Something I've been meaning to get off my chest for some time, regarding Rafa.

[Tom R]

A MASSIVE BAG OF SHIT.

 

Didn't even read that mate. Stopped after about 2 lines.

 

I'd rather saw my cock off with a blunt rusty spoon than read any more of your posts.

 

Cheers anyway though. I'm sure the rest of the forum enjoyed it.

[Whelan]

Worst. Debating. Tactic. Ever. Tom R, rules at everything, except mass debating.

 

I thought everyone was reasonably firm!, but it does become a bit polarised, although in all fairness I am just as guilty. I want Rafa to stay, end off, so don't really see other peoples points of view in that respect, which doesn't really make for an all round debate!

[ToxtethTerror]

Didn't even read that mate. Stopped after about 2 lines.

 

I'd rather saw my cock off with a blunt rusty spoon than read any more of your posts.

 

Cheers anyway though. I'm sure the rest of the forum enjoyed it.

 

Ha Ha... come on Thommo - we have to continue the debate - it's healthy.

[isr]

To be honest, ISR, that is a load of bollocks you've just posted there.

 

This forum is so fans can talk about the club and all of its staff. The forum is a pretty good spread of the feelings which would mirror that throughout the fanbase.

 

Trying to say, "Don't post anything negative about Rafa" is ridiculous. I'd hazard that only 15% of the fans on this forum alone would back Rafa regardless... 25% back rafa but have reservations... 15% probably sit on the fence or aren't arsed... 25% are leery about rafa and question where the club is going under his management... and 15% are against rafa and want him out regardless of what happens and 5% don't want to stick their oar in whatever the case.

 

What gives you the right to tell, probably, a majority of the forum to stop posting about a MAJOR talking point of this club?

 

No Unrighteous, you've misinterpreted the post (although you may still think the intended meaning is still bollocks - to each his own).

 

Here's what I'm NOT advocating:

1) you must all sing the manager's praises daily (from the officially sanctioned hymn book)

2) you may not criticise

3) you must believe that he is the man for the job

 

Now thats out of the way, what AM I trying to say?

 

Simply this. We have a chunk of "supporters" who have consistantly said how much they have lost faith in Rafa. Its been rammed down the rest of our throats, ad infinitum, since the 3rd game of this season. By now, we can all quote verbatim the same old stuff:

- Rafa is politiking and ruining the fabled "Liverpool Way" (hypocritical bollocks)

- Rafa is exercising a secret desire to prevent any Scousers from ever playing for Liverpool again. Thats why he has deliberatedly destroyed our academy system. Out of pure spite. (err, right .....)

- Rafa is a defensive coward, who is shit scared of attacking (...)

- Rafa doesn't want to win the League, as winning the European Cup is more relevant to his long term ambitions of managing Real Madrid/Barca/whoever

- Rafa isn't English (ok, got me on that one)

 

And on, and on.

 

End conclusion: we won't win anything this season, nor will we next, or the one after that, as long as he's in charge. You've given up on this season. Its over. We blew it.

 

Fine, we get it. Message understood. Not agreed with, understood.

 

Ok, now how about letting the rest of us, who DON'T agree with it, get on with:

- supporting our team

- supporting our manager

- riding this seasons roller-coaster to the very end, enjoying every minute of it while it lasts

 

We don't want, or need, killjoys constantly whining about the same old things we already know they are upset about. In real life, on any other issue, people wouldn't stand for the same old miserable sods coming into the room and screaming that the sky is about to fall down (unless you happen to be the chief of a tribe of unruly Gauls - Asterix fans take note). At some point, you'd be told:

 

"Fine, got it. Now, talk about something else, or just shut up".

 

I'm sick and tried of reading the same old crap. All season long. We win, after a day or so - post after post of "Rafa this, Rafa that".

 

We lose, after a minute or so - post after post of "Rafa this, Rafa that".

 

Before the team has even had the good manners to even lose a game this season, already a thread on how our manager has "lost it".

 

We win 4-0 and 4-1 v Real and ManU, and after a day or so, lo and behold, post after post of "Rafa is crap, Rafa out ".

 

Its not a case of censorship (as you're trying to portray), because the same old tired crap has been aired so often, and so fully, thats its a dried out husk by now.

 

Its time to move on. If you believe this season is already a failure, then leave the rest of us to get on and enjoy the remainder, the poor deluded fools that we are.

 

If you keep repeating the same stuff, just to provoke the same old responses, in the hope that someone will eventually say something new that will change your mind - its not happening. There's nothing left to be said. You either back the manager at this stage of the season, or you don't. Why demand to be convinced by others?

 

Its really ironic that the season after Rashid was banned from this forum for alledgedly being a repetitive bore, this entire forum is in danger of going down the toilet for the same reason.

[Guest Ulysses Everett McGill]

Tick tock

[Code]

To be honest, ISR, that is a load of bollocks you've just posted there.

 

This forum is so fans can talk about the club and all of its staff. The forum is a pretty good spread of the feelings which would mirror that throughout the fanbase.

 

Trying to say, "Don't post anything negative about Rafa" is ridiculous. I'd hazard that only 15% of the fans on this forum alone would back Rafa regardless... 25% back rafa but have reservations... 15% probably sit on the fence or aren't arsed... 25% are leery about rafa and question where the club is going under his management... and 15% are against rafa and want him out regardless of what happens and 5% don't want to stick their oar in whatever the case.

 

What gives you the right to tell, probably, a majority of the forum to stop posting about a MAJOR talking point of this club?

 

Agree with everything above.

[isr]

Didn't even read that mate. Stopped after about 2 lines.

 

I'd rather saw my cock off with a blunt rusty spoon than read any more of your posts.

 

Cheers anyway though. I'm sure the rest of the forum enjoyed it.

 

Hmm, now there's an incentive to post more, if ever there was one.

 

Prevent the spillover into the next generations gene pool.

[kopheart]

RAFA is quite simply pound for pound the best manager in the european elite. I Joined this forum not so long ago and agree Rafa makes mistakes and will make more, but have been flabberghasted by some of the baseless tripe posted about the man and his management of our football team ..... we have average players in a lot of positions yet we are competing for the title and have been the top club in the champions league averaged over the last 5 years.

 

I read a post about RAFA inheriting the best player in the world..... beg ya pardon.. SG was not the complete footballer he is now....i guess that happened by chance.

 

I think for some on this Forum it is more important to them that they send a post and have that post seen or reacted to ..than it is to actually discuss real footballing matters.. Those of U, and you know who you are, would be better served using Facebook or Friends Reunited etc than a football forum

[BatChainPuller]

Excellent post Chris. I think a lot of people had unrealistic expectations this season, and Rafa has been the scapegoat for that at times.

 

Most people, me included, required a title challenge this season but accepted we weren't quite ready to win the title. What some people maybe hadn't thought through is that getting within sniffing distance but not winning it will be deeply disappointing. I will happily throttle the next person I hear drone on about '' the Stoke/ Man City / whatever result will come back to haunt us at the end of the season ". We've made steady progress but its not going to go in a straight line - in the real world it will always be two steps forward and one step back.

 

I also think that there will never be a manager that matches some people's expectations. Clearly there's always going to be decisions that managers make that you don't agree with or don't understand. Everyone has strengths, weaknesses, and blindspots. Rafa clearly does learn - as Chris pointed out his record against the top three has been totally transformed, and that was one of the main sticks critics used to beat him with. You have to weigh Rafa's poor decisions against the good ones - the overall balance sheet is well in credit.

[SpeedyG]

Excellent post Chris. I think a lot of people had unrealistic expectations this season, and Rafa has been the scapegoat for that at times.

 

Most people, me included, required a title challenge this season but accepted we weren't quite ready to win the title. What some people maybe hadn't thought through is that getting within sniffing distance but not winning it will be deeply disappointing. I will happily throttle the next person I hear drone on about '' the Stoke/ Man City / whatever result will come back to haunt us at the end of the season ". We've made steady progress but its not going to go in a straight line - in the real world it will always be two steps forward and one step back.

 

I also think that there will never be a manager that matches some people's expectations. Clearly there's always going to be decisions that managers make that you don't agree with or don't understand. Everyone has strengths, weaknesses, and blindspots. Rafa clearly does learn - as Chris pointed out his record against the top three has been totally transformed, and that was one of the main sticks critics used to beat him with. You have to weigh Rafa's poor decisions against the good ones - the overall balance sheet is well in credit.

 

Once he's won the league title things will change.

[Deadlogic]

Well said.

 

There's hope for us yet, it seems.

[Unrighteous]

Once he's won the league title things will change.

 

It will, and it won't, really. I now that, personally, I would be over the moon with a league title and I wouldn't really have so much doubt about Rafa's ability to deliver our 'bread and butter'.

 

However, I'd still have reservations on how he did it. I'd really expect to play the kind of football that leaves the Boltons, Stokes, and Fulhams running scared when they see our name on the fixture list.

 

If we show up like we did last week, I'd be happy with the clubs direction and gladly keep my mouth shut about any concerns.

 

Unlike before this season started, when I wouldn't have really had any concerns because I kept believing that he'd sort out our problems.

[Deadlogic]

Agree with everything above.

 

Only because the post contained lots of stats.

[Deadlogic]

It will, and it won't, really. I now that, personally, I would be over the moon with a league title and I wouldn't really have so much doubt about Rafa's ability to deliver our 'bread and butter'.

 

However, I'd still have reservations on how he did it. I'd really expect to play the kind of football that leaves the Boltons, Stokes, and Fulhams running scared when they see our name on the fixture list.

 

If we show up like we did last week, I'd be happy with the clubs direction and gladly keep my mouth shut about any concerns.

 

Unlike before this season started, when I wouldn't have really had any concerns because I kept believing that he'd sort out our problems.

 

They'd be running scared because we'd be Champions, and rightly so. Chelsea under Jose for 2 seasons played in a very similar way to us (though I do believe we play better Football than they did), and teams used to hate playing them because they had that psychological edge of being "winners." It doesn't matter "how" you get that, it just matters that you get it.

 

If we won every match 1-0, then end result would be the same wouldn't it? We'd win the League, and that should be far more important than anything else. As it stands, I believe once we do win the League (this season or next...), then the confidence that brings will have it's own rewards regarding style (both in the players we have, and the players we could then attract...), but as I say - I wouldn't give a fuck either way.

[Unrighteous]

They'd be running scared because we'd be Champions, and rightly so. Chelsea under Jose for 2 seasons played in a very similar way to us (though I do believe we play better Football than they did), and teams used to hate playing them because they had that psychological edge of being "winners." It doesn't matter "how" you get that, it just matters that you get it.

 

If we won every match 1-0, then end result would be the same wouldn't it? We'd win the League, and that should be far more important than anything else. As it stands, I believe once we do win the League (this season or next...), then the confidence that brings will have it's own rewards regarding style (both in the players we have, and the players we could then attract...), but as I say - I wouldn't give a fuck either way.

 

It would, and it wouldn't. Stokes, Wigans, etc know that they can park the bus and draw, or maybe even beat us, and tend to be well up for giving one to the big boys.

 

We need to absolutely smash a club who sticks 10/11 men behind the ball something like 5 or 6 nil, and make it look like an easy day out, and erode that confidence... after that it doesn't matter if we beat the dross 1-0, 2-1, etc. because they'll reckon themselves absolutely lucky we didn't twat them. The occassional battering of the dross would balance out the odd draw.

 

Our biggest problem, and my biggest problem with Rafa's football, is that we can't convert the easy matches into points.

 

When they play against United, you can see that the game is over before it starts most of the time.