Something I've been meaning to get off my chest for some time, regarding Rafa.

[philyhamann]

Sigh. It really has nothing to do with money.

[Code]

Mistake 5

 

Letting you on the forum.

 

Durango chill out ffs.

 

Why all this anger?

[Durango]

Durango chill out ffs.

 

Why all this anger?

I'm a angry man,i love Rafa!

[Durango]

Calling all Mourinho Lovers,calling all Mourinho lovers.

 

What have you all got to say regarding Inter fans protesting against his "boring" brand of football.

 

Is there any Special 1 lovers out there,care to elaborate?

[PaulMcC]

If you where not so fuckin Daft,that would be side splitting funny!

 

Calm down mate. He was joking.

[isr]

For me it boils down to this: I fully blame Rafa for blowing the league title this season. It's 100% his fault that we arent top and flying now. He's the gaffer and the buck stops there. Period.

His bizarre subs, his cautious approach, his selection of woeful player picked not on form or merit but on god knows what. And on it goes. It's his fault and nobody elses.

However, I'm not so blind that I can't see that he's also the man that got us in to the position of a challenge in the first place.

 

Chris rightly says that we're reliant on Gerrard and Torres, and their absence of joint playing time has cost us, and I agree with that 100%. But that's a seriously bad thing indeed, and that's also Rafa's fault, 100%. At the end of the day he's very lucky to have inherited the world's best player in Gerrard, and what we're saying here is that he's only managed to sign one other player capable of dragging a team to a league title. That's surely just not good enough, is it?

 

So the question I have to ask myself is "can I forgive Rafa for throwing away a league title and giv him another chance?"

 

After the week we've just had, the kneejerk answer is a resounding YES! But then I think back to almost every other game this season, and the way in which he's behaved at times, and the answer is a resounding and resolute absolute fucking NO.

 

That sums us up under Rafa. My biggest concern is I've had the same feeling at the end of the last 2 seasons as well! When do you accept that it just isn't going to change? ]

If a high quality alternative was on the cards then I'd like to see them come in, but they have to have some serious credentials.

 

We'll see what happens at home against Aston Villa. I have a sinking feeling that I'll be dumped firmly back in the camp of not being able to forgive him after yet another dire home performance

 

Catching up here (this is from a few pages back). But Tom, what you said above amounts to a bunch of self-indulgent bollocks. The same old crap, rehashed again and again. To paraphrase:

 

"We should be 200 points clear at the top by now."

Why? Who says? Nobody wins 38 games a season. Everybody goes through bad patches. Winning, or challenging to win, a league is not a cake walk. Particularly if its the strongest league in Europe, with the reigning European champs and the European runners-up in your way.

 

"You blame Rafa 100%"

Eh? Who the hell has piloted the vessel to where you start getting a sniff of the title in the first place?

 

"However, I'm not so blind that I can't see that he's also the man that got us in to the position of a challenge in the first place."

 

You say it, but from everything else you say, it seems like you actually are.

 

The rest of your post goes on to highlight just how much of a flip-flopper you really are.

 

 

(from your later posts)

"He was brought in to win the title, within 5 years, on a smaller budget than his rivals. Anything less, and he should be sent packing"

 

Absolute bollocks. Thats like saying Obama has been elected to cure the recession within 12 months, and cancel America's national debt within 4 years. Anything less, and he's been a disgraceful failure.

 

Its too easy to say shit like that, without thinking it through. Just smacks of a petulant child screaming for more ice cream. How many managers out there are walking around with a placard around their backs saying they are capable of winning the hardest league in the world, today, with minimal investment?

 

For Liverpool to reclaim its place at the top, not just for one season, but for a decade, requires incremental and constant improvement.

 

I'm not going to debate performances. Frankly, most of you don't know your arse from your elbow (and even less about football), so no point there. I'm just going to stick to results.

 

Based on results, we have thus far sustained a genuine and serious challenge for the 2 biggest honours in the game.

 

Thats proof of our progress. End of story.

 

Stick with it, and more will come.

 

And all this "I'm disgusted with Rafa's behaviour" nonsense.

 

Well, its pointless going over the nest of vipers he has to deal with. Its been explained enough times. Most of you know this already, yet hypocritically choose to ignore this and focus on Rafa. Similarly for this childish "Rafa loves Hicks" bollocks. Its the kind of in-depth analysis which wouldn't cut it even for a game of tic-tac-toe. So I'm going to simply say this.

 

If you're one of those who keeps slagging the manager off, and has done so all season, then you have no leg to stand on. Your own behaviour has been bad enough. You don't get to have the right to point fingers. You lost it.

[Unrighteous]

ISR, You cannot argue that Rafa continues to make the same mistakes, the same baffling substitutions, and with the exception of the last two matches, has failed to make us look 'mighty' on the pitch.

 

We are horribly inconsistant, which is due to squad depth, but still... Rafa doesn't change his tune.

 

It began to feel like he's cut off his nose to spite his face this season...

 

If you can't understand, and appreciate, that a lot of concerns that some people have for Rafa are not valid then you, too, are blind.

 

Rafa isn't a shit manager by any means, but he's lost me, and other fans, due to his inability to show that he can handle the domestic situation.

 

I respect, and understand why people love him and believe in him. I'm just afraid that I no longer believe in him, domestically.

[ToxtethTerror]

ISR, You cannot argue that Rafa continues to make the same mistakes, the same baffling substitutions, and with the exception of the last two matches, has failed to make us look 'mighty' on the pitch.

 

We are horribly inconsistant, which is due to squad depth, but still... Rafa doesn't change his tune.

 

It began to feel like he's cut off his nose to spite his face this season...

 

If you can't understand, and appreciate, that a lot of concerns that some people have for Rafa are not valid then you, too, are blind.

 

Rafa isn't a shit manager by any means, but he's lost me, and other fans, due to his inability to show that he can handle the domestic situation.

 

I respect, and understand why people love him and believe in him. I'm just afraid that I no longer believe in him, domestically.

 

I posted this elsewhere mate and it applies here too..

 

It's not easy getting a manager to come and make that next BIG step, or to take a team to the holy grail... just ask Mourinho at Inter Milan - who has acheived nothing more than what Mancini did. Mourinho also failed to do what Rafa has done twice this season which is outsmart Ferguson.

 

I am Rafa's biggest critic but as a Liverpool fan we can't ignore whats in front of our eyes. Just like we didn't ignore the shit performances, we can't now ignore the genuine strides being made of late. I think we need to hold our nerve and just allow that little bit more time because we are close, my God we are close and with the right two signings in the summer we might just get there....

 

He lost me ages ago as most on here know but maybe just maybe we need to hold tight a year more?

[PaulMcC]

[Guest LFD]

I'm just afraid that I no longer believe in him, domestically.

 

But you must admit he must have been doing something right, given we have been challenging most of this season to date, even top at times, all despite our striker (arguably the best in the league / Europe) only starting nine games with Gerrard.

 

He's built a team that is incredibly disciplined, organised and efficent. He's reliant on Torres and Gerrard to win us games. Given match winners cost big money (certainly world class ones), he's not had the luxury to spend big on attacking players, bar Keane, which didn't pay off.

 

We don't have depth in attacking positions, in the sense we can't replace our stars as easily as Man U or Chelsea can. But then again Benitez hasn't had the luxury to spend as much on attacking players as these teams.

 

For example he spends 20 million on Keane which didn't work out and then has to cut his losses in January because Spurs probably wouldn't offer as much in the future as they were desperate for a striker with Defoe injured, as they were in danger of getting relegated without investment.

 

Man U could afford to leave Berbatov on the bench against us, not to mention other expensive players such as 18 million Hargreaves or Nani etc.

 

Our team is good enough to win the title as long as Gerrard / Torres stay fit. Unfortunately they couldn't and unfortunetly our 20 million signing didn't pay off which we had hoped.

[isr]

ISR, You cannot argue that Rafa continues to make the same mistakes, the same baffling substitutions, and with the exception of the last two matches, has failed to make us look 'mighty' on the pitch.

 

Actually, I can argue it (eg: when he puts out a "baffling" lineup, we put in one of our best performances v Newcastle, oh I forgot, we only win because the opposition are shit, a la Madrid, Vidic is suddenly a crap defender, etc) .

 

But how's this for a change. I'm not going to. No need to.

 

Many on here have already formulated their own own opinion of the manager, and by the vitriolic nature in which they express it (general comment here, not meaning you specifically), sounds like their minds are already made up.

 

Ok then. Stick to it. Here's the thing - the rest of us GOT IT ALREADY.

 

We know who you are, and we know what you all think. God knows, you've told us enough times already.

 

So can you kindly put a sock in it, and stop reminding us every 5 seconds? Just wait for the end of this season (or next), and then come back gloating to the rest of us.

 

Until then, give us a break. We just had a great week. And lo and behold, the same old slagging of the manager, doom-mongering etc has taken over.

 

I'm sick of hearing it. Keep your opinions. I'm not going to try to argue you out of them. Just stop dominating every thread with the same old muck. The rest of us want to talk about other stuff without this shit - which I'd wager most don't agree with anyway - getting in the way.

 

Honestly, I don't care. Not everyone agrees on everything. I'm sure 1% still think the earth is flat. Good luck to them. Just stop warning the rest of us not to fall over the edge.

[Al Campbell]

Selling Keane in January when Spurs were desperate for a striker would have been a good deal if we'd used the extra cash we obviously got to buy a decent replacement. Selling Keane and got bringing in a replacement is just stupid. If Torres gets injured now our season is fucked. Unless anyone seriously thinks N'Gog is capable of scoring the goals to win us a sixth European Cup.

[Kevin D]

That's a fucking class picture.

 

Tom's been in class form , I pissed myself through the last two pages. The San Siro, the Nou Camp, the Bernebeu, , Goodison, Stamford Bridge and Old Trafford; we've been to all these places( many more, too) and proceeded to hand the opposition their arse. That alone is worthy of a lot of praise for Rafa.

[Chippo]

Catching up here (this is from a few pages back). But Tom, what you said above amounts to a bunch of self-indulgent bollocks. The same old crap, rehashed again and again. To paraphrase:

 

"We should be 200 points clear at the top by now."

Why? Who says? Nobody wins 38 games a season. Everybody goes through bad patches. Winning, or challenging to win, a league is not a cake walk. Particularly if its the strongest league in Europe, with the reigning European champs and the European runners-up in your way.

 

"You blame Rafa 100%"

Eh? Who the hell has piloted the vessel to where you start getting a sniff of the title in the first place?

 

"However, I'm not so blind that I can't see that he's also the man that got us in to the position of a challenge in the first place."

 

You say it, but from everything else you say, it seems like you actually are.

 

The rest of your post goes on to highlight just how much of a flip-flopper you really are.

 

 

(from your later posts)

"He was brought in to win the title, within 5 years, on a smaller budget than his rivals. Anything less, and he should be sent packing"

 

Absolute bollocks. Thats like saying Obama has been elected to cure the recession within 12 months, and cancel America's national debt within 4 years. Anything less, and he's been a disgraceful failure.

 

Its too easy to say shit like that, without thinking it through. Just smacks of a petulant child screaming for more ice cream. How many managers out there are walking around with a placard around their backs saying they are capable of winning the hardest league in the world, today, with minimal investment?

 

For Liverpool to reclaim its place at the top, not just for one season, but for a decade, requires incremental and constant improvement.

 

I'm not going to debate performances. Frankly, most of you don't know your arse from your elbow (and even less about football), so no point there. I'm just going to stick to results.

 

Based on results, we have thus far sustained a genuine and serious challenge for the 2 biggest honours in the game.

 

Thats proof of our progress. End of story.

 

Stick with it, and more will come.

 

And all this "I'm disgusted with Rafa's behaviour" nonsense.

 

Well, its pointless going over the nest of vipers he has to deal with. Its been explained enough times. Most of you know this already, yet hypocritically choose to ignore this and focus on Rafa. Similarly for this childish "Rafa loves Hicks" bollocks. Its the kind of in-depth analysis which wouldn't cut it even for a game of tic-tac-toe. So I'm going to simply say this.

 

If you're one of those who keeps slagging the manager off, and has done so all season, then you have no leg to stand on. Your own behaviour has been bad enough. You don't get to have the right to point fingers. You lost it.

 

repped

[Code]

Calling all Mourinho Lovers,calling all Mourinho lovers.

 

What have you all got to say regarding Inter fans protesting against his "boring" brand of football.

 

Is there any Special 1 lovers out there,care to elaborate?

 

[INTORRESTING]

Yes.

 

you have to draw the line somewhere. We have exactly the same problems now that we had after his second season and yet he still hasn't addressed them.

 

I see no reason and have no evidence to suggest that he can and will do that this summer.

 

nothing like giving up, we can still win the double.

[G Richards]

Great thread. My thoughts:

 

1. Chris put his thoughts across very well and they resonate with many fans

2. Tom R puts his thoughts across very well too, and they resonate with a sizeable portion of our fans

 

 

The big conundrum is whether to stick or twist. Do you see Rafa getting nearer and nearer, and, on the whole, improvement being made? Or do you think Rafa has taken this about as far as he can in terms of the league and it is time for a new man in the summer.

 

After being quite staunchly in favour of Rafa's work here, I have to say that as the title charge has (seemingly) slipped away this season, I started to drift over to the viewpoint that we need a change of manager.

 

But then the last week happened. I was shown a tantalising glimpse of what life could be like, and I find myself back squarely behind the manager.

 

My big hope is that the style of play continues in a similar fashion until the end of the season. If it does, then regardless of whatever silverware it may or may not bring, I'd like to think that the vast majority of fans will swing behind Rafa.

 

If it all fizzles out, and we get knocked out of CL next round and finish further behind the PL winner than last season, I would imagine there will be a growing clamour (albeit reluctantly since most of our fans still have some sort of residue of doing things in a classy way) for a new manager.

 

As many have said, the fairest thing to do is wait until the season ends and judge then.

[Unrighteous]

Actually, I can argue it (eg: when he puts out a "baffling" lineup, we put in one of our best performances v Newcastle, oh I forgot, we only win because the opposition are shit, a la Madrid, Vidic is suddenly a crap defender, etc) .

 

But how's this for a change. I'm not going to. No need to.

 

Many on here have already formulated their own own opinion of the manager, and by the vitriolic nature in which they express it (general comment here, not meaning you specifically), sounds like their minds are already made up.

 

Ok then. Stick to it. Here's the thing - the rest of us GOT IT ALREADY.

 

We know who you are, and we know what you all think. God knows, you've told us enough times already.

 

So can you kindly put a sock in it, and stop reminding us every 5 seconds? Just wait for the end of this season (or next), and then come back gloating to the rest of us.

 

Until then, give us a break. We just had a great week. And lo and behold, the same old slagging of the manager, doom-mongering etc has taken over.

 

I'm sick of hearing it. Keep your opinions. I'm not going to try to argue you out of them. Just stop dominating every thread with the same old muck. The rest of us want to talk about other stuff without this shit - which I'd wager most don't agree with anyway - getting in the way.

 

Honestly, I don't care. Not everyone agrees on everything. I'm sure 1% still think the earth is flat. Good luck to them. Just stop warning the rest of us not to fall over the edge.

 

To be honest, ISR, that is a load of bollocks you've just posted there.

 

This forum is so fans can talk about the club and all of its staff. The forum is a pretty good spread of the feelings which would mirror that throughout the fanbase.

 

Trying to say, "Don't post anything negative about Rafa" is ridiculous. I'd hazard that only 15% of the fans on this forum alone would back Rafa regardless... 25% back rafa but have reservations... 15% probably sit on the fence or aren't arsed... 25% are leery about rafa and question where the club is going under his management... and 15% are against rafa and want him out regardless of what happens and 5% don't want to stick their oar in whatever the case.

 

What gives you the right to tell, probably, a majority of the forum to stop posting about a MAJOR talking point of this club?

[JMARKH]

Too many self righteous people on here spouting their mouths of after a few victories, at the end of the season hopefully we will be winning what counts i.e SILVERWARE (the excuse makers tend to forget this) and then some of us can gladly admit we were wrong for doubting Rafa ( the anger with him for the political stuff will still remain valid though). Lets just wait and see as we could end up another season winning fuck all while the Mancs celebrate again.

At the end of the day all teams have there good results during the season but it is what happens in May that counts and if you are a club like Liverpool then you need to be delivering trophies. How some on here forget the dross that has been served up at Anfield this season but maybe they don't pay out as much to watch the Reds as others do.

[Jose Jones]

To be honest, ISR, that is a load of bollocks you've just posted there.

 

This forum is so fans can talk about the club and all of its staff. The forum is a pretty good spread of the feelings which would mirror that throughout the fanbase.

 

Trying to say, "Don't post anything negative about Rafa" is ridiculous. I'd hazard that only 15% of the fans on this forum alone would back Rafa regardless... 25% back rafa but have reservations... 15% probably sit on the fence or aren't arsed... 25% are leery about rafa and question where the club is going under his management... and 15% are against rafa and want him out regardless of what happens and 5% don't want to stick their oar in whatever the case.

 

What gives you the right to tell, probably, a majority of the forum to stop posting about a MAJOR talking point of this club?

 

Spot on that Unrighteous, unfortunately the two groups at either end tend to make the most noise, and so debate becomes polarised even when the majority agree on the strengths and weaknesses, mistakes and successes, just have differing future outlooks.

[lifetime fan]

Keane was a much much better player than N'Gog.

 

He scored 7 goals in 28 games for us. Granted he was hardly brilliant, and in some games quite frankly was shite, but he gave us a some very good performances, and chipped in with a decent amount of goals.

 

We have nobody in the squad able to replace him. And to sell him on the last day of the transfer window, and bring in no replacement, is why the vast majority of fans are angry with Rafa. And it is a fair criticism aswell.

 

 

The point people are missing is that Keane did not need to be replaced. We had a far better player in Gerrard to play his position and one in Yossi who would be far better than Keane based on his form for us.

 

The only reason for keeping Keane would have been if he could have stepped up to the plate and provided cover for Torres. He couldn't. He was shit with a rank attitude.

[KopOut]

.....there is no way, no way on this earth, that we should be thinking of replacing Rafa Benitez as manager of our Football Club. It is absolute, unadulterated lunacy.

 

The absence for one third of this season of the Gerrard and Torres dynamic. With those two fully fit and raring to go all season we'd be clear at the top now...

 

We're not lucky enough to be gifted with the resources that allow us to have ... midfielders or ..strikers like Manchester United have. Or leaving the likes of Deco and Essien on the bench. Or Having the choice between Anelka and Drogba....

 

.

With regards to the Academy, it is a real shame that no young players are following Gerrard and Carragher into the first team. .

 

 

I firmly believe that a sixth European Cup is on its way here come the end of May.

 

Viva Rafa.

 

I've given my fair share of comments regarding Rafa B over the season; I've been frustrated with certain aspects of the team's play & frustrated with key aspects of the running of the club, by our new owners & by Parry. I really dont have any idea who controls transfers, or who writes the cheques.

 

All I know is we havn't had a 'holy trinity' for many a year, and yet somewhere in all the hodgepodge of the season, there's been a synergy...there's been the glimmer of potential, and a stirring of passion within the players.

 

I knew the Real games would be the propellors forward, or the Hari Kari act for the players and the fans, and maybe Rafa as well.

 

This week, it seems that everything hidden has been unveiled, potential has crystalised, and The Red Beast was unleashed.

 

what I want for the rest of the season

 

1.Rafa to sign a new long term contract (stability is the essence now, and he is the key to keeping our talent.)

2. CASH made available in the next transfer window for THE RIGHT PLAYERS.

3. I want to see the backs of the American owners, if possible, asap, but realisticaly this is more medium term, unless the Bank wont roll over their loan and we have a firesale.

4. Some news - ANY news, on development of the stadium which seems to be permanently on hold. We are debt stricken, short on liquidity, and if we had 60-70,000 seats available then we'd have a Fortress (new) Anfield, a Cauldren (new) Anfield and a highly profitable (new) Anfield all rolled into one.

 

Oh yes & I'd like us to get the double as well.

 

I've consulted the Runes & said all my prayers; I now await visitations from Shankly, Paisley, my older brother and my Grandad, all now on the terraces watching that great game in the sky. (I'll keep you posted)

 

Time will now unfold.....

[Mr.SB]

1. Aws speaks sense, no one seems to be listening to him.

 

2. I feel sad that the person who started BELIEVE (correct me if I'm wrong) has given up on our manager halfway through the season. Believe is easy when you're leading, when you're strong and dominating. BELIEVE is not so easy when you're chasing, you're struggling and facing an uphill task (and that's why its in capitals). As a fan, I'm not giving up yet. I still BELIEVE while many have already given up. We can argue (tactics etc) at the end of the season, we're not there yet, I still think we can fight the good fight.

[Woo]

1. Aws speaks sense, no one seems to be listening to him.

 

When aws speaks, the whole word should stop and listen.

[Dirk]

I think we've covered taht I don't giev a shit if it was at a loss or even for a profit.

 

IT WAS STILL A SHITTY BIT OF BUSINESS.

 

Worst. Debating. Tactic. Ever. Tom R, rules at everything, except debating.