lead the team out to face Arsenal at White Hart Lane tomorrow lunchtime.

 

With his Liverpool career consigned to history, Keane is eagerly anticipating the challenge of ensuring Tottenham's topflight status under Redknapp, a manager with whom he feels he can build a close bond.

 

'Obviously, Harry has a record of having a great relationship with his players,' beamed Keane. 'I've been speaking to the lads about him and I am really good mates with Jamie Redknapp, so I know Harry through that. He speaks to the players, and when he gets a player in, he certainly gives them an opportunity and that's something I'm relishing.

 

'You don't become a bad player overnight. I believe in my ability and I believe I could have brought a lot to that Liverpool squad. Maybe it was fate. I move on to the future and I am fully focused on Tottenham. I am back where I think where I belong.'

 

With Crouch backing him.. both were treated badly in my opinion.

[Catch22]

"I am back where I think where I belong."

 

Yes Robbie, that is rather the point.

[ScottyT]

"I am back where I think where I belong."

 

Yes Robbie, that is rather the point.

 

Are you on the Benitez payroll or something?

 

Whatever the reasons for him leaving, he's right in what he says and the manager used him poorly and as part of his ongoing political manouvering.

[Catch22]

Are you on the Benitez payroll or something?

 

Whatever the reasons for him leaving, he's right in what he says and the manager used him poorly and as part of his ongoing political manouvering.

 

Hardly. Rafa made a mistake in buying him in the 1st place.

 

He is at the level he belongs & will do well there.

[ScottyT]

At his level? What, a proven striker in the best league in the world?

 

Anyway, surely you judge players by their wages, no?

[Catch22]

At his level? What, a proven striker in the best league in the world?

 

Anyway, surely you judge players by their wages, no?

 

Is he moving to La Liga?

 

Sorry that's flippant but i hate all the Sky "PL is the best in the world".

 

It's come top once in its existence in Uefa's top league, has won 3 CL in 16 years & had the world's best player once.

[ScottyT]

We're the richest league in the world, so going by your skewed logic, it's the bestest.

 

I forget you had a chip on your shoulder about our league and culture, mainly because Benitez has struggled here.

[ToxtethTerror]

Is he moving to La Liga?

 

Sorry that's flippant but i hate all the Sky "PL is the best in the world".

 

It's come top once in its existence in Uefa's top league, has won 3 CL in 16 years & had the world's best player once.

 

Who were the semki finalists in last years CL? I think this is a good way to judge it given how much you love your Champions League.

[Catch22]

We're the richest league in the world, so going by your skewed logic, it's the bestest.

 

I forget you had a chip on your shoulder about our league and culture, mainly because Benitez has struggled here.

 

The richest is actually an objective measure that we have the best in the world which is more than most can come up with.

 

On most others we don't.

 

British over-estimation of it's sporting talents & betting against it is the only free lunch out there.

[ratcatcher]

Is he moving to La Liga?

 

Sorry that's flippant but i hate all the Sky "PL is the best in the world".

 

It's come top once in its existence in Uefa's top league, has won 3 CL in 16 years & had the world's best player once.

 

I think the viewing figures from around the world makes it the best in the world not some platini or blatter inspired co efficient rating system dished out by uefa of fifa!

[ScottyT]

I'm stumped now. Utter waffle can do that to you.

[barnesrush]

according to the latest from keane

 

" As long as I am given that opportunity, I will score goals. I don't have to prove myself to anybody.''

 

now as hes a red i feel genuinely sorry for the lad but its just confirmed my suspicions that hes a bit of a billy big bollocks.

 

hope the spurs fans forgive him this attitude

[Catch22]

Who were the semki finalists in last years CL? I think this is a good way to judge it given how much you love your Champions League.

 

 

I agree.

 

That's what the Uefa co-efficient syatem does.

 

The PL has come top once in its 16 years

[Catch22]

I think the viewing figures from around the world makes it the best in the world not some platini or blatter inspired co efficient rating system dished out by uefa of fifa!

 

I would guess that the most watched League in the world in both football or basketball may well be the Chinese domestic League in each sport.

I wouldn't say they are the best though

[ScottyT]

When Benitez leaves will you go with him?