Chemical Weapons

[Ranxerox]

It's meaningless because it's non-binding.

 

 

 

 

Ha nice play with words, or maybe you don't understand how the US system works.

 

Saying its meaningless is like saying a loaded gun pointed at your head is meaningless because so far no one has pulled the trigger.

 

The only way the resolution will pass is if that language is in there otherwise McCain is out. It is meaningful. If the US goes ahead with strikes it will be with the intention of fostering regime change. What most of us who opposed it predicted from the start.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Tony Blinken: Not Obama's 'Intention' To Attack Syria If Congress Votes Against It

 

Not that you'll read it or anything.

 

No, I read it. Better than you, by the sound of it. Did you even bother to listen to the video? More utter bollocks from you. Lies, actually. Coupled with ignorance, backed up with sarcasm and arrogance. That's you.

 

'Obama has already stated', you said. Then you post a link to something Blinken said. Fucking hell. You think you're in a position to judge me and you come out with that nonsense? Got fuck yourself.

 

Did you even watch the video, because they say clearly in it that Obama didn't say it and said exactly what I posted to you. Try again. This time, read your own source. I've been patient with the obtuse bollocks in this thread so far, choosing not to pick up on every little piece of idiocy. I'm done with that.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Ha nice play with words, or maybe you don't understand how the US system works.

 

Maybe that's it.

[Ranxerox]

 

I don't feel the need to prove myself to you, thanks all the same. Try sharing an opinion rather than posting links to other people's. If I wanted to talk to Brzezinski, I'd just that.

 

Because you have none.

 

When someone share an opinion you ask for facts

 

When someone provides facts you ask for opinion

 

Ha you're priceless and have a massive ego.

 

My opinion from the get go was no, I don't trust the US. By offering up experts (who do you cite????? John Kerry???) who know what they're talking about I demonstrate why I feel vindicated in my opinion.

 

If I feel sick I go to the Doctor, you know the learned expert. If I'm being sued I hire a lawyer. Doesn't make me any less worthwhile to consult an expert. You know humility is actually an admired quality, you should try it out sometime.

 

All you've offered throughout this thread is your own arrogant opinion. You've offered no facts, cited no experts, bullied, name called, belittled, threatened, cajoled, insulted etc.

 

You've pretended you have knowledge and expertise when you obviously have none. Or at least nothing in comparison to someone Like Zarkaria, Pollack, or Zbignew just to name a few.

[Ranxerox]

No, I read it. Better than you, by the sound of it. Did you even bother to listen to the video? More utter bollocks from you. Lies, actually. Coupled with ignorance, backed up with sarcasm and arrogance. That's you.

 

'Obama has already stated', you said. Then you post a link to something Blinken said. Fucking hell. You think you're in a position to judge me and you come out with that nonsense? Got fuck yourself.

 

Did you even watch the video, because they say clearly in it that Obama didn't say it and said exactly what I posted to you. Try again. This time, read your own source. I've been patient with the obtuse bollocks in this thread so far, choosing not to pick up on every little piece of idiocy. I'm done with that.

 

Administration Officials don't go on record without the President's say so you buffoon, again you show no understanding of US politics.

 

It's all falling apart for you now isn't it?

[Ranxerox]

More on why Obama will not act without Congressional approval

 

 

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/06/world/europe/obama-arrives-in-russia-for-g20-summit.html?hp&_r=2&

 

This is good news for those who have opposed this all along, as its likely at this point the resolution will be defeated or not even come to a vote in the house.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

You're very silly. Logical fallacies and appeals to authority aside, you're just very silly. I'd get worked up if it wasn't just so silly. Humility, you say? Yet you want me to list credentials? Again, I politely request you go fuck yourself.

 

As I said, I've been incredibly patient in this thread (or, as you call it, 'bullying') , but I'll not stand by and be talked down to by somebody who doesn't even know what mission creep is, yet wants to throw it in my face. Continue posting links which say one thing and pretending - telling lies, actually - they say another thing. Pseudo-intellectuals are pretty easy to spot, especially when they've no idea what the terminology they're using actually means. Then there's the links by others. A sure fire sign that you've not got the first clue. Have a look what Dennis Tooth does. Link. Link. Link. You're no different, just a little more arrogant.

 

It's all falling apart for you now isn't it?

 

No. Glad I could clear that one up for you, at the very least.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Numero Veinticinco

[Ranxerox]

You're very silly. Logical fallacies and appeals to authority aside, you're just very silly. I'd get worked up if it wasn't just so silly. Humility, you say? Yet you want me to list credentials? Again, I politely request you go fuck yourself.

 

As I said, I've been incredibly patient in this thread (or, as you call it, 'bullying') , but I'll not stand by and be talked down to by somebody who doesn't even know what mission creep is, yet wants to throw it in my face.

 

 

 

No. Glad I could clear that one up for you, at the very least.

 

You're pathetic really, you can dish it out but you truly cannot take it.

You are a bully as has been mentioned by others, pointed out time and again, in thread after thread you always make it personal with those who disagree with you. I gave you what you wanted when you asked for more than opinions and you didn't like it one bit. Like all bullies you're a coward too.

 

I used to be intimated by you but now I only feel sorry for you.

[Ranxerox]

Perhaps a better solution.

 

The Syria Policy We Can And Should All Get Behind - Forbes

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

What on earth are you babbling on about. Coward? Bully? Pathetic? Pity? Me and my name calling! Meh, water off a duck's back. Why won't you just respond to what I've actually written. It's a sure-fire sign that you're an empty vessel, all this nonsense. I've spent ages in this thread replying, patiently until the last page, to point after point after point. Any question asked on the subject, I'm more than happy to reply to it.

 

Far from not being able to 'handle it', I'm actively asking you to reply to what I've written. You can call that cowardice if you like, it doesn't really bother me. I just want an cogent answer. I want you to back up your guff.

 

I wouldn't mind that you've no idea what mission creep is if only you hadn't thrown it at me in some way to show my ignorance. I've taught lots of cocky young men who think they know more than they do, parroting terminology they don't understand or they've picked up from a blog or Huffpo, and it's fine, it's the internet, you can do that. But don't pretend you've any clue what my credentials are or that you're fit to judge what I do or don't know.

 

Before shouting your mouth off, look a bit closer at your own links. Maybe form a coherent opinion, then use articles, facts, blogs to back it up. Rather than just throwing loads of links out which don't even say what you think they do.

 

Now, back to the pity. Or, maybe, the point? I think half the issue is, despite my repeating it many times, I don't think you actually understand my point. It has very little to do with the Americans at all. Anyway, tee up another blog link. It'll save you from actually having to do any thinking of your own. Whilst you're doing that, I'll tee-up another John Kerry quote, just like I've been doing all thread.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Numero Veinticinco

[Red Phoenix]

it's difficulty to see how Assad can remain in power and be re-accepted into the international community after gassing his own citizens.

 

There's no proof that he's done that though. The governments of the US, UK and France don't have the ability to present proof to anybody. We know people have been attacked, but we don't know which side did it. And we're supposed to believe that Assad would launch a chemical weapon attack on civilians during a fight he was already doing well in, on the same day that the UN team arrived in Syria, as if that was going to somehow help him.

 

And the people telling us that he did are in positions of power in countries that have a history of waging wars all over the place because they're obsessed with power, control, and causing chaos and death in the middle-east for almost all of the last century.

[piscinin]

Obama could do with sending a stray cruise or two over this way. It's only headcount after all.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

There's no proof that he's done that though. The governments of the US, UK and France don't have the ability to present proof to anybody. We know people have been attacked, but we don't know which side did it. And we're supposed to believe that Assad would launch a chemical weapon attack on civilians during a fight he was already doing well in, on the same day that the UN team arrived in Syria, as if that was going to somehow help him.

 

And the people telling us that he did are in positions of power in countries that have a history of waging wars all over the place because they're obsessed with power, control, and causing chaos and death in the middle-east for almost all of the last century.

 

Would you accept that there's a possibility that the Assad regime did use Chemical Weapons against civilians? Not fact, not proof, but the possibility that the regime which has killed, according to unbiased reputable sources, many people recently, might just have done it. Maybe?

 

Administration Officials don't go on record without the President's say so you buffoon

 

Sorry, Scott, I just can't let this one go so easily. First you said that 'Obama has already stated he won't go without Congressional approval'. You expected me to take that as fact. I didn't, which I think is fair considering it never happened. So, I ask for a link. You provide one, alongside sarcastic comment. Thanks. Woah, what's that! It's not Obama saying he won't go. The shock! It's not Obama, it's Tony Blinken. Fine, he's only been in the job five minutes but he's fairly senior. The issue is that he doesn't say they 'won't go without approval' either. He says it's not his intention to go without Congressional support. Of course it's not his intention, his intention is to go with approval.

 

That's how politics works, Scott. Even first year under-grad students know that. Yet you want to call me a buffoon and say I'm the one who doesn't understand US politics? Fucking hell, if I don't understand US politics, I'm in some big trouble. If you think I'm going to side by, quiet as a mouse, whilst you take chunks out of me, you're mistaken. I'm not even saying Obama would definitely go without approval, although having listened to him skirt around it and totally fail to rule it out, even indicating options where he would likely have used military force without Congressional approval. I'm saying that if you're going to state something as fact, then call me a buffoon, expect to get picked up on it. 'cause it won't play.

[Strontium]

There's no proof that he's done that though.

 

 

Keep telling yourself that if it makes it easier.

 

I suppose the other hundred thousand or so dead were all killed by the rebels too.

[zigackly]

I think it's quite likely that he did and quite possible that he didn't. I wouldn't trust the UK or US governments to be telling the truth about it though, based on their past records.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

I think it's quite likely that he did and quite possible that he didn't. I wouldn't trust the UK or US governments to be telling the truth about it though, based on their past records.

 

In my opinion, that's a perfectly fair position to take. Actually, it's the sensible position to take.

[Red Phoenix]

Keep telling yourself that if it makes it easier.

 

I suppose the other hundred thousand or so dead were all killed by the rebels too.

 

It doesn't really make anything easier, it's just a fact, there's no proof that it was the Syrian Army that made the attack. And no I don't think the rebels killed the other 100,000, but I'd guess they've killed most of them with their retarded bombs and rockets fired in civilian areas, and lack of respect for huge parts of the population, the Alawites being one part of that.

 

But yes, I understand that the Syrian Army has probably caused a fair amount of civilian death too, that's why fighting like this is completely retarded from the off.

 

 

Would you accept that there's a possibility that the Assad regime did use Chemical Weapons against civilians? Not fact, not proof, but the possibility that the regime which has killed, according to unbiased reputable sources, many people recently, might just have done it. Maybe?

 

I accept that it's possible, that's why I've tried to be increasingly careful with my wording of things. I know that I don't know what's actually happened, all I can do is look at history and try to say what I think. It doesn't mean I'm having doubts, just that I don't think it's possible for anything I say to be taken seriously at all if I'm stating things like I know them when I clearly don't.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Red Phoenix

[Barney_Rubble]

There's no proof that he's done that though. The governments of the US, UK and France don't have the ability to present proof to anybody. We know people have been attacked, but we don't know which side did it. And we're supposed to believe that Assad would launch a chemical weapon attack on civilians during a fight he was already doing well in, on the same day that the UN team arrived in Syria, as if that was going to somehow help him.

 

And the people telling us that he did are in positions of power in countries that have a history of waging wars all over the place because they're obsessed with power, control, and causing chaos and death in the middle-east for almost all of the last century.

Amen!

 

Keep telling yourself that if it makes it easier.

 

I suppose the other hundred thousand or so dead were all killed by the rebels too.

You'd say that wouldn't you, you tory-arse-kissing, Clegg-loving cuntbucket.

[Strontium]

You'd say that wouldn't you, you tory-arse-kissing, Clegg-loving cuntbucket.

 

 

Go drink some drain cleaner. Twunt.

[Kevin D]

I wonder if Obama will go ahead anyway, what with it looking like it's going to fail to get congressional approval. Judging by his reluctance to say he wouldn't, I suspect he will.

 

I was surprised he took it to Congress in the first place. His administration have a very radical interpretation of Executive powers, which doesn't include asking Congress for permission for things you can do anyway.

 

As an aside, while nobody knows anything and we're speculating, I have been wondering if this has anything to do with Snowden. The Government were shamed in front of the world and then rendered impotent in their attempts at punishment. It may be simply about reestablishing credibility. Certainly, they've gone to war for lesser reasons.

[Joe Le Taxi]

We should just split Syria in half and have two separate states. It worked well the last time we did that, just ask Israel.

[Strontium]

We should just split Syria in half and have two separate states. It worked well the last time we did that, just ask Israel.

 

 

Palestine was split into three states, not two.

[Saintslfc13]

My vote is for "stay the fuck out of other nations business and don't send our friends and family members to die in another foreign war".

[Stu Monty]

I actually understand some of the concerns people have about regime change. Though it's not a stated aim of the proposed military action, it's difficulty to see how Assad can remain in power and be re-accepted into the international community after gassing his own citizens.

 

Haha. I bet you are saying that with a straight face aren't you.

 

Here we have it, Assad is the first rotter to ever be nasty to his own people (or presumably, to other people as, you know, they're still people), so he has to go. There is no possible way rotters can be accepted in the international community of love and brotherhood.

 

Fuck me!

 

And this isn't an anti-US or anti-Israel things either, as brazen as they are about being cunts, Putin is accepted in the international community too after all sorts of dogdy shit...because it isn't a Disney film and killing people isn't that much of a black mark.

[Saintslfc13]

Palestine was split into three states, not two.

 

The sarcastic point about the outcome still stand though doesn't it?