Remembrance Day

[Malarkey]

I'm sorry, but this has really grinded my gears.

 

Muslims clash with police after burning poppy in anti-Armistice Day protest - Telegraph

 

About 35 Islamic protesters, dressed in dark clothes and with many masking their faces, carried banners and chanted slogans such as "British soldiers: terrorists".

 

The group confronted police officers and briefly fought with them, leaving one officer with a head injury requiring hospital treatment, and three arrests were made.

 

Around 50 counter demonstrators from the far-right English Defence League gathered nearby but officers kept the two sides apart.

 

The protesters said they were from a group called Muslims Against Crusades.

 

They gathered near Hyde Park in London before burning a model of a poppy on the stroke of 11am then marching along Exhibition Road and along an underpass, past the Victoria and Albert and Natural History Museums.

 

Asad Ullah, 23, a spokesman for the group who would only say he was from London, said: "The British soldiers you remember on this day are soldiers who have taken innocent lives in illegal occupations and unjust wars.

 

"Our aim is not violence but if people come to us with violence, Muslims will defend themselves."

 

He added: "We will do this again. Until the British people condemn the British Government for these illegal wars, we will not stop protesting."

 

Posters bore slogans including "Hands off Muslim lands" and "Islam will dominate", and flags bore Arabic writing with the words "There is no God but Allah".

 

The group went to South Kensington Tube station, roughly circled by about 20 police officers as they were from the start of the march, and rode it to Whitechapel, in east London, where the organisers collected the flags and high-visibility vests some were wearing and the group dispersed.

 

One of the passengers on the Tube was Sylvia Black, 61, a retired sub-postmistress from Yeovil, Somerset.

 

She was wearing a poppy in memory of her uncle, a corporal who was killed in the First World War.

 

Mrs Black said: "I disagree with what they're doing. They shouldn't be doing it and they shouldn't be allowed to do it."

 

Of the three arrests made, two were for public order offences and one was for assaulting a police officer.

 

The Muslims Against Crusades website includes graphic images of children wounded in warfare and the torture of detainees at Abu Ghraib.

 

Earlier this year members were involved in violent clashes with far-right groups during a troop march in Barking, east London.

 

There are suspicions Muslims Against Crusades is a splinter group of Islam4UK, founded by Anjem Choudary, a British Muslim extremist formerly a senior figure in the now banned Al-Muhajiroun and Islam4UK groups.

 

____________________________________________________________

 

A small minority of oxygen thieves.

 

A small minority of people who don't understand that the people who died for this country so that these people use the free speech rights they're using today. And disrespecting them in public.

[Master Bates]

It's just that troublesome tiny majority again. But don't forget, the overwhelming minority are really moderate and peace-loving. Honestly.

[stevebaby]

If they want to burn poppies,Afghanistan is full of poppy fields.

I think that a less tolerant reaction would be forthcoming there though.

[Guest San Don]

A lad I work with is packing his whole life and family up and fucking off to Aus. Says he's pissed off at shit like this where all and sundry think they can come to the UK, hurl abuse at our way of life, want their own 'sharia' law etc introduced for them.

 

He's had enough. Cant say I blame him either.

[Section_31]

My take on it:

 

(1) They have the right to protest the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq

(2) But they shouldn't have burned the poppies as it's disrespectful.

(3) Modern wars shouldn't be lumped in with the great wars of the past.

(4) The media is obsessed with 'muslims' because it sells papers

(5) The EDL are cunts.

[Stu Monty]

A lad I work with is packing his whole life and family up and fucking off to Aus. Says he's pissed off at shit like this where all and sundry think they can come to the UK, hurl abuse at our way of life, want their own 'sharia' law etc introduced for them.

 

He's had enough. Cant say I blame him either.

 

Haha. "Our" way of life. A curry at the weekend you mean? Or are you talking about out nordic traditions of paganism that are always being disrespected by newcomers?

 

If you don't want people to start seeing the poppy as a symbol of something it never was in the past then don't deliberately use it as a tool of manipulation. If you have mass media campaigns telling people that the poppy is about buying prosthetic limbs for the people who illegally occupied Iraq then don't be surprised when people start to resent it.

 

My grandad fought in the war and I personally think that lumping the people who fought in WW2 with the recent war crimes is a fucking disgrace.

 

A dozen mouthy muslims couldn't dream of doing as much damage to the image of the poppy as has been done by the campaign itself.

[Joe Le Taxi]

Section I owe you a rep.

 

We should all chain mail that instead of the shit on Facebook at the moment.

[Guest San Don]

Haha. "Our" way of life. A curry at the weekend you mean? Or are you talking about out nordic traditions of paganism that are always being disrespected by newcomers?

 

If you don't want people to start seeing the poppy as a symbol of something it never was in the past then don't deliberately use it as a tool of manipulation. If you have mass media campaigns telling people that the poppy is about buying prosthetic limbs for the people who illegally occupied Iraq then don't be surprised when people start to resent it.

 

My grandad fought in the war and I personally think that lumping the people who fought in WW2 with the recent war crimes is a fucking disgrace.

 

A dozen mouthy muslims couldn't dream of doing as much damage to the image of the poppy as has been done by the campaign itself.

 

Well you can keep your crocodile tears as far as Im concerned. You dont even know the fucking lad but are pontificating on his actions.

 

And just what exactly does "If you don't want people to start seeing the poppy as a symbol of something it never was in the past" mean?

 

As for illegally occupying Iraq, you may think its illegal but the UN didnt.

[Stu Monty]

Well you can keep your crocodile tears as far as Im concerned. You dont even know the fucking lad but are pontificating on his actions.

 

And just what exactly does "If you don't want people to start seeing the poppy as a symbol of something it never was in the past" mean?

 

As for illegally occupying Iraq, you may think its illegal but the UN didnt.

 

Which lad?

[Section_31]

Well you can keep your crocodile tears as far as Im concerned. You dont even know the fucking lad but are pontificating on his actions.

 

And just what exactly does "If you don't want people to start seeing the poppy as a symbol of something it never was in the past" mean?

 

As for illegally occupying Iraq, you may think its illegal but the UN didnt.

 

Erm...

 

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Iraq war illegal, says Annan

 

The United Nations Secretary-General Kofi Annan has told the BBC the US-led invasion of Iraq was an illegal act that contravened the UN charter

 

BBC News - Iraq inquiry: Former UN inspector Blix says war illegal

 

The UN's former chief weapons inspector Hans Blix has said it is his "firm view" that the Iraq war was illegal.

 

 

 

Even Johnnie Cochran thought it was illegal.

[She Knows It]

A lad I work with is packing his whole life and family up and fucking off to Aus. Says he's pissed off at shit like this where all and sundry think they can come to the UK, hurl abuse at our way of life, want their own 'sharia' law etc introduced for them.

 

He's had enough. Cant say I blame him either.

 

You pmed me after I negged you with the word 'racist', telling me to "Get a fucking life".

 

Just to clarify, are you suggesting that moving halfway across the globe just because a handful of dickheads had a protest that you didn't agree with is a sane and rational response?

[Stu Monty]

He means the other UN, Section.

[Magic Sponge]

They should of stormed Labours headquarters. More media exposure.

[Master Bates]

There isn't really a lot of point in arguing with dyed-in-the-wool lefties about Islam.

 

Basically these people have always staked their entire intellectual existences on the premise that there is nothing remotely as bad as Western democratic capitalism. Nothing at all in their eyes, we are as evil and corrupt as it is possible to be.

 

That's why so many used to be die hard communists and Stalinists until all the communist countries realised they were bankrupt and couldn't go on and wanted to become democratic capitalists (or at least capitalists) instead.

 

For a brief moment in the 1990s this dispossessed left hitched its star to the green movement, but they quickly realised that telling us to grow our own food, live by candle light and cycle not drive to work wasn't going to sell any tickets, particularly when they weren't going to follow those standards themselves.

 

The along came Islam. Something you would have thought every self-respecting leftie would have run a mile from. It's got everything they claim to oppose. Capital and corporal punishment, dominance of an unelected clerisy, gender inequality and segregation, honour killings, rape within marriage, apartheid between believers and unbelievers, terrorism, jihad, you name it. They should run a mile.

 

But the left embraces Islam, clasps it to its bosom. And why? Because it's not Western democratic capitalism, that's why. It's not the thing they've been taught to hate above all else.

[Stu Monty]

They should of stormed Labours headquarters. More media exposure.

 

I think they've done pretty well for what looked like about a dozen people. It could have been one nutter and it's still be national news though. People love to be offended by mulsims, it helps solidify the opinion that they're all nutters.

 

Well, more nuttery than the other nutters who believe in religions.

[Magic Sponge]

There isn't really a lot of point in arguing with dyed-in-the-wool lefties about Islam.

 

Basically these people have always staked their entire intellectual existences on the premise that there is nothing remotely as bad as Western democratic capitalism. Nothing at all in their eyes, we are as evil and corrupt as it is possible to be.

 

That's why so many used to be die hard communists and Stalinists until all the communist countries realised they were bankrupt and couldn't go on and wanted to become democratic capitalists (or at least capitalists) instead.

 

For a brief moment in the 1990s this dispossessed left hitched its star to the green movement, but they quickly realised that telling us to grow our own food, live by candle light and cycle not drive to work wasn't going to sell any tickets, particularly when they weren't going to follow those standards themselves.

 

The along came Islam. Something you would have thought every self-respecting leftie would have run a mile from. It's got everything they claim to oppose. Capital and corporal punishment, dominance of an unelected clerisy, gender inequality and segregation, honour killings, rape within marriage, apartheid between believers and unbelievers, terrorism, jihad, you name it. They should run a mile.

 

But the left embraces Islam, clasps it to its bosom. And why? Because it's not Western democratic capitalism, that's why. It's not the thing they've been taught to hate above all else.

 

Fuckin hell mate, talk about taring Muslims with the same brush.

 

It was a small minority. Just like it's a small minority that follows Nick "goggle eyed cunt" Griffin.

[George Costanza]

should have shot them

[Anubis]

There isn't really a lot of point in arguing with dyed-in-the-wool lefties about Islam.

 

Basically these people have always staked their entire intellectual existences on the premise that there is nothing remotely as bad as Western democratic capitalism. Nothing at all in their eyes, we are as evil and corrupt as it is possible to be.

 

That's why so many used to be die hard communists and Stalinists until all the communist countries realised they were bankrupt and couldn't go on and wanted to become democratic capitalists (or at least capitalists) instead.

 

For a brief moment in the 1990s this dispossessed left hitched its star to the green movement, but they quickly realised that telling us to grow our own food, live by candle light and cycle not drive to work wasn't going to sell any tickets, particularly when they weren't going to follow those standards themselves.

 

The along came Islam. Something you would have thought every self-respecting leftie would have run a mile from. It's got everything they claim to oppose. Capital and corporal punishment, dominance of an unelected clerisy, gender inequality and segregation, honour killings, rape within marriage, apartheid between believers and unbelievers, terrorism, jihad, you name it. They should run a mile.

 

But the left embraces Islam, clasps it to its bosom. And why? Because it's not Western democratic capitalism, that's why. It's not the thing they've been taught to hate above all else.

 

Misty old boy, is that you? Have you snuck back in?

[Anubis]

Thirty five?! Thirty five?! My god, they've invaded us with an army......

[Master Bates]

I didn't tar all Muslims with the same brush Magic Sponge. In fact I never once mentioned the word ''Muslims'' in the post you refer to.

 

Most Muslims are probably decent people and they are not Muslims through choice. They are Muslims because their parents were Muslims and their parents' parents were Muslims etc and this brainwashing has gone on down the generations.

 

You can regard Islam as ''one of the world's great religions'' if you want to. I prefer to think of it as a cult which indoctrinates its adherents from birth and actively promotes behaviour which all sane people ought to reprehend.

[Yozzer]

 

BBC News - Iraq inquiry: Former UN inspector Blix says war illegal

 

 

[YOUTUBE]5TEvacFETvM[/YOUTUBE]

 

Sorry, couldn't resist.

[Section_31]

Misty old boy, is that you? Have you snuck back in?

 

Good skills, you're like a dog in the Terminator franchise. No offence.

 

(when I said 'no offence' I made a hand and facial gesture like this.)

 

[Magic Sponge]

I didn't tar all Muslims with the same brush Magic Sponge. In fact I never once mentioned the word ''Muslims'' in the post you refer to.

 

Most Muslims are probably decent people and they are not Muslims through choice. They are Muslims because their parents were Muslims and their parents' parents were Muslims etc and this brainwashing has gone on down the generations.

 

You can regard Islam as ''one of the world's great religions'' if you want to. I prefer to think of it as a cult which indoctrinates its adherents from birth and actively promotes behaviour which all sane people ought to reprehend.

 

That's not only a narrow minded view, it's frightfully close to being racist.

[Stu Monty]

There isn't really a lot of point in arguing with dyed-in-the-wool lefties about Islam.

 

Basically these people have always staked their entire intellectual existences on the premise that there is nothing remotely as bad as Western democratic capitalism. Nothing at all in their eyes, we are as evil and corrupt as it is possible to be.

 

That's why so many used to be die hard communists and Stalinists until all the communist countries realised they were bankrupt and couldn't go on and wanted to become democratic capitalists (or at least capitalists) instead.

 

For a brief moment in the 1990s this dispossessed left hitched its star to the green movement, but they quickly realised that telling us to grow our own food, live by candle light and cycle not drive to work wasn't going to sell any tickets, particularly when they weren't going to follow those standards themselves.

 

The along came Islam. Something you would have thought every self-respecting leftie would have run a mile from. It's got everything they claim to oppose. Capital and corporal punishment, dominance of an unelected clerisy, gender inequality and segregation, honour killings, rape within marriage, apartheid between believers and unbelievers, terrorism, jihad, you name it. They should run a mile.

 

But the left embraces Islam, clasps it to its bosom. And why? Because it's not Western democratic capitalism, that's why. It's not the thing they've been taught to hate above all else.

 

If you think I have any time at all for Islam you're painfully misinformed.

 

The whole premise of your post is wrong too. Lefties don't think democratic capitalism is the worst thing ever, they just think it isn't the wonderful system that other people do, and that's only some of them. They also generally like tolerance of other people and would rather not go starting illegal wars then plastering people involved in them with the same poppy as those who fought Hitler.

 

Gotta love the little aside there about "or at least capitalists" inferring that they didn't achieve the lofty levels of democracy that countries like the US have. A country where poll rigging is now rife and a president stole an election. And comparing a religion to a form of government? How is that apples and apples?

[Master Bates]

So Magic Sponge, just tell me straight then.

 

Is it racist to disapprove of Islam's doctrines, or is it just ''frightfully close'' to being racist?

 

And what about Christianity, Scientology, Mormonism, Communism. Conservatism? Could disapproval of their doctrines be characterised as racist or frightfully close to racist too?