Greatest fight of all time?

[Liam]

Barrera Morales 1 was the best fight I've watched in my lifetime (im only 20). A domestic favourite would have to be Thompson Eubank 1.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Yeah, bit good calls Liam. Barrera Morales is up there in the pantheon of greatness.

[Liam]

A heavyweight classic my dad has often shown me on video is Ron Lyle v George Foreman. It was a cracking fight which only lasted 5 rounds. There were more punches in a round than the modern fat heavyweight throws in twelve!

 

[Liam]

Great, they are showing the Haye v Maccarinelli fight tomorrow lunch time on BBC. I havent seen it back on tv yet.

[Red Mist]

Hard to top Benn Vs McClellan. Absolutely brutal.

[King Emlyn]

Check out some of Julio Cesar Chavez fights mate, he was a wrecking ball in his pomp, which I reckon would have been 83-88. The fights with Rosario and Greg Haugen were worth watching. The fights between Azumah Nelson and Jeff Fenech were good fights also.

Larry Holmes vs Gerry Cooney was about as good a Heavyweight fight as you could have seen in the early 80s.

Honeyghan vs Johnny Bumphus was a decent fight, that was Honeyghan at his best.

The KO of Milton McCrory by Don Curry is still just about the best left hook I've ever seen....2nd round, for the undisputed Welterweight title. Curry could have been anything he wanted to be before he took his eye off the game and got involved in out of ring shenanigans.

Also check out Henry Armstrong from golden era fighters, you will be glad that you did. He is still in the top 3 of all time for me.

 

 

Indeed he could, "The lone star cobra" at his peak was as good as anyone that i've seen in my lifetime. You seem to know your stuff Patrick, when it comes to "all time" greats, are you aware of Jimmy Wilde?

[Liam]

I met Ezra Sellers at a boxing memorabilia fair a few years ago. I was told to watch his war with Carl Thompson. I can only find it on youtube in two parts without sound. Its well worth a watch though.

[Dr.Filth]

Benn-McLellan for me too. I watched it on youtube a few months back for the first time since that sad night. Tragic ending but it really was an unbelievable fight.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Indeed he could, "The lone star cobra" at his peak was as good as anyone that i've seen in my lifetime. You seem to know your stuff Patrick, when it comes to "all time" greats, are you aware of Jimmy Wilde?

 

Don Curry could have been the Roy Jones of the 80's King, he was an exceptionally gifted fighter and he could punch...unfortunately, after the Honeyghan fight he never got it back. He won a version of the title at 154 vs Gianfranco Rossi, but got KO'd cold by the great Mike McCallum when well on top in the fight, and that was pretty much it. Got involved in drug and guns and pissed all his talent away...such a shame, the Cobra was just about pound 4 pound the best about in 1985 time.

 

Ah...Jimmy Wilde, 'The Mighty Atom' possibly the best Flyweight the world has ever seen and better judges than me have him in the top 10 of all time. Bert Randolph Sugar rates him as one of the best he's ever seen, as does Nat Fleischer. Not bad for a little kid from a mining family in Merthyr. A little guy with a very big heart.

 

Where do you rate Billy Conn in your all time list King?

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

I met Ezra Sellers at a boxing memorabilia fair a few years ago. I was told to watch his war with Carl Thompson. I can only find it on youtube in two parts without sound. Its well worth a watch though.

 

Ezra Sellers is a great guy, a real gentleman, and man could he punch. What a fight that was with the CAT....up and down all the way through...both could punch and neither could hold a shot that well. It was pure excitement. I liked Carl Thompson, he made the most of his talent and you'd be hard pushed to find a more dedicated pro and family man than him.

[James H]

Perhaps not an all-time classic but Naseem Hamed v Kevin Kelley was a hell of a fight.

[King Emlyn]

Don Curry could have been the Roy Jones of the 80's King, he was an exceptionally gifted fighter and he could punch...unfortunately, after the Honeyghan fight he never got it back. He won a version of the title at 154 vs Gianfranco Rossi, but got KO'd cold by the great Mike McCallum when well on top in the fight, and that was pretty much it. Got involved in drug and guns and pissed all his talent away...such a shame, the Cobra was just about pound 4 pound the best about in 1985 time.

 

Ah...Jimmy Wilde, 'The Mighty Atom' possibly the best Flyweight the world has ever seen and better judges than me have him in the top 10 of all time. Bert Randolph Sugar rates him as one of the best he's ever seen, as does Nat Fleischer. Not bad for a little kid from a mining family in Merthyr. A little guy with a very big heart.

 

Where do you rate Billy Conn in your all time list King?

Difficult to say mate, my dad (a walking boxing ecyclopedia) rates Conn very highly, i don't really know a great deal about him, what i would say is that if any light-heavy (which is all he really was)could rattle the great Brown Bomber the way he did, then the man simply demands respect.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Difficult to say mate, my dad (a walking boxing ecyclopedia) rates Conn very highly, i don't really know a great deal about him, what i would say is that if any light-heavy (which is all he really was)could rattle the great Brown Bomber the way he did, then the man simply demands respect.

 

Indeed mate, I agree with that, and your Dad is spot on. Anybody who rates Billy Conn right up there knows their stuff. Billy Conn was an excellent fighter and a really smashing guy, I've seen him interviewed a few times and read plenty about him. Perhaps the best Light Heavy of all time and gave the definitely great Joe Louis one of his toughest fights. In the top 25 of all time for me.

 

Ask your old man what he thought about Harry Greb and ask him to tell you some stories about him!

[CharleyKnight]

Very good subject this and one that can never be agreed on. Older fans will talk about Ali V Frasier or Ali V Foreman. Two great fights which will live on for the rest of time. More recentley I'd have to say the Eubank Benn fights in the early 90's. This is a personal choice as I was a nipper growing up and remember watching them and being absolutely mesmarised by the sheer skill and arrogance of Eubank and ferocity and down right fucking scariness of Benn. It got me into boxing and I will always remember that feeling of watching it as a kid and being in awe of those 2 fighters. You can also take nothing away from Tyson in his early days and look at the battles he had against Hollyfield. I think, problems aside, Tyson will go down as one of the absolute greats in the heavyweight division.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Very good subject this and one that can never be agreed on. Older fans will talk about Ali V Frasier or Ali V Foreman. Two great fights which will live on for the rest of time. More recentley I'd have to say the Eubank Benn fights in the early 90's. This is a personal choice as I was a nipper growing up and remember watching them and being absolutely mesmarised by the sheer skill and arrogance of Eubank and ferocity and down right fucking scariness of Benn. It got me into boxing and I will always remember that feeling of watching it as a kid and being in awe of those 2 fighters. You can also take nothing away from Tyson in his early days and look at the battles he had against Hollyfield. I think, problems aside, Tyson will go down as one of the absolute greats in the heavyweight division.

 

The second Ali-Frazier fight was a classic Chaz and the first Benn Eubank fight ranks up there as one the best domestic dust ups ever. Benn wasn't chinny, he was just too wide open and his style was made for Eubank that night...great fight though.

 

Tyson cleaned up the division at a pretty bleak time, but you'd have to say that the Heavyweights haven't been any stronger since. You look at the people he beat and that deserves plenty of respect. Tony Tucker was a good fighter, Pinklon Thomas is no worse than much since, nor is Bonecrusher or Trevor Berbick... Michael Spinks was out of his depth...but Tyson pretty much hammered all comers before Jim Jacobs died and Bill Caytons influence was eroded by Don King and his fucking whore of a wife and her daft mother....Samson and Delilah all over again.

 

There has been some real revisionism about Tyson's achievements now he is a bum, but back in the day, he was as scary as anybody in history. When Cus D'Amato had him under his wing, Tyson had a real underrated defence and could punch with both hands...he worked off a good jab and threw hooks to the body. In later years, he just loaded up on overhand rights and was a 4 round fighter.

 

I think Holyfield had his number and would have beaten Tyson 9 times out of 10 whenever they had fought. Tyson peaked early and when at his peak didn't have enough savvy to beat Holyfield, when he did have enough savvy, he was way past his best. Tyson would still make the top 10 heayweights of all time list.

[madstock]

YouTube - Ray Robinson -vs- Randy Turpin II 1951

 

Randolph Turpin has never got the credit or recognition he deserved.

 

edit: Although my kicking of Kevin Dodds' flabby arse was far, far more entertaining.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

YouTube - Ray Robinson -vs- Randy Turpin II 1951

 

Randolph Turpin has never got the credit or recognition he deserved.

 

edit: Although my kicking of Kevin Dodds' flabby arse was far, far more entertaining.

 

Randy Turpin was a good fighter mate, he just caught an aging Ray Robinson who had moved up and down in weight. Randy couldn't keep his head together, that was his problem. He lost the rematch convincingly in New York a few months later, but there is no shame in losing to the greatest of all time.

My old man knew Randy Turpin and my Uncle sparred with him a couple of times.

[Mr Moustache]

For me its:

 

1. Hagler/Hearns

2. Morales V Barrera 1

3. Gatti V Ward 1

4. Benn V McLellan

5. Dempsey V Jess Willard

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

For me its:

 

1. Hagler/Hearns

2. Morales V Barrera 1

3. Gatti V Ward 1

4. Benn V McLellan

5. Dempsey V Jess Willard

 

Couldn't argue with any of those kidda. Dempsey's fight with Firpo was a cracker also.

[Mr Moustache]

Couldn't argue with any of those kidda. Dempsey's fight with Firpo was a cracker also.

 

Never saw any footage of that. Saw Oscar Larios in a fucking belter a couple of years ago. Duran V De Jesus 2 was a cracker. If thats the one I'm thinking were Hands of Stone won. More for the sheer animal intesnity Duran worked himself up to attimes during that fight.

 

Its only fair to mention (as Devils 'Prentice did today) Neary V Holligan as it was as good a fight as your likely to see these days in Liverpool seeing as the majority of fights these days are on the streets and usually 12 V 1.

 

I liked Hagler V Leonard myself. Marvin took that defeat so badly but Leonard boxed well and showed he had the balls to match the skills.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Never saw any footage of that. Saw Oscar Larios in a fucking belter a couple of years ago. Duran V De Jesus 2 was a cracker. If thats the one I'm thinking were Hands of Stone won. More for the sheer animal intesnity Duran worked himself up to attimes during that fight.

 

Its only fair to mention (as Devils 'Prentice did today) Neary V Holligan as it was as good a fight as your likely to see these days in Liverpool seeing as the majority of fights these days are on the streets and usually 12 V 1.

 

I liked Hagler V Leonard myself. Marvin took that defeat so badly but Leonard boxed well and showed he had the balls to match the skills.

 

Jose Luis Firpo was a huge Argentinian, was known as 'The Pampas Bull' and knocked Dempsey clean out of the ring. Jack got back in and knocked him all over the place...up and down it was...a truly great fight. I've got a still of that fight on a T Shirt.

 

Esteban De Jesus was an underrated fighter and beat Duran first time out, but Duran was just savage the night of the second fight. I think they fought 3 times in all, Duran winning 2-1. I think its fair to say that his time at Lightweight was just about the best of Duran's career, and when you consider he then won titles at Welter, Light Middle, Middle and SuperMiddle, you can see just how good he was. Probably the best Lightweight of all time.

 

The Neary Holligan fight was an entertaining fight, I was at that fight in the tent on Stanley Park car park. Neary just looked so much bigger than Andy on the night. Jamie McKeever from Birkenhead made his pro-debut that night.

 

I've always liked the Leonard-Hagler fight...I was a teenager at the time, I wanted Leonard to win. I must have seen that fight a hundred times or more now, and I could still be persuaded on all outcomes as a result. It wasn't that Sugar Ray was the clear winner, it was that he was so much better than everybody expected him to be.

 

The talk before the fight was that it was madness him taking it....that Hagler would quickly bring him to his senses. Leonard was coming off a long lay off...a second retirement in fact. He had retina trouble, had a comeback fight vs Kevin Howard when he got put on his arse for the first time in his career, eventually won in 9...retired again, and then after a break of 2 years came back to fight Hagler of all people.

 

Hagler wasn't used to losing and the loss to Leonard of all people made him give it all up. I think he could have taken defeat better if it had been anybody else...but Hagler only had himself to blame, he virtually gifted the opening 4 rounds to Ray. Leonard was always seen as a pretty boy and a White Collar fighter to Haglers blue collar image, but this was really unfair on Leonard. Just because he was an Olympic Champ and a good looking boy, people thought he had it easy. Ray Charles Leonard was from as much a deprived background as anybody else and just because he was articulate and could box didn't mean he couldn't mix it when necessary. It was a close fight and I think Leonard did just enough to win it. One of the judges had him winning 118-110 which was a different fight to the one I saw. Like I said, I think it was more a case of Leonard exceeding expectations than Hagler being ordinary, although it has to be said that Leonard knew what he was doing and caught Hagler at the right time....he was in decline and the championships were over 12 rounds instead of 15. I think had it been a 15 rounds fight, Hagler may well have caught up with him.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Ah bugger. Everybody has gone off this thread now...I was just getting into my stride and bedded in for an evening talking about Bahhhxing.

RJ, did you ever get round to buying that 'Blood Season' book by Phil Berger that I recommended to you a while back when you were asking about sports books?

[Mr Moustache]

Jose Luis Firpo was a huge Argentinian, was known as 'The Pampas Bull' and knocked Dempsey clean out of the ring. Jack got back in and knocked him all over the place...up and down it was...a truly great fight. I've got a still of that fight on a T Shirt.

 

Esteban De Jesus was an underrated fighter and beat Duran first time out, but Duran was just savage the night of the second fight. I think they fought 3 times in all, Duran winning 2-1. I think its fair to say that his time at Lightweight was just about the best of Duran's career, and when you consider he then won titles at Welter, Light Middle, Middle and SuperMiddle, you can see just how good he was. Probably the best Lightweight of all time.

 

The Neary Holligan fight was an entertaining fight, I was at that fight in the tent on Stanley Park car park. Neary just looked so much bigger than Andy on the night. Jamie McKeever from Birkenhead made his pro-debut that night.

 

I've always liked the Leonard-Hagler fight...I was a teenager at the time, I wanted Leonard to win. I must have seen that fight a hundred times or more now, and I could still be persuaded on all outcomes as a result. It wasn't that Sugar Ray was the clear winner, it was that he was so much better than everybody expected him to be.

 

The talk before the fight was that it was madness him taking it....that Hagler would quickly bring him to his senses. Leonard was coming off a long lay off...a second retirement in fact. He had retina trouble, had a comeback fight vs Kevin Howard when he got put on his arse for the first time in his career, eventually won in 9...retired again, and then after a break of 2 years came back to fight Hagler of all people.

 

Hagler wasn't used to losing and the loss to Leonard of all people made him give it all up. I think he could have taken defeat better if it had been anybody else...but Hagler only had himself to blame, he virtually gifted the opening 4 rounds to Ray. Leonard was always seen as a pretty boy and a White Collar fighter to Haglers blue collar image, but this was really unfair on Leonard. Just because he was an Olympic Champ and a good looking boy, people thought he had it easy. Ray Charles Leonard was from as much a deprived background as anybody else and just because he was articulate and could box didn't mean he couldn't mix it when necessary. It was a close fight and I think Leonard did just enough to win it. One of the judges had him winning 118-110 which was a different fight to the one I saw. Like I said, I think it was more a case of Leonard exceeding expectations than Hagler being ordinary, although it has to be said that Leonard knew what he was doing and caught Hagler at the right time....he was in decline and the championships were over 12 rounds instead of 15. I think had it been a 15 rounds fight, Hagler may well have caught up with him.

 

Great post that mate. I was very young but have since watched that fight a number of times. I love Duran. He was like an animal in the ring.

 

Have you ever read the books 'Dark Trade?' or 'War baby'. Keep meaning to buy them but just aint got round to it yet. Also fancy Micky Vanns book. Read The Shadows of Boxing. Interesting stuff and the interview with Naz at the end is a cracker.

[Liam]

Ezra Sellers is a great guy, a real gentleman, and man could he punch. What a fight that was with the CAT....up and down all the way through...both could punch and neither could hold a shot that well. It was pure excitement. I liked Carl Thompson, he made the most of his talent and you'd be hard pushed to find a more dedicated pro and family man than him.

 

I have to admit I had never heard of Ezra Sellers before I met him, but he came across really well and that fight with Thompson was really exciting. Carl Thompson was in so many exciting fights during his career. Its a shame he wasnt managed better because he should have been a household name for amount of entertainment he dished out during his career. I saw him beat Haye when he was washed up and that was a brilliant comeback he made in that fight. YouTube - David Haye v Carl Thompson

 

I cant agree with people putting Gatti Ward fights in all time great lists. Neither was a feared fighter at the time and both would have been taken apart by the best in their division at the time. In footballing terms I would compare their fights to Portsmouths high scoring victory over Reading... Lots of entertainment but enough class.

[Guest PaddyBerger15]

Great post that mate. I was very young but have since watched that fight a number of times. I love Duran. He was like an animal in the ring.

 

Have you ever read the books 'Dark Trade?' or 'War baby'. Keep meaning to buy them but just aint got round to it yet. Also fancy Micky Vanns book. Read The Shadows of Boxing. Interesting stuff and the interview with Naz at the end is a cracker.

 

Duran was an all time great mate, top 20 of all time for me and you won't go far wrong when you use him as a yardstick for judging fights and fighters.

 

War Baby is an ace book, you need to read that, thoroughly absorbing, I couldn't put it down when I first got it...you will be glad you did. Dark Trade is OK, but there are better books on the sport. 'Night Train' by Nick Tosches is a good read about the life and times of Sonny Liston. 'The release of power' is a good book about Tyson, as is the one by Peter Heller called 'Tyson'. Anything by Phil Berger...particularly Blood Season is worth reading. But you need to get War baby mate, really good book. Its by Kevin somebody, I forget his surname...Kevin Mitchell maybe?