'You should have stayed at a big club'

[Xherdan]

While I dont think Gerrard fucked around like Torres there has to have been games where he wasnt completely right as he was considering a move to another club. He is human afterall.

[Trucker Paddy]

It's a bit difficult to take people seriously when they say that Torres's work rate in his last 6 months was "the last straw" or "unforgivable", given the captain of this club has frequently had entire seasons plagued with melancholy and still gets a lot of affection.

 

What? Your talking shit chief

[Il Fenomeno]

Bollocks. To include 04-05 in this, when he was the main reason by far that we won the CL ... Again: Bollocks.

 

No he wasn't, Rafa was the main reason we won, but keep on believing that it was Gerrard that signed two vital parts of our CL winning team in Alonso and Garcia, coached our defence into being awesome as an unit and made the change to bring Hamann on at half time and many other things that happened. The manager is always the main reason teams win things.

[ngogswilly]

I'd suggest we let this one die lads because we all know where it will end up going.

[silverlining]

No he wasn't, Rafa was the main reason we won, but keep on believing that it was Gerrard that signed two vital parts of our CL winning team in Alonso and Garcia, coached our defence into being awesome as an unit and made the change to bring Hamann on at half time and many other things that happened. The manager is always the main reason teams win things.

 

And is the manager also the reason teams don't win things?

[Il Fenomeno]

And is the manager also the reason teams don't win things?

 

Usually one of the reasons, yes. But again, it depends, what's been going on behind the scenes, like if an owner buys players you don't want (Shevchenko) or doesn't buy players you want.

[Scousa Tomo]

No he wasn't, Rafa was the main reason we won, but keep on believing that it was Gerrard that signed two vital parts of our CL winning team in Alonso and Garcia, coached our defence into being awesome as an unit and made the change to bring Hamann on at half time and many other things that happened. The manager is always the main reason teams win things.

 

Got to admit, it was an outstanding header by Rafa to start the comeback in Istanbul.

[Nomad]

I dislike Torres for what he did to us and the way he did it. I also do not want to see him do well at Chelsea.

 

what I would say though is it would have been nice to see our fans not give him the time of day yesterday. rather then sing about him, fuck him.

 

As soon as he left as people have said he 'made his bed' lets not give him reason to get riled to play against us. instead show him what he is missing. the fans, the atmosphere and the support he would have got if he wasnt such a prick.

[razor]

04-05, 06-07, 09-10.

 

I love Gerrard as much as the next man, and right now judge him by his service in totality - one of the all time greats.

 

But Kevin is right. He was 'plagued by melancholy' for much of those seasons.

 

He was on the verge of going to Chelsea for at least two of them. There was a strained relationship with the Kop. Some still haven't forgiven him.

 

I think the difference is, Kevin, he stayed and fought on. Torres never.

[ThewaytoRome]

I love Gerrard as much as the next man, and right now judge him by his service in totality - one of the all time greats.

 

But Kevin is right. He was 'plagued by melancholy' for much of those seasons.

 

He was on the verge of going to Chelsea for at least two of them. There was a strained relationship with the Kop. Some still haven't forgiven him.

 

I think the difference is, Kevin, he stayed and fought on. Torres never.

 

The difference is Gerrard was still our most consistent performer in all of those seasons, unlike Torres who was dogshit for most of his 'melancholy' times!!

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Back to Torres...

 

It's nearly the end of November and he has still scored more League goals for Liverpool than Chelsea in 2011.

 

This amuses me.

[jamespp]

Got to admit, it was an outstanding header by Rafa to start the comeback in Istanbul.

 

His save from Shevchenko was good aswell

[Biscao]

No he wasn't, Rafa was the main reason we won, but keep on believing that it was Gerrard that signed two vital parts of our CL winning team in Alonso and Garcia, coached our defence into being awesome as an unit and made the change to bring Hamann on at half time and many other things that happened. The manager is always the main reason teams win things.

And the screamer against Olympiakos out of nothing that actually sent us through the group stages - Benitez as well? Or the penalty against Milan? Benitez? The brilliant ball through to Garcia against chelski? Also Benitez? He was probably the best player in Europe that season and carried our team on his shoulders. But sure, it was all the "genius".

[ngogswilly]

Its fairly obvious though when it comes to that CL campaign Gerrard dug us out of a few holes along the way and carried the team.

 

I also think its fairly obvious there were games that Benitez played a blinder and set us up perfectly against superior opposition.

 

The reality is both of them deserve a huge amount of credit.

[Biscao]

Its fairly obvious though when it comes to that CL campaign Gerrard dug us out of a few holes along the way and carried the team.

 

I also think its fairly obvious there were games that Benitez played a blinder and set us up perfectly against superior opposition.

 

The reality is both of them deserve a huge amount of credit.

 

Just to be clear: I don't disagree.

[ngogswilly]

Just to be clear: I don't disagree.

 

Sorry if that gave the impression it was aimed at you. Its not.

 

Its just a feeble attempt at stopping the impending doom I can see coming in this thread.

[Guest San Don]

It's a bit difficult to take people seriously when they say that Torres's work rate in his last 6 months was "the last straw" or "unforgivable", given the captain of this club has frequently had entire seasons plagued with melancholy and still gets a lot of affection.

 

That's just pure bullshit kev lad. And you know it.

[dennis tooth]

He's also talking sense on this occasion. Torres is a considerably better player, and he'd likely form a decent partnership with Suarez. He made a big fuck up leaving, but we're missing a player of his quality and goal ability.

 

EDIT: I just want to make clear that he's a fucking cunt and can fuck the fuck off.

 

Yeah we could get Micheal Owen as well and play Suarez behind them.

 

Really tho, Torres is finished.

[PaulMcC]

Gerrard has had plenty of periods where he looked like he couldn't be bothered.

[PaulMcC]

Garcia was one of the biggest reasons we won it. Gerrard missed a few games. Garcia scored every knockout game bar the final.

 

Carra was amazing the whole tournament. Best centre back in the tournament.

[razor]

The difference is Gerrard was still our most consistent performer in all of those seasons, unlike Torres who was dogshit for most of his 'melancholy' times!!

 

Agreed.

 

I love Gerrard - he is an all-time great.

 

I think the similarity that Kevin was referring to was the wanting to leave and not looking happy.

 

This is fact. Uncomfortable though it is to acknowledge.

 

I don't want to start a big dig at Gerrard. It wouldn't be right - as I say I judge his Liverpool career in totality. However, those people who refuse to acknowledge he sulked and wanted to leave, and that he looked dis-interested at times, are ignoring facts.

 

Torres sulked and left.

Gerrard sulked, stayed and will be rightly remembered as an all-time great for many, many match-winning performances. That is not a lightly given accolade.

 

So there is an obvious difference, yes.

Edited November 21, 2011 by razor

[Sangria]

I am baffled by Torres, he was the bollocks and has went to pieces. I can still see him coming back - the old class is permanent thing - but I am starting to wonder if he will.

 

As for him leaving I thought he could have given us another six months, at least to see how things went, that was a let down and I think a rash decision on his part but he made it, it would have been nice to see him and Saurez together but at the end of the day fuck him, he made his move and it is not looking too good a year down the line.

[norwichlfc]

Personally to me he played shite for about 2 or 3 months, not showing any interest and then started playing and taking an interest when the transfer window opened.

I would say he probably thought The Scum or someone would come in for him but when The Chavs bid so high the other moves were out of the window, so he went to the money

[Major Tom]

I am baffled by Torres, he was the bollocks and has went to pieces. I can still see him coming back - the old class is permanent thing - but I am starting to wonder if he will.

 

As for him leaving I thought he could have given us another six months, at least to see how things went, that was a let down and I think a rash decision on his part but he made it, it would have been nice to see him and Saurez together but at the end of the day fuck him, he made his move and it is not looking too good a year down the line.

 

I think he did give us another 6 months. Apparently he wanted out last summer but was persuaded not to leave. But he obviously felt there was no challenge or CL football on the horizon so bailed at the next opportunity.

 

You can see flashes of the old class but he looks a shadow of the player who arrived at Liverpool. As you say; baffling.

[Captain]

There is an astounding level of bitterness on show here.