"Kick it Out" campaign

[Faustus]

Serious question here:

 

Would Suarez be allowed to join Rio's group if it were set up? You know, seeing as Luis himself is mixed race because of his black ancestry...

[xerxes]

The FA and clubs along with the media had an excellent chance to educate fans, to show how things could have been handled but didn't.

 

The key point in a good post.

 

The FA have created a dangerous situaion where criminal and sporting association rules are in conflict- and show no sign of putting that right.

 

Chelsea are happy to have the playing figurehead of an old, proud, internationally known club going around calling the opposition fucking black cunts.

 

As a Club we have made no overt efort to highlight with the issue of educating foreign players on what you can and cannot say nor have we campaigned to get the FA rules,our rules which we agree to, changed.

 

I think that there is a leadership issue here.

[Nightcat]

Are you not happy unless you are bitching and moaning about something? Though, I guess this makes a nice change, as it's normally something to do with LFC.

 

Why's that Major? You hurt my feelings.

 

Is it because I think the FA are corrupt and FSG are shite? I won't stop saying that.

 

I like Gerrard, Suso, Sterling. Wanna talk about that instead?

[piscinin]

I don't think it breaks along those lines at all. If Ferdinand has issues with how racism is being tackled in the game, and if he feels that groups like 'Kick It Out' are not listening or doing enough, then promoting a black-only group is not the way to go about trying to help tackle the problem.

 

Creating a group that makes a point about not being funded by the FA seems to suggest that's where they think the line is. They're bored of hearing Ouseley and crew saying, "Ah, but it's the FA. So we'll sit on our hands because we have to be nice".

 

You think it's a black vs. white thing I take it.

[zigackly]

Ferdinand is a complete twat, so even if he did have a point any group headed up by him is doomed to spectacular failure.

[piscinin]

If you read around the issue and don't just assume that the headlines and soundbites comprise the whole issue, you will see that there is a large sense that the FA has not kept up. There is a new generation of "black" footballers for whom the racism is not just about stopping people calling you a nigger. They come towards the end of their careers and they see under-representation in coaching, management, governance, quangos. They go to FA headquarters and are immediately engulfed in a tide of 70 year old white guys.

 

As they've been exposed to similar industries like Music etc, they've started to ask questions about next steps. The FA don't even seem to acknowledge that any are necessary.

 

It's a pity that we tend not to take any notice until the media serve up a rent-a-mong like ferdinand because the message is invariably monged up.

[zigackly]

I get that completely, and I agree. Football has to be one of the most ethnically monolithic career choices out there, once you get past kicking a ball around. You're basically stuck with joining Kick it Out or being a pitchside pillock for the BBC.

[Trumo]

Creating a group that makes a point about not being funded by the FA seems to suggest that's where they think the line is. They're bored of hearing Ouseley and crew saying, "Ah, but it's the FA. So we'll sit on our hands because we have to be nice".

 

You think it's a black vs. white thing I take it.

 

No, I don't think it is a black vs white thing, in the simplest sense. It is never that simple.

 

Some of these players and media figures seem to feel the FA have been lenient with the punishment given to John Terry. The FA decided his punishment based on the same guidelines used (rule E3 etc) when deciding Luis Suarez's punishment. That the FA had no evidence (or couldn't dress flimsy evidence to suggest something that wasn't) to suggest that John Terry had repeatedly used the offensive words meant that they couldn't hand out a lengthier ban such as that given to Suarez. The difference in punishments was based on the number of times the racist words were found to have been used in each case.

 

The same people that are moaning about the FA's actions and the actions of the various campaign groups after the John Terry case were perfectly happy with how things were done with regards to Luis Suarez. They were busy patting each other on the back for a job well done, and openly talking about how thorough and well thought out the FA's disciplinary procedures were, and how hard the different anti-racism groups were working. They were happy because the outcome went in their favour, so to speak. This time round, they are putting it across as having gone against them because the outcome didn't quite pan out how they expected it to, so all of a sudden, the very bodies they were praising so much are suddenly incompetent and ineffective.

 

Also, I don't base my opinions on headlines and soundbites. I'm fully aware of the glass ceiling that coloured players face once they end their playing careers, and I fully endorse any viewpoint which says that any candidate for a role should be judged on competence and suitability for that role, not by their colour or ethnicity.

[piscinin]

Fair enough. Don't disagree that there are a bunch of self-serving people involved. As with any collective there's a mish-mash of motivations, mong and objectives. But there is a groundswell that goes beyond what you can see through the little windows of the media headlines. Terry is just the straw that broke the camel's back IMO.

[Iceman]

Anything that fucks up the FA is good in my book. I hope this runs and runs.

 

Poor millionaire footballers, life has been and continues to be so hard for them. Breaks your heart doesn't it?

 

I'm curious has Jason Roberts, Rio Ferdinand etc done anything for young black footballers in UK? Have they set up any scholarships, footy pitches in deprived areas, handed out free boots and kits etc etc

 

Also, if Rio hadn't been overlooked for Ingerland, would he still have not worn the t-shirt?

 

Racism has no place in football but Rio is a twat. How can he get away with the choc ice and coconut comments? No ban? No fine?

[Major Tom]

I'm curious has Jason Roberts, Rio Ferdinand etc done anything for young black footballers in UK? Have they set up any scholarships, footy pitches in deprived areas, handed out free boots and kits etc etc

 

Rio Ferdinand Foundation

 

Ferdinand does quite a bit in the community.

[zigackly]

Racism has no place in football but Rio is a twat. How can he get away with the choc ice and coconut comments? No ban? No fine?

 

He did get fined: Rio Ferdinand fined £45,000 by FA over 'choc ice' tweet - Telegraph

 

And the coconut comment was Piara Powar, who got away with just locking his twitter account and declining to comment: Boss of football's anti-racism group is branded a racist after calling Asian fan a 'coconut' | Mail Online

[Iceman]

Thanks boys, I'll update my files. Like I said before, Rio is an outstanding role model.

[Whelan]

Creating a group that makes a point about not being funded by the FA seems to suggest that's where they think the line is. They're bored of hearing Ouseley and crew saying, "Ah, but it's the FA. So we'll sit on our hands because we have to be nice".

 

You think it's a black vs. white thing I take it.

 

The argument is that KIO is about racism within football and should fall within the remit of the FA, it shouldn't be down to a pressure group external to the FA. There is a valid point - the FA can only really influence the debate within the game, society is not really their problem. The other problem is that this is all being driven within a primarily white, middle class media who see Black footballers as a homogenous group and who speak with one voice e.g. Rio speaks for all black footballers, the comment by Michael Langly on David James is symptomatic of the problem that John Barnes alluded to last year which is that he is far better placed to articulate and deal with racism than Andy Cole or Ashley Cole, but that is a debate that people in power are keen to avoid.

 

The Guardian which through Daniel Taylor who has been particularly sly regarding Terry when he keeps referring to the fact that Cole, Sturridge and Barnard have backed Terry but Drogba, Essian and Anelka did not, again suggesting a subjective point of view if it supports Terry/Suarez and an objective point of view if it criticises, we saw this with Barnes and Johnson last year and this year with Cole. The ease with which Rio moved on from the Choc Ice quote was disgraceful, it was a racially loaded, and incredibly offensive term, that was swept under the carpet because it was too hot to handle. The fine is fuck all. Again, black people must speak with a single voice.

 

Remember last year when Paul McGrath was allowed to dissmiss Glen Johnson's support, and criticise it as being harmfull to the KIO movement? Yet when Big Ron was caught out, he was the first one defending him. Nobody offered this as context, his point of view was just accepted and published without criticism.

 

Racism in this country, and in particular with regards to these cases has been one of a single defined narrative - that demands people subscribe to it. Our opinion on Suarez might not have been accepted, but it seemed that people had a problem that we had even had the temerity to question it. It was racism so accept the punishment and shut the fuck up, or you will be tarnished as well.

 

The FA don't lead, they rule and the media don't lead they lecture, until those two bodies get their house in order, nothing will happen.

 

On another note, the response of the FA when they are up in the Dock for killing fellow Liverpool fans is going to be very interesting!

[zigackly]

Great post Whelan.

[Gym Beglin]

I hate Ferdinand, but I'm not sure he should be getting too much grief over all this.

 

Normal people don't dislike black people, that's fucking fact. I don't see the panic, do they think that someone shouts racist abuse on the Kop and then people think " aye aye, that sounds good, I'll join in with that shit" and then all of a sudden there's 5,000 chucking bananas at Karl Henry?

 

Fuck off, if you hear someone shout racist stuff then you cringe and think "aye aye, he's mental".

[piscinin]

The argument is that KIO is about racism within football and should fall within the remit of the FA, it shouldn't be down to a pressure group external to the FA.

 

...

 

On another note, the response of the FA when they are up in the Dock for killing fellow Liverpool fans is going to be very interesting!

 

Not quite sure I follow, but if you're saying the media is a hive mind that serves up mediocrity because we let it, and the FA is full of old farts only interested in preserving the status-quo behind a veil of righteousness, then I agree.

 

If you're not saying that, then I disagree. Because it's you :)

[xerxes]

There is some excellent debate on here.

 

The issue of structural reform in the FA transcends the race debate. There are only a handful of the hundred odd senior officials who have even played the game professionally, let alone are not white.

 

The issue of the rules is in the hands of the clubs. It is a democratic sporting association, proposals can be made and all member clubs have a vote. If we, or other Clubs, want to amend the rules, we can, with majority support. Sadly the will to do it is not there- which is where I have some sympathy with KIO.

[Gym Beglin]

It's just bollocks, and this all comes at a time when the 'Respect' campaign is now not even mentioned, which is by far the biggest ill in the game.

 

The players have way too much power these days, it needs to stop, leadership should come from the FA and it's not, the game is pulling in all sorts of different directions and nobody seems to own football anymore. The media crown a new king every month, and just sit back and watch them fuck around and create stories for them.

[Whelan]

Not quite sure I follow, but if you're saying the media is a hive mind that serves up mediocrity because we let it, and the FA is full of old farts only interested in preserving the status-quo behind a veil of righteousness, then I agree.

 

If you're not saying that, then I disagree. Because it's you :)

 

Haha, that is what I am saying!

 

And even if it wasn't, it is now.

[No2]

I don't buy into the idea that black players are under represented in management, media and football in general. Today's managers are the players from 70's, 80's and 90's, the fact is racism was a problem from a different era, an era that meant virtually all players in 70's where white and the vast vast majority of players in the 80's where white too. It makes perfect sense that today's managers are white because all the players where white. It was only in the 90's and 00's that the number of black players started to spiral. I'm not old enough to remember further back than the mid eighties but from what I can see all the top black players had an opportunity of some sort to make waves.

 

Below is a list all retired black players to represent England, I am working on the basis that the best players, regardless of colour usually get the big gigs after retirement so using just England internationals is fair barometer imo.

 

Ian Wright - Very high profile within the media

Des Walker - went into coaching at Forest and seems to have disappeared off the face of the earth.

Viv Anderson - Went into management, failed. Works for MUTV

John Barnes - Failed in management, works for ESPN

Sol Campbell - Only just retired

Paul Ince - Failed at management

Stan Collymore - High profile on the radio

Cyrille Regis - Football agent

Paul Parker - Couple of low profile management jobs, works for Yahoo

Carlton Palmer - Failed in management

Luther Blisset - Still coaching

Michael Thomas - Not involved in football

Andy Cole - Doing his coaching badges

Ugo Ehiogu - Runs a music label

Chris Powell - Doing well in management

Keith Curle - Seems to be sacked regularly but still managing

Dion Dublin - Sky Pundit

Tony Daley - Fitness coach at Wolves

John Salako - Pundit at Sky

Mark Walters - Himself and Torben Pichnik are both teachers at Aston Villa's academy

Brian Deane - Sports consultant for solictors firm

John Fashanu - Hosts deal or no deal in Nigeria, mad cunt

Earl Barrett - Doing his badges, currently coaching at Man City

 

None of them are managing Real Madrid but Ian Rush, Bryan Robson, Ronnie Whelan and Tony Adams and plenty of others are white players from the same generation who also took up management and failed. The reason none of them still manage is because they where shite at it, not because of the colour of their skin.

[Hand Shandy]

John Fashanu hosts Deal or No Deal in Nigeria?!?

 

That's fucking hilarious!

 

Mad cunt indeed...

[Anubis]

I get that completely, and I agree. Football has to be one of the most ethnically monolithic career choices out there, once you get past kicking a ball around. You're basically stuck with joining Kick it Out or being a pitchside pillock for the BBC.

 

You could just smile at your hefty bank balance, and go and kick back on a beach somewhere. Wearing a halter top and tight denim shorts, naturally.

[njackets]

He has to be the biggest gobshite in the game.

 

Why the hell hasn't somebody pulled him up on the hypocrisy of his actions after the 'choc ice' retweet? Or, in fact, does he think he should have been banned for his actions?

 

I'll bet the daft twat doesn't even realise it would be fucking racist to set up a union where membership is granted based on an individual's skin colour.

 

Spot on, racism only cuts one way with some people though.

[Megadrive Man]

John Fashanu hosts Deal or No Deal in Nigeria?!?

 

That's fucking hilarious!

 

Mad cunt indeed...

 

Indeed.

 

I actually forget he was ever a football player.