PODCAST: Liverpool 2 Real Madrid 5 - Match Reaction

[tlw content]

A massively chastening experience for the Reds as a dream start quickly turned into a complete nightmare. 2-0 up and flying, but then goal after goal went in at the other end and the last chance of a trophy this season went up in smoke.

 

Chris Smith was joined shortly after the final whistle by Stu Montagu and TLW Editor Dave Usher to look back on one of the more humbling nights in Liverpool's long and illustrious European history.

 

 

View full article

[3 Stacks]

I generally agreed the most with Stu, except for the Gomez part. He was awful.

 

The Real Madrid thing in Europe is just a mixture of experience and composure. They've seen it all and pretty much never have a reason to doubt themselves. A team like ours that have been awful in giving the ball away and defending transitions were always going to be seriously up against it versus a team like that.

 

The discussion about Klopp's style and giving the ball away was the most interesting thing. We have very dynamic but technically erratic players that are encouraged to be daring with the ball. When we're crap like we are now, there's a huge amount of technical mistakes and then we can't recover the ball and leave spaces everywhere. Midtable players eat those up, never mind geniuses like Modric, Vini and Benzema. 

 

It was basically the perfect storm and they didn't even have to try that hard or commit too many players forward. We were huffing and puffing and even ended up with a higher xG, whilst they just sat back and took maximum advantage of mistakes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Red Shift]

We were well beaten by a combination of mistakes, lethal Madrid finishing & erratic mentality coupled with an ageing cadre of experienced players resting on their laurels not being able to rally or respond.

 

There was some great first half football on display, but no way are our prime players able to sustain any intensity over 90 minutes anymore. We are rebuilding and we need to complete it asap. Bring on the war chest this Summer and lets cut the wheat from the chaff.

[Red Shift]

Oh yeah, almost forgot…I wholeheartedly agree about the Nunez shove. Penalty for me, and no, not making excuses, but if given and converted, at 3-3, the game would have had a different complexion.

[Razoray]

As well as the errors for the goals, when Joe Gomez plays, we just look a lot looser. It does not seem as organised and has less of a presence. 

 

[johnsusername]

Can't agree that Fabinho was the best player on the pitch. He's our defensive midfielder and we got battered! 

[No2]

Stu should be on more, speaks a lot of sense. I'm with him on Gomez, the foul for the third goal and the pass to Ali are both things he needed to do, in the overall analysis of both goals his part is irrelevant. The 2nd goal is million percent on Alisson and third has to be on Virgil or Ali, they are the leaders and therefore organisers, those 6 statues where there because one of those 2 put them there.

[Chris]

For me, the sample size is humongous with Gomez now. Why are we even still having to debate him?
 

We’re supposed to be a top class organisation. We shouldn’t be debating whether a player is good enough for three years. If the debate is this lengthy following  mistake after mistake after mistake, it probably means he isn’t good enough.
 

Move the fuck on. 
 

 

[KMD7]

9 hours ago, 3 Stacks said:

I generally agreed the most with Stu, except for the Gomez part. He was awful.

 

The Real Madrid thing in Europe is just a mixture of experience and composure. They've seen it all and pretty much never have a reason to doubt themselves. A team like ours that have been awful in giving the ball away and defending transitions were always going to be seriously up against it versus a team like that.

 

The discussion about Klopp's style and giving the ball away was the most interesting thing. We have very dynamic but technically erratic players that are encouraged to be daring with the ball. When we're crap like we are now, there's a huge amount of technical mistakes and then we can't recover the ball and leave spaces everywhere. Midtable players eat those up, never mind geniuses like Modric, Vini and Benzema. 

 

It was basically the perfect storm and they didn't even have to try that hard or commit too many players forward. We were huffing and puffing and even ended up with a higher xG, whilst they just sat back and took maximum advantage of mistakes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Great post but fucking Vini? NEGGED

[johnsusername]

1 hour ago, Chris said:

For me, the sample size is humongous with Gomez now. Why are we even still having to debate him?
 

We’re supposed to be a top class organisation. We shouldn’t be debating whether a player is good enough for three years. If the debate is this lengthy following  mistake after mistake after mistake, it probably means he isn’t good enough.
 

Move the fuck on. 
 

 

 

The club has been asleep at the wheel for a couple of years. 

 

This season has been traumatic. The players look shell shocked. 

[dave u]

1 hour ago, Chris said:

For me, the sample size is humongous with Gomez now. Why are we even still having to debate him?
 

We’re supposed to be a top class organisation. We shouldn’t be debating whether a player is good enough for three years. If the debate is this lengthy following  mistake after mistake after mistake, it probably means he isn’t good enough.
 

Move the fuck on. 

 

More often than not these players who have the question hanging over them don't come good. Hendo did, most don't.

 

Keita and Ox are good examples and Curtis is another, although he still has (some) time on his side.

 

I think Gomez will be kept around because of the English quota. We're in a bit of bother with that and losing Ox and Phillips puts us in even more of a spot. 

 

Matip will be sold before Gomez I think.

[Chris]

6 minutes ago, dave u said:

 

More often than not these players who have the question hanging over them don't come good. Hendo did, most don't.

 

Keita and Ox are good examples and Curtis is another, although he still has (some) time on his side.

 

I think Gomez will be kept around because of the English quota. We're in a bit of bother with that and losing Ox and Phillips puts us in even more of a spot. 

 

Matip will be sold before Gomez I think.

 

With Gomez last night we talked about which were directly his fault and which weren't. It's kinda beside the point, in some ways. The glaring errors are obvious enough, but you just want him to do better in all of those situations. All five of them.

 

Even the first goal – as great a finish as it was – I think he can get a little tighter and stop the shot from getting away. They're not necessarily all big errors, they're situations where he should have done more. 

 

I think it's called defending. 

[Razoray]

3 minutes ago, Chris said:

 

With Gomez last night we talked about which were directly his fault and which weren't. It's kinda beside the point, in some ways. The glaring errors are obvious enough, but you just want him to do better in all of those situations. All five of them.

 

Even the first goal – as great a finish as it was – I think he can get a little tighter and stop the shot from getting away. They're not necessarily all big errors, they're situations where he should have done more. 

 

I think it's called defending. 

Agree 100%. None of the goals are totally his fault but if he was a better defender then a few of them don't happen. That is the difference between a top centre back and an average one. His pace and athleticism means he is a better fit to Klopp's system than most but he just isn't good enough. 

[Section_31]

Never knew Monty was from Burnley or Bury or one of those other B places. That's fucked up.

 

 

[NoelM]

I think the biggest problem is that none of our centre-backs apart from Konate actually want to do the dirty work of defending.

That's why Virgil and Konate are the perfect partnership. Gomez and Matip are not aggressive, "body-on-the-line" defenders like Konate - they don't enjoy it, he does.

[Crazy Dave]

I'm less arsed about Gomez than some. He is what he is, a 4th choice centre back who can do a job as a right back occasionally. He should be doing better, admittedly, but he's not a big problem in the grand scheme of things. 

 

I'm much more concerned about Virgil. I was hoping he'd become our version of Thiago Silva, just in terms of still playing to a very high standard in his mid to late 30's, but the way he's played we should be having a serious discussion about whether he's worth his place in the starting eleven next season or not.

 

Konate, for me, is our first choice centre back now and if we can find somebody else like him then Virgil might become 3rd choice sooner than many of us anticipated he would. 

[JohnnyH]

Really enjoyed Stu’s comments on the pod. Found myself nodding along with pretty much everything he said. Especially on the Allison goal.  It’s 100% on the keeper. It’s absurd to give even 1% blame to Gomez. 
 

The day after I don’t feel anywhere near as bad. Play like we did in the 1st half and we’ll get 4th with games to spare. Even in that second half against most of the teams in the league we’d do enough to win assuming our strikers will start putting a few shots away. 

[dave u]

Still say Gomez shouldn't pass it back to him in that situation (and its also not a great pass as he kicks it into the ground and it bobbles up). That said, there's no excusing what Alisson then does so I'll revise my 70/30 blame apportioning and say its 99/1 just to annoy Johnny.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

I said to our kid in the pub at the time Gomez shouldn’t have played it back, but just put it out in Row Z of the King Kenny stand. 
 

That said Allison has no right to be trying to pass it back to him. 

I’m in full agreement of Dave’s revised assessment and reasons. 

 

[Skidfingers McGonical]

1 hour ago, Section_31 said:

Never knew Monty was from Burnley or Bury or one of those other B places. That's fucked up.

 

 

I knew he was a wool, thought everyone did. 
 

[stringvest]

1 hour ago, Section_31 said:

Never knew Monty was from Burnley or Bury or one of those other B places. That's fucked up.

 

 

he's defo from the wrong side of the tracks

[JohnnyH]

2 hours ago, dave u said:

Still say Gomez shouldn't pass it back to him in that situation (and its also not a great pass as he kicks it into the ground and it bobbles up). That said, there's no excusing what Alisson then does so I'll revise my 70/30 blame apportioning and say its 99/1 just to annoy Johnny.

I kinda walked into that.  Just like Allison 

[TheBitch]

3 hours ago, Section_31 said:

Never knew Monty was from Burnley or Bury or one of those other B places. That's fucked up.

 

 

He’s behind enemy lines. That’s all we need to know. 

[Section_31]

Monty ordering a round at half time.