Garry Barry

[RedinSweden]

I am far more excited about the Keane deal, not because I don't rate Barry, just because Alonso is so good.

[lifetime fan]

Well something most have changed then. Bascombe mailed me saying Rafa would have all the money generated from player sales plus another £20m on top of that from the chuckle brothers.

[Guest LFD]

Assuming we get Keane, the Barry deal falls through and Alonso stays.

 

Does anyone have a guesstimate at how much we'd have for this wide player?

 

Would we be in the Milner and Riera bracket? Or could we afford a Silva type? If it is the latter I'd be tempted to sack the Barry deal off, given how long it's taking.

[lifetime fan]

Well Bascombe is now hinting we'll have fuck all money apart from what rafa can generate through sales.

[Dirk]

Irrespective about how you feel about the Barry/Xabi issue, might be worth reflecting on what this says about our financial situation.

 

If the figure of £12 million plus add-ons for Keane that was mentioned elsewhere on the forum tonight is correct, that means we'll be pretty much at break even for ins and outs this summer. If either no-one else comes in at all, or squad players are sold to fund the purchase of a winger, we're therefore already at the point where all the club's income is going on our "overheads" and there's nothing for transfers beyond what's accumulated through sales.

 

Obviously, money's not important though...

 

That's what I have been fearing for a while. What makes it even more frightening was that the loan and its subsequent repayment was partly based on future income from an increased capacity stadium. If we don't have the extra revenue to help pay for that then we will be stuck in this cycle of using all of our money to cover overheads. If that becomes apparent we will be totally reliant on our ability to bring youngsters through and selling players for profit to compete. Otherwise we will become also-rans. It might seem dramatic but that is the stark nature of the reality we are presently facing.

[1892-LFCWasBorn]

Assuming we get Keane, the Barry deal falls through and Alonso stays.

 

Does anyone have a guesstimate at how much we'd have for this wide player?

 

Would we be in the Milner and Riera bracket? Or could we afford a Silva type? If it is the latter I'd be tempted to sack the Barry deal off, given how long it's taking.

 

My guess is that Rafa has about £15-20m on wide players.

 

I'd rather have only Silva as opposed to Riera and Milner.

[drewy]

That's what I have been fearing for a while. What makes it even more frightening was that the loan and its subsequent repayment was partly based on future income from an increased capacity stadium. If we don't have the extra revenue to help pay for that then we will be stuck in this cycle of using all of our money to cover overheads. If that becomes apparent we will be totally reliant on our ability to bring youngsters through and selling players for profit to compete. Otherwise we will become also-rans. It might seem dramatic but that is the stark nature of the reality we are presently facing.

 

Nothing dramatic as far as I can see, only the cold hard truth.

[paisley1977]

That's what I have been fearing for a while. What makes it even more frightening was that the loan and its subsequent repayment was partly based on future income from an increased capacity stadium. If we don't have the extra revenue to help pay for that then we will be stuck in this cycle of using all of our money to cover overheads. If that becomes apparent we will be totally reliant on our ability to bring youngsters through and selling players for profit to compete. Otherwise we will become also-rans. It might seem dramatic but that is the stark nature of the reality we are presently facing.

 

If all of our money,CL runs,TV revenues are going on paying our overheads then how are them two twats going to make any money out of us?

[JMARKH]

Very unfair assessment of the author of the piece that. He still gets more things right than anyone in the news about LFC.

 

I am loathe to re-start another Bascombe-NOTW-Sunday Sun shit fest so I'll leave it at that

 

I like bascombe but if what he has said is true, i would expect Rafa to resign, the americans deserve to be tortured if that is our budget after keane.

[Dirk]

If all of our money,CL runs,TV revenues are going on paying our overheads then how are them two twats going to make any money out of us?

 

We are a real estate investment. A bit like buying a fucking huge house, the value of the club will go up and up. Gillett knows all about this. Compare the value of the the Montreal Canadiens in 2006 and in 2007. They have huge debt, invest relatively little and the value of the club continues to increase because the demand from the fans is still there and the investment from corporates and television companies continues to grow. This doesn't really come back out as massive dividends but as increasing value of the real estate, which in our case is the club. Montreal went from being the 7th most valuable "franchise" in 2006 to the 4th in 2007.

 

 

Forbes evaluation of Montreal Canadiens in 2006

 

 

Team Value 1 $230 mil

 

The skinny

Hockey can be more about real estate than Stanley Cups. George Gillett, who owns the Montreal Canadiens and the Bell Centre, leveraged his building this summer when he borrowed $240 million in part to pay himself a $72 million dividend. Gillett used the Bell Centre to secure the loan. The Bell Centre cost $190 million to build and opened in 1996. The huge, unprecedented dividend guarantees Gillett a large return on the $181 million he paid for 80% of the team and 100% of the arena in 2001.

 

 

#7 Montreal Canadiens - Forbes.com

 

Forbes evaluation of Montreal Canadiens in 2007

 

Team Value 1 $283 mil

 

The skinny

Since George Gillett, who owns the Montreal Canadiens and the Bell Centre, bought the world's greatest hockey franchise and its building for $181 million six years ago, the franchise has sputtered on the ice. Last season the Canadiens failed to qualify for the playoffs for the second time during past four years. Meanwhile, Gillett has hiked the ticket prices (the average of $57 is one of the highest in the league) and seems more interested in English football (Gillett and Dallas Stars owner Tomas Hicks own the Liverpool soccer team) than ice hockey. Gillett is the team's first non-Canadian owner in its 97-year history and, if Montreal supporters have their way, its last.

 

#4 Montreal Canadiens - Forbes.com

[rebel23]

there's no profit in LFC, they're just raping us and will be forced to sell to someone sooner or later, as Dirk said they're banking on a capital increase but even in these uncertain times they might wind up with fuck all

[Red Nick]

That's what I have been fearing for a while. What makes it even more frightening was that the loan and its subsequent repayment was partly based on future income from an increased capacity stadium. If we don't have the extra revenue to help pay for that then we will be stuck in this cycle of using all of our money to cover overheads. If that becomes apparent we will be totally reliant on our ability to bring youngsters through and selling players for profit to compete. Otherwise we will become also-rans. It might seem dramatic but that is the stark nature of the reality we are presently facing.

 

Nice to see you getting with the programme

 

Not pleasant watching though.

[Filo]

Ever since Bascombe had a thinly veiled pop at Rafa with his match report in our bad run last year, I'm not convinced he's exactly in the trusted journo camp anymore.

 

Rafa lumping NOTW in the same category as the S*N shortly afterwards is a fair indication that any leaks he's getting at the moment won't be coming from Rafa anyway.

 

Precious little quality available for wide areas at decent prices at the moment anyway

[Dirk]

Nice to see you getting with the programme

 

Not pleasant watching though.

 

What are you on about, Nick? I was called a depressive and a knee jerker for having huge reservations about Gillett and Hicks from the outset. I began to thaw a bit but wasn't wholly taken in by them but they pretty much have been how I expected they might from the start. I've been one of the loudest voices against those two on this forum.

[Royal Family]

The problem with the Hicks-Gillett business plan, however, is that the club is only worth something if someone is willing to buy. Without a stadium - which is not only a no-go, but the FAILURE to build has already costs us tens of millions in fees - we're not in any way an attractive asset; and those two cowboys now cannot build a stadium, having scoured Europe and the US for money AND FAILED.

 

Look at it this way - at least we haven't had to sell Fernando this summer. In 12 months time, unless Rafa can repeat a run to the semi-finals of the CL and qualify for the 2009/10 tournament, Torres will be on his way to Chelsea or Barca. Because the two cowboys will insist on their £30m dividend each year, regardless of the consequences, for as long as they won't be able to find a buyer.

 

Thanks again DM.

[rebel23]

im pretty confident they will be gone next year come the reality of the next round of financing

[snez1]

Well, i applaud us on not paying 18m for Barry and i'd be happy if Xabi stayed.

 

But once again this shows we are nowhere near Chelsea and the Mancs in the transfer market. If Rafa keeps in touch witht hem he's doing a great job. United won the league 2 years ago and then go and buy Tevez, Anderson, Nani and Hargreaves for about 90m. Overtaking them is going to be nigh on impossble with these clowns in charge.

[rebel23]

Well, i applaud us on not paying 18m for Barry and i'd be happy if Xabi stayed.

 

But once again this shows we are nowhere near Chelsea and the Mancs in the transfer market. If Rafa keeps in touch witht hem he's doing a great job. United won the league 2 years ago and then go and buy Tevez, Anderson, Nani and Hargreaves for about 90m. Overtaking them is going to be nigh on impossble with these clowns in charge.

 

they won fuck all 2 years ago and bought only Carrick for £18m and won the league

[Red Nick]

What are you on about, Nick? I was called a depressive and a knee jerker for having huge reservations about Gillett and Hicks from the outset. I began to thaw a bit but wasn't wholly taken in by them but they pretty much have been how I expected they might from the start. I've been one of the loudest voices against those two on this forum.

 

And long may it continue

 

This forum is just like last summer when the Count got load of stick for telling the truth as the summer unfolded it became clear that they were Dicks and our net spend proved which way the club was going and what classless twats they were.

 

Now some people who have had there head in the sands are beginning to realise there are bigger problems than Rafa's transfer Kitty

[snez1]

they won fuck all 2 years ago and bought only Carrick for £18m and won the league

 

After having previously spent big money on lots of players and having a far better squad than us.

 

How many players have they bought for over 15m? Rooeny, Ferdinand, Carrick, Hargreaves, Nani, Anderson, Tevez, Horse and thats just off the top of my head.

 

We've bought Torres for over 15m and now maybe Keane. Considering when Rafa took over we we're miles behind them that puts it into perspective in my eyes. Rafa's spnt a lot of money but basically had to rebuild a club in ruin. He had a shit squad, no good youth players and has had to spread his transfer money out every summer instead of going for his top targets for mega money with the exception of Torres last summer (who was still under 20m).

Edited July 27, 2008 by snez1

[Royal Family]

im pretty confident they will be gone next year come the reality of the next round of financing

 

 

But to whom? Talk in the City is that DIC are no longer interested AND in any case don't have the same money for 'trophy investments' that they did 6-12 months ago.

 

If the refinancing fails (which i don't think is likely btw) we're in the hands of the banks. Which means a firesale of assets FIRST and finding new owners SECOND. Be very careful what you wish for.

 

Torres, Masch et al won't be here for the start of the 2009/10 season if we finish outside the top 4 this year - or indeed if we fail to get past the group stages of the CL.

[lifetime fan]

Ever since Bascombe had a thinly veiled pop at Rafa with his match report in our bad run last year, I'm not convinced he's exactly in the trusted journo camp anymore.

 

Rafa lumping NOTW in the same category as the S*N shortly afterwards is a fair indication that any leaks he's getting at the moment won't be coming from Rafa anyway.

 

Precious little quality available for wide areas at decent prices at the moment anyway

 

I think it's fair to say Bascombe and Rafa have had a fairly large argument/disagreement and are no longer on speaking terms.

[rebel23]

But to whom? Talk in the City is that DIC are no longer interested AND in any case don't have the same money for 'trophy investments' that they did 6-12 months ago.

 

If the refinancing fails (which i don't think is likely btw) we're in the hands of the banks. Which means a firesale of assets FIRST and finding new owners SECOND. Be very careful what you wish for.

 

Torres, Masch et al won't be here for the start of the 2009/10 season if we finish outside the top 4 this year - or indeed if we fail to get past the group stages of the CL.

 

i dont think we will be in the hands of banks, there will be a new owner, we'll see.

 

we will easily meet the sporting objectives in the short term

[Unrighteous]

There is no short term profit in LFC but there is massive gains to be had long term.

 

Unfortunately, these two skint cunts don't have the vision or the funds to make that happen.

 

Hopefully, DIC(or some other cash rich corporation/person) will come in and save the day.

[Red Nick]

Please name me someone who has got 400m to spend buying LFC and then putting another 400m cash or debt into the project

 

If DIC dont buy us the only option is Abromovic's mate and thats it