Klopp is the indispensable man

[Captain Willard]

7 minutes ago, bizzle10 said:

the level of hysteria here is worse than twitter yes we are shockingly poor but we are not getting relegated we will pick up form again it will  be patchy couple wins here and there.

We will start by beating Dyche at Anfield yes we will win the derby but clearly the club has bigger problems than need solving off the pitch mainly the ownership as Jurgen will need major backing in the summer .

I think the owners have lost their faith in his ability to spot players worth buying. Nunez, Keita etc. Nearly £150m wasted plus giving Salah a £50m contract. That’s £200m for those 3 alone. They won’t trust him with another £300m. It’s over. 

[ZonkoVille77]

I picked 85% just to stir shit up. 

 

 

 

 

Wakanda Forever. 

 

 

 

Jah Bless.

 

 

 

 

[Red_or_Dead]

With the markets you sell when you think your stock is as high as it will go, hence FSG leaking that they were looking to sell back in October.  They knew their asset was at its peak - they're not going to put in any funds to maintain it - so they thought, lets get out and make our £3bn profit.

 

Can't see them sacking Klopp, he's own of their biggest assets, losing him lowers the price.

 

 

[an tha]

35 minutes ago, Shooter in the Motor said:

Since the World Cup, we are bottom of the League.

Just checked and not true.

 

6 games since restart:

 

 

 

[Freddo]

3 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

I think the owners have lost their faith in his ability to spot players worth buying. Nunez, Keita etc. Nearly £150m wasted plus giving Salah a £50m contract. That’s £200m for those 3 alone. They won’t trust him with another £300m. It’s over. 

Majority of us have lost faith in the owners. It's over for them. 

[Captain Willard]

1 minute ago, Freddo said:

Majority of us have lost faith in the owners. It's over for them. 

They don’t give a fuck about the fans. There are tens of millions all over the world, millions alone in the Far East. Success sells merchandise. That’s all they care about. 

[Freddo]

10 minutes ago, Captain Willard said:

They don’t give a fuck about the fans. There are tens of millions all over the world, millions alone in the Far East. Success sells merchandise. That’s all they care about. 

They will when fans in the ground start a movement against them. They sack klopp, they’ll live to regret it, I’m sure of it. 

[TheHowieLama]

No one seriously thinks we are getting relegated - certain posters would like to though.

[Creator Supreme]

5 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

No one seriously thinks we are getting relegated - certain posters would like to though.

I seriously think we are, we've fallen off a fucking cliff! I hope Klopp and the players prove me wrong yet again, but based on the season so far I don't fucking see it.

 

They are shot physically and mentally!

[Captain Howdy]

Hope to God I’m wrong but I’m mystified as to why anybody thinks we’re winning the derby. They will be fired up to fuck and have their tails up and we are a complete fucking mess. I just don’t see how we beat them I honestly don’t.

[TheHowieLama]

2 minutes ago, Creator Supreme said:

I seriously think we are, we've fallen off a fucking cliff! I hope Klopp and the players prove me wrong yet again, but based on the season so far I don't fucking see it.

 

They are shot physically and mentally!

 

Well, yeah but you have never been right about anything so you are the exception to the rule.

[VladimirIlyich]

What a spoiled bunch of bastards our support has become. The man was getting the team punching well above his weight for seasons on a budget well below most of the division but as soon as we revert to our average,mostly due to injuries,the crying arses our out demanding his head. If he walks he will walk into any job he wants because he is a great manager but like everybody needs backing. These owners can go before him.

[AdamD]

Our issues at the moment are a complex conundrum and quite clearly there isn't / won't be a quick fix. If you want a quick fix keep hitting the refresh button during the match threads on here. 

Has Klopp been too loyal...definitely but that is an admirable trait and I would like to think part of what makes LFC and why you see so many past players reflect positively on their time at Anfield.

 

Is Klopp the right man to fix it...undoubedtly but quite honestly managers better than Klopp are thin on the ground and he is amongst Europe's elite alongside the likes of Ancelotti.

What are the factors to our demise...
 

1.  The squad is too old...in todays football and Klopps way or playing you cant have the core of your first 11 age 30 or over.
2. The squad lacks quality in depth...if our first 11 or 13 are fit then we can still give anyone a good game but go outside these and then there are a number of reasons why we struggle...too old (I love him but Milner is in here)...too inexperienced (Carvalho, Bajetic), not used to Klopp style of play (Gapko), too shit (Keita, Ox)
3. Injuries - something is not right. Consistently over a few years we must be near the top of the league table for injuries. May be that mad dutch sports scientist bloke was right
4. Sportwashing / FFP - its a joke and will always be and the chance of that bubble bursting is close to zero as there have been some pretty big issues recently e.g. Covid and that hasnt derailed the money tree. The middle eastern countries know they have to diversify and leisure including football and boxing is part of this.
5. FSG - no doubt they bought in to FFP and no doubt they struck gold with Jurgen but he is not a magician and at some point especially because of point 4 you have to invest to grow otherwise you are in managed decline. 

 

I am sure there are other factors in play but there is a chink of light...we have Klopp and although it wont happen overnight the ship can be turned around as Arsenal and Man U have shown.

 

[Kevin D]

1 hour ago, KMD7 said:

I don't think there's any chance of that. Other than arguably Guardiola and Ancelotti who'd come in and do a better job? And neither of them (Guardiola for definite) would work under the financial constraints that FSG have Klopp working under anyway. It's not like Kenny's second season where it was easy to get rid of him as they didn't really want to give him the contract in the first place. 

I do love you, but I’m still a little upset at that final sentence.

 

Yes, we did manoeuvre FSG into getting Kenny, but what a bloody 6 months that was.

[KMD7]

1 minute ago, Kevin D said:

I do love you, but I’m still a little upset at that final sentence.

 

Yes, we did manoeuvre FSG into getting Kenny, but what a bloody 6 months that was.

 

 

It really was. The cup runs the following season were nice as well. 

 

I meant it was easier for FSG to sack Kenny. I took no joy from it and wanted him to stay.  

[Tj hooker]

50 minutes ago, Creator Supreme said:

I seriously think we are, we've fallen off a fucking cliff! I hope Klopp and the players prove me wrong yet again, but based on the season so far I don't fucking see it.

 

They are shot physically and mentally!

If you honestly think we will  go down then let's have a bet £25 to a charity either in Liverpool or Hillsborough based then 

[Creator Supreme]

2 minutes ago, Tj hooker said:

If you honestly think we will  go down then let's have a bet £25 to a charity either in Liverpool or Hillsborough based then 

I haven't got £25 spare, still paying off my ma's funeral mate.

[Tj hooker]

2 minutes ago, Creator Supreme said:

I haven't got £25 spare, still paying off my ma's funeral mate.

Ok sorry about your Mum but if you change your mind I'm here 

[Creator Supreme]

2 minutes ago, Tj hooker said:

Ok sorry about your Mum but if you change your mind I'm here 

Just don't think it would be a fair bet you putting your stake up and me not mate.

[TheHowieLama]

11 minutes ago, AdamD said:

 The squad is too old...in todays football and Klopps way or playing you cant have the core of your first 11 age 30 or over.

 

I think these are two different things tbh. There are top teams who have players playing very well into their 30's because of their set up.

 

The tried and true Klopp 433 does not allow that. Unfortunately the things that made certain players very, very good in that system do not transfer to a more pragmatic setup.

 

A right back like Trent can only play to the level he did the last couple years in the Klopp setup. He really cannot be a traditional right back of any quality - the system more than anything freed him up to capitalize on his strengths. Robbo maybe less so - he has the engine to make overlapping runs and is fundamentally a better defender.

 

Henderson is another example - good in an effective pressing team. On the age thing, I think he still could be but he is useless in a team that needs to play through the midfield in possession - he is not creative enough to break that and is not a threat to carry the ball past anyone - or in a side set up for midfield to arrive late in the box as a goal threat. And he can't shoot.

 

Salah is a similar worry. His game was built on having space in transition to run into - he can't play with his back to goal through the middle and is no longer a threat off the dribble playing wide.

 

The beauty of the team of a couple seasons back were the roles that defined our top players were exactly their strengths. 

 

 

 

[Kevin D]

24 minutes ago, KMD7 said:

 

 

It really was. The cup runs the following season were nice as well. 

 

I meant it was easier for FSG to sack Kenny. I took no joy from it and wanted him to stay.  

9/10 answer.

 

Would have given full marks if you had slated Commolli, applauded Spearing’s pointing and made reference to Maxi Rodriguez’s song, as embedded in this response:

 

 

[JohnnyH]

2 hours ago, Kevin D said:

99% seemed too Rawkish, and I didn’t want to throw my upcoming move in the forum’s face.

Fair point. I’ve gone 30% so. 

[diamondjoe]

I think we'll beat Everton, Newcastle and Real Madrid in our next 3 games. Gonna stick some cash on it. 

I couldn't imagine him not managing us btw. It'd be fucking heart  wrenching to see him in another dug out. 

[Crazy Dave]

This is fucking long, but:

 

Of course I've got full faith in Jurgen to turn things around and I wouldn't want any other coach on the bench. However, anybody thinking there's no chance of him walking is being naive - he did break his contract with Dortmund lets not forget. If he honestly feels as though he cannot get a tune out of the players then I think he will go of his own volition. 

 

There's countless reasons why things have disintegrated like this but I think one of the main ones is what's gone on behind the scenes with recruitment. Go back 2-3 years and we had such an effective structure off the pitch under Edwards and the data analyst guys. It was incredible how well we recruited and sold (albeit with the odd exception granted). We also had a clear way of playing and recruited specifically for our needs. 

 

For me the sign that things were changing was when we signed Thiago. I love the guy and overall he's been a good player for us, but he was a break from the tried and trusted method, plus he was 29, had an injury record and coming in on high wages. At the time there was the sense that he was a signing made by Klopp and the coaches, not by Edwards, Graham and the analysts. 

 

Around the same period we refused to renew Gini's contract because he had turned 30. It's obvious that Klopp wanted to him to stay but Edwards and co didn't want players of 30+ on big contracts. But then, post-Gini, we've seen just that happen - Hendo, Fabinho, Virgil, Salah, and, now, even Bobby soon have contracts well into their 30's. I might be way off on this, but I don't think that happens under Edwards, or at least not the same length of terms. 

 

It's pretty obvious that the coaching staff have too big a say in recruitment now. The successful model has not shifted. Julian Ward and Ian Graham are fucking off because they have a diminishing role. Whether Klopp feels he should have a larger say in recruitment is irrelevant. What we do know is the team was much more successful when he could trust others at the club to perform this role.

 

Our successes were built off of young, hungry players who weren't cheap but didn't cost a fortune either. Now we only seem interested in players at the top end of the market or 16-17 year old talents. With our original model we would have recruited a Manu Kone or a Thuram-type midfielder for 30m last summer. No doubt about it. 

 

Now we see the likes of Nunez, Gakpo, even Carvalho being recruited and they seem completely at odds with how we recruited between 2015-2019, where we were hitting the target nearly every time. I do think Klopp and Lijnders are trying to evolve our style of play, but it hasn't worked - we seem like a pound shop version of Man City now and I've never seen a Liverpool team so brittle - and I've been supporting the club since 1990. 

 

We need to rediscover our original identity again, sort out the chaos behind the scenes, relieve Klopp and Lijnders to be coaches again, and be absolutely brutal with the squad this summer. 

[Jennings]

I am a believer. I have his back.