Hillsborough files release on 5 live now

[Anubis]

Will the BBC take on board the comments about Mackenzie.

[Einch]

Will the BBC take on board the comments about Mackenzie.

 

We wish but the BBC are fucking shameless and spineless in equally epic proportions.

[drewy]

Hard to put into words, I feel we could be making progress to finally getting justice.

[gingerhulk]

Been in tears tonight watching the debate. Steve rotheram and andy burnham have been brilliant in this battle for justice. Feel we are one step closer to justice tonight, still long way to go but I believe we are getting there. JFT96

[Coro]

Will the BBC take on board the comments about Mackenzie.

 

Reading this

John Prescott

I find if remarkable the BBC News at 10 hasn't given the #HillsboroughDebate the prominence it deserves today. Very poor

 

You have to doubt they will.

[zigackly]

I think the BBC have made it painfully clear in recent years that they don't give a flying fuck about people's justified outrage at their using MacKenzie to "add spice" to their broadcasts.

[the walsh]

didnt watch but hope it,s a big step to get justice for the 96 people that lost there lives.it,s very much long overdue.

[shaunstrudwick]

here here

[mouse1989]

Just listened to the speeches by Steve Rotheram and Andy Burnham, powerful speeches.

[razor]

No doubt like many on here I never talk about Hillsborough (just typing the word now feels wrong).

 

I have my own experiences and feelings to work through and my reaction to watching Steve Rotheram shows I still have a way to go.

 

Just a few things he said which stood out. I didn't know that the kick off of 'a match' was delayed the previous season. Does anyone know which match he is referring to? The FA Cup semi or another game? I don't suppose it matters that much, as clearly it HAD been done before, which I was unaware of. It is one of the points that is important to me as it is one of the excuses I thought I could legitimately give to them - that nobody would think of it because it hadn't been done before.

 

The second point was when he spoke about the entrance to the ground. The police (not stewards) were stationed just inside so they could search each fan. I had been frisked many times at away games, but this was a full search that took ages. Again I don't know if this had any bearing at all on things, but it is just another point I always think about.

 

The final point was the tunnel opposite you as you came in. There was only one way to go and there were no stewards that I recall directing anyone round the sides.

 

I don't know why I'm typing this.

 

I just hope that this time, THIS TIME, things are done right and we get the truth. I have hope but not as much faith.

[Randy Marsh]

Brilliant that, no other word for it. Powerful, moving, emotional, many people have a lot to be proud of tonight. Rotheram, Burnham, and McGovern especially spoke with so much passion and sincerity, as did everyone else who contributed. Proud to be a red tonight, finally a glimmer of light at the end of the longest of tunnels. JFT96

[lifetime fan]

That's why I tagged it mate. The same photo has been on the Echo's website all week and like hundreds more' date=' is readily available with a simple google search.

 

As someone in the thread has said, 'if ever there was a photo to sum up what happened that day, that photo was it'.[/quote']

 

I thought I'd pretty much seen all the photos of Hillsborough over the years.

 

And then...It wasn't the bodies that hit me but the sheer number of police stood with their backs to the dead and dying like they couldn't give a shit.

 

That is probably the most harrowing image I've ever seen of the disaster.

[Dougie Do'ins]

No doubt like many on here I never talk about Hillsborough (just typing the word now feels wrong).

 

I have my own experiences and feelings to work through and my reaction to watching Steve Rotheram shows I still have a way to go.

 

Just a few things he said which stood out. I didn't know that the kick off of 'a match' was delayed the previous season. Does anyone know which match he is referring to? The FA Cup semi or another game? I don't suppose it matters that much, as clearly it HAD been done before, which I was unaware of. It is one of the points that is important to me as it is one of the excuses I thought I could legitimately give to them - that nobody would think of it because it hadn't been done before.

 

The second point was when he spoke about the entrance to the ground. The police (not stewards) were stationed just inside so they could search each fan. I had been frisked many times at away games, but this was a full search that took ages. Again I don't know if this had any bearing at all on things, but it is just another point I always think about.

 

The final point was the tunnel opposite you as you came in. There was only one way to go and there were no stewards that I recall directing anyone round the sides.

 

I don't know why I'm typing this.

 

I just hope that this time, THIS TIME, things are done right and we get the truth. I have hope but not as much faith.

It matters very much. Hillsborough had a bit of a history for crowd issues at big games. I think there was one involving Spurs where spectators were sat around the perimeter of the touchline.

 

The previous seasons semi against Forrest was also noted for over crowding in the Leppings Lane end. As anyone who was there the previous season will know, the police organization was much better that day. However it was concerning enough for Peter Robinson (i think) to plead with the FA that Liverpool were given the Kop end of Hillsborough for the 89 semi. Unfortunately his pleas fell on deaf ears.

 

I think it's important to remember that the FA played a Major part in what happened that day, yet for some reason they seem to be slipping below the radar of blame, and it's an issue which IMO needs to be addressed.

[robslappa]

There was an incident in 1981 involving Wolves and Spurs which was similar to what happened in 1989. I think Spurs had the Leppings Lane that year.

 

One of the MP's who spoke last night referred to a delayed kick off two years previous, which was the game between Leeds and Coventry.

[robslappa]

It matters very much. Hillsborough had a bit of a history for crowd issues at big games. I think there was one involving Spurs where spectators were sat around the perimeter of the touchline.

 

The previous seasons semi against Forrest was also noted for over crowding in the Leppings Lane end. As anyone who was there the previous season will know' date=' the police organization was much better that day. However it was concerning enough for Peter Robinson (i think) to plead with the FA that Liverpool were given the Kop end of Hillsborough for the 89 semi. Unfortunately his pleas fell on deaf ears.

 

[b']I think it's important to remember that the FA played a Major part in what happened that day[/b], yet for some reason they seem to be slipping below the radar of blame, and it's an issue which IMO needs to be addressed.

 

Couldn't agree more Mick. It was their event, they chose an unsafe venue and their decision to give Forest the Kop end for the second successive year was unbelievable, even after Liverpool asked them not to.

[lifetime fan]

Couldn't agree more Mick. It was their event, they chose an unsafe venue and their decision to give Forest the Kop end for the second successive year was unbelievable, even after Liverpool asked them not to.

 

Am I the only one so cynical to believe the FA were capable of refusing our request simply to show it was they who were in charge?

[xerxes]

I think it's important to remember that the FA played a major part in what happened that day' date=' yet for some reason they seem to be slipping below the radar of blame, and it's an issue which IMO needs to be addressed.[/quote']

 

I agree.

 

A balanced inquiry now I suspect will shed light on many who have sought the shadows for too long.

 

Much of the focus is on the Police that day.There was one pivotal judgement of Solomon.Delay opening the gate until the two central pens could be closed off risking death and injury outside, or act immediately risking death and injury inside.

 

Those responsbile for a "Slum sport in slum grounds" had been asleep at the wheel for 20 years.

[Paco]

Hopefully this is the beginning of the end in the search for justice.

[Barnesey]

I think it's important to remember that the FA played a Major part in what happened that day' date=' yet for some reason they seem to be slipping below the radar of blame, and it's an issue which IMO needs to be addressed.[/quote']

 

I believe I am right in saying 3 people received suspended jail sentences for their part in the Heysel disaster. Think one was either UEFA or Belgian FA, maybe both

[JER]

Was just featured on the Jeremy Vine show - the only 2 callers that got through was a Liverpool fan who said that he pushed his way in, and an elderly bigot who ran out the usual drunken yobs bile. Shocking stuff.

[Total Longo]

"...And now the cynical ones say that it all ends the same in the long run

Try telling that to the desperate father who just squeezed the life from his only son

And how it's only voices in your head and dreams you never dreamt

Try telling him the subtle difference between justice and contempt

Try telling me she isn't angry with this pitiful discontent

When they flaunt it in your face as you line up for punishment

And then expect you to say thank you straighten up, look proud and pleased

Because youve only got the symptoms, you haven't got the whole disease

Just like a schoolboy, whose heads like a tin-can

Filled up with dreams then poured down the drain

Try telling that to the boys on both sides, being blown to bits or beaten and maimed

Who takes all the glory and none of the shame.

Well I hope you live long now, I pray the lord your soul to keep

I think I'll be going before we fold our arms and start to weep

I never thought for a moment that human life could be so cheap

Cos when they finally put you in the ground

They'll stand there laughing and tramp the dirt down"

 

Fuck you, Thatcher.

[Cliff T. Beast]

Didn't see it myself but i've read the speeches on the Echo site. My mum was me telling about it at lunch, told me that my dad was in tears watching it. Only ever seen my Dad cry once. April 16th 1989 stood outside Anfield.

[xerxes]

I believe I am right in saying 3 people received suspended jail sentences for their part in the Heysel disaster. Think one was either UEFA or Belgian FA, maybe both

 

There were 27 arrests on suspicion of manslaughter – the only extraditable offence applicable to events at Heysel. Sixty percent of these people were from Merseyside. Some of these people had previous convictions for football-related violence. In 1989, after a 5-month trial in Belgium, fourteen English fans were given 3-year sentences for involuntary manslaughter. Half the terms were suspended and it is unclear how many served their sentences.

 

 

 

No official enquiry was ever held – nor did Liverpool FC, Juventus FC, the Belgian Government, the British Government the FA or UEFA. For reasons not dissimilar to Hillsborough, it was in too many people’s interests not to bother. A Belgian judges investigation,(carrying little formal weight) criticised the Police’s handling of the day, UEFA’s decision to hold the final at that ground, ticketing procedures, the Belgian FA and several local officials – sound familiar? Everyone just wanted “it” to go away, but it didn’t.

 

If a full enquiry had been held into Heysel, there is every likelihood that the lessons which would have been learned could have resulted in changes that could have prevented Hillsborough.

 

The Hillsborough paradox is that it was a crowd management disaster defined by hooligamism.