Russia v Ukraine

[Captain Howdy]

3 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

I don't think it's difficult really. NATO is a tool of greedy psychopathic western elites intent on dominating as much of the world as possible, the percentage of GDP spent on defence requirement for each NATO member is a massive grift for defence corps and the "rules based international order" is everyone that bows down to the US. This that don't aren't following "the rules."

You’re one bad dickhead, can’t be doing with your oral diarrhoea anymore. Yet another belter on ignore

[M_B]

42 minutes ago, Arniepie said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/mauritius-chagos-islands-indian-ocean-american-international-criminal-court-b2009993.html%3famp

 

Obviously I wouldn't suggest Russia would be justified in invading a sovereign state,but I do find it quite ironic that we claim the moral high ground on colonial issues

 

 

By that thinking, we'd have allowed Hitler to invade Poland and Russia unopposed.

[SasaS]

3 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

I don't think it's difficult really. NATO is a tool of greedy psychopathic western elites intent on dominating as much of the world as possible, the percentage of GDP spent on defence requirement for each NATO member is a massive grift for defence corps and the "rules based international order" is everyone that bows down to the US. This that don't aren't following "the rules."

I think NATO membership actually saves you some of defence budget money. Didn't your boy Trump rant at the NATO summit how nobody spends any money and everybody expects the US to defend them?

 

3 hours ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

But Eastern Europe has chosen, in the most part, to become members of the EU and some of them NATO. We can’t just leave them alone. That would certainly make them feel less safe. 

All of EE EU members are in NATO, it's like a prerequsite for joining the EU.

[Numero Veinticinco]

12 minutes ago, SasaS said:

I think NATO membership actually saves you some of defence budget money. Didn't your boy Trump rant at the NATO summit how nobody spends any money and everybody expects the US to defend them?

 

All of EE EU members are in NATO, it's like a prerequsite for joining the EU.

I was too lazy to look at the status of a couple of countries, I assumed that some were in the EU and not NATO. I'll happily take your word for it. Point doesn't change of course.

 

But Eastern Europe has chosen, in the most part, to become members of the EU and some of them NATO. We can’t just leave them alone. That would certainly make them feel less safe. 

[SasaS]

11 minutes ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

I was too lazy to look at the status of a couple of countries, I assumed that some were in the EU and not NATO. I'll happily take your word for it. Point doesn't change of course.

 

But Eastern Europe has chosen, in the most part, to become members of the EU and some of them NATO. We can’t just leave them alone. That would certainly make them feel less safe. 

I think without NATO, Baltic republics would definitely be very nervous, Estonia and Latvia in particular with their large Russian minorities, ideal for destabilization and even as a possible pretext for creating de facto breakaway provinces, as in Georgia, Moldova and recently Ukraine. Outside of the former USSR area, it would be less drama.

 

NATO is also useful for regional stability in the Balkans, where there is always some powder keg being left close to the fire somewhere.

[Red Phoenix]

36 minutes ago, SasaS said:

I think NATO membership actually saves you some of defence budget money. Didn't your boy Trump rant at the NATO summit how nobody spends any money and everybody expects the US to defend them?

 

I think NATO membership locks in regular cash for defence corps so it figures that they're happy to get as many countries as possible in on it. It seems ironic that you're going on about "my boy" Trump too when Clinton was one of the main US war hawks that urged military action on Libya, one of the biggest atrocities that NATO is stained with.

[Numero Veinticinco]

22 minutes ago, SasaS said:

I think without NATO, Baltic republics would definitely be very nervous, Estonia and Latvia in particular with their large Russian minorities, ideal for destabilization and even as a possible pretext for creating de facto breakaway provinces, as in Georgia, Moldova and recently Ukraine. Outside of the former USSR area, it would be less drama.

 

NATO is also useful for regional stability in the Balkans, where there is always some powder keg being left close to the fire somewhere.

Agreed. 

[Bjornebye]

I think we should all be relieved that Russia haven't decided to kick off. 

[SasaS]

7 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

I think NATO membership locks in regular cash for defence corps so it figures that they're happy to get as many countries as possible in on it. It seems ironic that you're going on about "my boy" Trump too when Clinton was one of the main US war hawks that urged military action on Libya, one of the biggest atrocities that NATO is stained with.

I calles him your boy because you supported him (over Clinton).

[TheHowieLama]

13 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

I think we should all be relieved that Russia haven't decided to kick off. 

Don't be too sure - the GF plays the long game.

War with Iran has been imminent for going on 14 years now.

[Red Phoenix]

35 minutes ago, SasaS said:

I calles him your boy because you supported him (over Clinton).

 

I don't remember actively supporting him, I was more focused on pointing out how much of a fraud Clinton was after her campaign had rigged things against Sanders (someone who I did support) and the fact that she chose to blame Russia when Wikileaks exposed that instead of taking any part in the blame herself. There's also the bit about her wanting to take out Syria's air bases around that time whilst Russia were in the country, maybe that would've been another NATO op? And who knows how that one could've ended up.

[Bjornebye]

10 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

I don't remember actively supporting him, I was more focused on pointing out how much of a fraud Clinton was after her campaign had rigged things against Sanders (someone who I did support) and the fact that she chose to blame Russia when Wikileaks exposed that instead of taking any part in the blame herself. There's also the bit about her wanting to take out Syria's air bases around that time whilst Russia were in the country, maybe that would've been another NATO op? And who knows how that one could've ended up.

Can you do a bit on how much of a fraud Trump is then? 

[Red Phoenix]

6 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

Can you do a bit on how much of a fraud Trump is then? 

 

I don't feel any need to, it's common knowledge and I don't know of anyone trying to avoid it, unlike what was going on with Clinton in 2016. And her campaign actively supported him way more than anything I could have done with their pied piper strategy, it could've even been one of the main reasons he ended up being president.

[TheHowieLama]

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his first reaction to reports from Russia that it is pulling back some of its troops from the border area close to Ukraine.

Speaking to BBC Eastern Europe Correspondent Sarah Rainsford at a military training ground in western Ukraine, Mr Zelensky said "we don't see any troop withdrawal yet" and "for now it's just statements".

[Arniepie]

8 hours ago, M_B said:

By that thinking, we'd have allowed Hitler to invade Poland and Russia unopposed.

Like I said,I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying I find it quite ironic when we are so opposed to foreign imperialism, when historically, we are probally one oif the worst offenders

And whilst puton may be a bit of a cunt,I'm not sure if compare him to Hitler just yet.

[M_B]

9 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

I think we should all be relieved that Russia haven't decided to kick off. 

Yet. Defender of the fatherland day in Russia is Feb 23rd.

[Gnasher]

9 hours ago, Bjornebye said:

I think we should all be relieved that Russia haven't decided to kick off. 

 

I wish they'd hurry up and get on with it tbh.

[Gnasher]

50 minutes ago, M_B said:

Yet. Defender of the fatherland day in Russia is Feb 23rd.

So 24th it is then.

[Gnasher]

Surprised we haven't sent little William Hague over to have a strong word with Putin, remember that time he took Putin to a judo competition, dear god I don't think that stunt had the desired effect.

[Gnasher]

9 hours ago, TheHowieLama said:

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his first reaction to reports from Russia that it is pulling back some of its troops from the border area close to Ukraine.

Speaking to BBC Eastern Europe Correspondent Sarah Rainsford at a military training ground in western Ukraine, Mr Zelensky said "we don't see any troop withdrawal yet" and "for now it's just statements".

 

Zelensky; salt of the earth, Ukraine has their fair share of far right thugs;

 

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/05/01/ukr-m01.html

 

Let's not forget, nice bunch of lads,

 

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2014/05/13/odes-m13.html

 

Salt of the earth,

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-idUSKBN1GV2TY

[Strontium]

3 hours ago, Arniepie said:

Like I said,I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying I find it quite ironic when we are so opposed to foreign imperialism, when historically, we are probally one oif the worst offenders

 

The important word in your sentence. 

[Babb'sBurstNad]

12 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

 

Zelensky; salt of the earth, Ukraine has their fair share of far right thugs;

 

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/05/01/ukr-m01.html

Always has. Eastern Europe proved a hotbed, particularly for countries where the German invasion pushed the Russians out. The enemy of my enemy and all that.

[Section_31]

There were loads of Ukrainians concentration camp guards, in fact most of the dudes at Auschwitz (inside the wire) were Eastern European I think, with the Germans usually guarding the outside. 

 

There were actually Russian SS units though, bonkers as it sounds, as they were opposed to Stalin and obviously didn't realise at the time they were earmarked for the ovens. 

[Bjornebye]

29 minutes ago, Strontium said:

 

The important word in your sentence. 

What’s your cut off point for history to be relevant or irrelevant ? 

[TheHowieLama]

2 hours ago, M_B said:

Yet. Defender of the fatherland day in Russia is Feb 23rd.

“After Feb. 20 was always the more important time frame,” said MICHAEL KOFMAN, an expert on Russia’s military at the CNA think tank. “We’re looking to see what Russian forces do then.”

That’s when the largest military exercise since the Cold War is scheduled to end, after which leaders in Moscow and Minsk promised Putin’s troops would head home.

 

“Not a single Russian serviceman, not a single piece of equipment will remain in Belarus after the completion of exercises with Russia,” Belarussian Foreign Minister VLADIMIR MAKEI.