Rafa Exclusive in The Times

[Tom R]

I've just realised - you actually BELIEVE what you say.

 

Ace!!!!!

 

Er, I don't just "believe" it. It's actually what I said, very publicly on here, having seen him play for the first time.

I said he was absolute turd then and the manager had fucked up again and that he'd be an absolute fucking flop here.

 

So yeah, as you say; Ace!!!!!

[Tom R]

I'd also give a sideways glance a Lucas to be added to that list - his performances this season have made a lot of people eat their words. (Or at least keep thier words to themselves).

 

haha

 

I've just realised - you actually BELIEVE what you say.

 

Ace!!!!!

[Kennys_spell]

There is no factual error in what you wrote? How the fuck do you know?

 

You have no idea why Alonso left. You have no idea how much he is earning at Madrid. You have no idea if Benitez wanted to sell him.

 

Stop purporting your opinions as fact. It's really fucking tedious.

 

It's actually quite well documented why Alonso left:

 

"Gerrard told FourFourTwo magazine how the sale had left him feeling: "Devastated, yeah. Devastated. But there was nothing I could do about it. Xabi said a long time ago that he wanted another chapter in his career and finally he got it and his team-mates and the coaches couldn't stand in his way. We just have to say thanks and move forward without him."

 

What you're saying in your post is that "YOU don't know why he left" therefore no one could know.

 

That comes across as arrogant.

[Whelan]

We are talking about the quartet of Dossena (left back), Degen (right back), Babel (left winger) and Voronin (behind the striker).

 

None of them are central midfielders.

 

So some are talking replacing them with Kelly, Eccleston, Amoo and Pachecho. Again, none of them are central midfielders.

 

Spearing doesn't play in the same position as any of Babel, Dossena, Degen or Voronin, which is why people are mentioning Pacheco, Eccleston and Kelly.

 

No-one mentioned Peter Gulacsi either, for the same reason.

 

Fair enough, sorry for being a bit snide.

[silverlining]

I'd also give a sideways glance a Lucas to be added to that list - his performances this season have made a lot of people eat their words. (Or at least keep thier words to themselves).

 

Haha. "sideways".

[Kennys_spell]

Er, I don't just "believe" it. It's actually what I said, very publicly on here, having seen him play for the first time.

I said he was absolute turd then and the manager had fucked up again and that he'd be an absolute fucking flop here.

 

So yeah, as you say; Ace!!!!!

 

It's alright - I already believe you.

[Roy Hobbs]

Your wasting your time Jim because the hatred of Rafa over-rides many looking at the bigger picture.

 

Yep. They are far too far gone too change their minds now.

[rondeco]

Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher risk film row | Liverpool - Times Online

 

Liverpool have risked a furore over a film starring Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher that portrays Sir Alex Ferguson, the Manchester United manager, as a whisky-guzzling drunk and Gary Neville, the club’s captain, as a rat who “hates Scousers”.

 

Gerrard and Carragher were joined by Rafael Benítez, the Merseyside club’s manager, at the premiere of Fifteen Minutes That Shook The World in Liverpool on Monday evening.

 

The 43-minute film is a darkly humorous, fictional account of the events that inspired Liverpool’s fightback against AC Milan in the Champions League final in Istanbul in May 2005, when they came from 3-0 down at half-time to win on penalties.

 

But while the movie — which includes cameos from Gerrard and Carragher, the Liverpool captain and vice-captain respectively — was intended to be light-hearted and firmly tongue-in-cheek, it remains to be seen what United make of it.

 

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In one scene, a Ferguson parody called McTaggart rings a Neville lookalike, wearing a United No 2 shirt bearing the name “Rat Boy” on the back, to celebrate Liverpool trailing Milan by three goals.

 

“Rat Boy”, whose features were digitally enhanced to make him more ratlike, responds by singing about how he “hates Scousers”, an ironic nod to the song that United fans chant about Neville’s widely perceived dislike of Liverpool.

 

When word comes through that Liverpool have drawn level, McTaggart is seen swigging furiously from a bottle of Scotch, which has the words “Manager of the Month but not as good as Bob Paisley” on it. He then tries to put his head in a noose only to be thwarted when the gum bubble he blows explodes over his face.

 

United declined to comment yesterday, but Ferguson and Neville are likely to be unimpressed, not least because of the involvement of Gerrard and Carragher and others at Anfield, even though they would not have been aware of the full extent of the content.

 

Ferguson did not react well the previous time a club tried to poke fun at United. He described Manchester City as a “small club with a small mentality”, arrogant, cocky and stupid for the “Welcome to Manchester” poster they erected in the summer after Carlos Tévez’s move to the club from Old Trafford.

 

Liverpool fans, though, will doubtless view the film as it was intended — a bit of fun — even if the timing of its release may raise a few eyebrows, coming as it has only days before Benítez’s team face Manchester City in the Barclays Premier League and Debrecen in the Champions League, games that could define their season.

 

Ferguson and Neville are by no means the only ones sent up in the film. Benítez, who is played by Neil Fitzmaurice, the actor and comedian, tells his players in the dressing room at half-time that “the whole damn world will take the p***, go on that pitch you shower of pigs and make it our day.” Of Dietmar Hamann, the former Liverpool player who also has a cameo in the film, Fitzmaurice’s Benítez says: “But what is Hamann, what has he got, he smokes, he drinks, he uses pot, but he will shine.”

 

Djimi Traoré, the former Liverpool defender, is brought into the dressing room in a box by Sami Hyypia, at which point Gerrard says, “Djimi, that’s the best you’ve been in the box all night,” while Carragher, when pressed by Benítez for his thoughts, can utter only the Scouse phrase: “I’m still chocka.” Gerrard adds that he “won’t be able to show my face” around his home town of Huyton if Liverpool do not stage a comeback.

 

The film was written by Dave Kirby, the Liverpool playwright, and will shortly go on general release at selected cinemas — although presumably not in Manchester — before being released on DVD in time for Christmas.

 

Truth stranger than fiction

 

Rafael Benítez went to the premiere of Fifteen Minutes That Shook The World on Monday night and laughed at the lampooning depiction of himself at half-time in Istanbul (Tony Evans writes). Yet the events in the dressing room at the Atatürk Stadium are so bizarre that fiction does not do them justice. Nor does Benítez need sending up. He repeats the story with wide-eyed humour.

 

The Liverpool manager rose from the bench with AC Milan leading 2-0. “I was thinking what to say,” he said. “Then Milan scored again.”

 

Benítez took off Djimi Traoré and sent on Dietmar Hamann. “Then I spoke,” he said. “For eight minutes. In English.” With the officials calling them back on the pitch, Benítez was told that Steve Finnan was injured.

 

Traoré was retrieved from the showers while Finnan pleaded to stay on. Benítez drew up his team. “I had Hamann, Finnan was still on and I added Traoré back,” he said, laughing. Someone pointed out he was sending out 12 men. “So I rubbed out both full backs,” he said. “It left ten men.”

 

With a bit of help, Benítez sent 11 on to the pitch, Liverpool came back to 3-3 and won on penalties. File under “great team-talks

[2pak]

I'd also give a sideways glance a Lucas to be added to that list - his performances this season have made a lot of people eat their words. (Or at least keep thier words to themselves).

 

This is quite funny!

[dave u]

If Ferguson and Neville don't like it, so fucking what. Fuck them. It's not like Rafa, Stevie or Carra wrote the play!

 

Personally I can't wait to see it.

[Liverpool lad]

Neville can fuck off

 

Which poster was it on here who said that Neville was seen smirking during a minutes silence? And that when Beckham got abuse from England fans, Neville was the first to tell the journalists in the press box that it was Liverpool fans?

 

He is from Bury for fucks sake, all this I hate Scousers from him is a fucking joke.

[Durango]

Damn right he should have to sell Babel, Voronin, Dossena and Degen. They're all fucking shite and on silly money. We won't miss them, and we have younger players who could fill those gaps without weakening us.

 

Seriously, could Eccleston, Pacheco, Kelly etc do any worse then that 'international quartet'? Bin them off, for whatever we can get. If we can get anything of course.

I always thought you knew a bit.

 

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this discovery.

[dave u]

I always thought you knew a bit.

 

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this discovery.

 

I always thought you were as thick as pig shit.

 

I'm quite happy to see it confirmed, yet again.

[Kennys_spell]

I actually really, really like Rafa. I'd fucking LOVE to see him suceed.

 

The fact that he wont suceed doesn't mean I "hate" him! That's fucking ridiculous.

I judge him on a professional basis only.

 

"Judge him on a professional basis only" ? Really - what team do you manage?

 

I like the consistency you show in your posts - just about each and every one of them is pure idoiocy.

[Durango]

I always thought you were as thick as pig shit.

 

I'm quite happy to see it confirmed, yet again.

But I couldn't do what you done at Preston.

[HJohal]

Damn right he should have to sell Babel, Voronin, Dossena and Degen. They're all fucking shite and on silly money. We won't miss them, and we have younger players who could fill those gaps without weakening us.

 

Seriously, could Eccleston, Pacheco, Kelly etc do any worse then that 'international quartet'? Bin them off, for whatever we can get. If we can get anything of course.

 

The only concern I have with this approach is that whilst the players are expandable the wages that the club generates for these players - approx 120k per week? - should be put back in the pool to be re-invested otherwise that spend will be banked as a saving permanentely.

 

Remember 120k per week is the wages equivalent of a superstar signing in the category of Torres or Gerrard.

 

I somehow doubt this money would be re-invested hence why it may be better to hang onto the resources (wages) to protect the budget longer term - they may be a compromise where part (~25%) of it may be re-invested for PR purposes, i.e Reina + Aurelio's new contracts. However I would be amazed if we have not slipped down to 6th behind Man Utd, Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal and Spurs in terms of wages invested by the end of the season judging by the way we are de-leveraging the club via asset stripping - with the high correlation between wages and league position it wont be long before we start fighting for Europa Cup every season unless something drastic changes.

[Carra_is_legend]

"Judge him on a professional basis only" ? Really - what team do you manage?

 

I like the consistency you show in your posts - just about each and every one of them is pure idoiocy.

 

You question the consistency in his posts and yet, you come up with stupid questions like above.

 

Are you saying he can only judge Benitez professionally if he is managing a football team? What sort of a stupid fucking question is that?

 

Are you saying the 40k Liverpool fans who go to Anfield have to manage a football team before they can pass their professional judgement on the manager?

[dirty_sanchez]

The only concern I have with this approach is that whilst the players are expandable the wages that the club generates for these players - approx 120k per week? - should be put back in the pool to be re-invested otherwise that spend will be banked as a saving permanentely.

 

Remember 120k per week is the wages equivalent of a superstar signing in the category of Torres or Gerrard.

 

I somehow doubt this money would be re-invested hence why it may be better to hang onto the resources (wages) to protect the budget longer term - they may be a compromise where part (~25%) of it may be re-invested for PR purposes, i.e Reina + Aurelio's new contracts. However I would be amazed if we have not slipped down to 6th behind Man Utd, Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal and Spurs in terms of wages invested by the end of the season judging by the way we are de-leveraging the club via asset stripping - with the high correlation between wages and league position it wont be long before we start fighting for Europa Cup every season unless something drastic changes.

 

I reckon those four are on a lot more than £120k a week between them. Degen's on more than a quarter of that by himself and Dossenawas on too much for Napoli to afford him. I reckon they're on closer to £160-170k a week.

[Kennys_spell]

You question the consistency in his posts and yet, you come up with stupid questions like above.

 

Are you saying he can only judge Benitez professionally if he is managing a football team? What sort of a stupid fucking question is that?

 

Are you saying the 40k Liverpool fans who go to Anfield have to manage a football team before they can pass their professional judgement on the manager?

 

 

Clearly the sarcasm was beyond you - it was a rhetorical question aimed at pointing out the fact that he is NOT judging him on a "professional basis". He may be judging him on his professional performance, he may be judging the professionalism he applies to his job. But he is NOT judging him on a professional basis.

 

Just shout if you need any more help.

[hamstrung]

You question the consistency in his posts and yet, you come up with stupid questions like above.

 

Kenny is a dick.

 

Consistently.

[Carra_is_legend]

Clearly the sarcasm was beyond you - it was a rhetorical question aimed at pointing out the fact that he is NOT judging him on a "professional basis". He may be judging him on his professional performance, he may be judging the professionalism he applies to his job. But he is NOT judging him on a professional basis.

 

Just shout if you need any more help.

 

WHAT?

 

THE?

 

FUCK?

[Red Nick]

Tom R is completely correct its just football business.

 

Just because you think Rafa is incapable of doing the job he is employed to do and you think someone can do it better then it doesnt mean you hate him its you just want what is best for the club and one view is that would be better without Rafa in charge.

[PaulMcC]

I'd be happy if we got rid of them 4 but would want the money to be invested in the squad, not cut the wage bill. I've doubts Eccleston is ready for the first team.

 

That's the most important part of the article, Rafa actually saying we have to sell to buy. Hopefully sell high and buy cheap.

 

That's a fucking disgrace for a club of our size who have done so well in teh money making Chammpions League.

[Kennys_spell]

Tom R is completely correct its just football business.

 

Just because you think Rafa is incapable of doing the job he is employed to do and you think someone can do it better then it doesnt mean you hate him its you just want what is best for the club and one view is that would be better without Rafa in charge.

 

...and surely - just because you think Rafa is incapable of doing the job he is employed to do that it is a correct opinioin. No?

[Carra_is_legend]

That's a fucking disgrace for a club of our size who have done so well in teh money making Chammpions League.

 

I'm more worried about the future of our club than ever.

 

I'm convinced the two cunts will destroy our club completely sooner or later.